the French vs. the Franks

fabb   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:13 GMT
But people on the opposite side of the Rhine (Baden, Rhineland) are also famous in Germany for their love of food, wine etc.

Of course it is not forbiden to germanic people to appreciate good things !... fortunally for them being german doesn't mean that they should necessary drink only beer... (they seem to like it very very much also !)
But if you want to push me to say that because some regions of germany make wine means that French people are have a germanic side, i'll put things very clear. : It is the inverse !!
Southern germany (also austria) can shows some similarities with France not because we have a german influence but because south germany and austria had in their history a latin influence that northern germany didn't had (whose regions were once roman, the romans brougth grapes from mediterranean to those regions. The proximity of Lombardia to Autria and south germany also had an influence.
Your pseudo-demonstration dosen't work.
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:24 GMT
I understand you, but you miss my point! Of course the Romans brought the grapes and I cannot detect any Germanic influence in France (except the names of most of your kings!). But do you have to act like a reborn Roman and say that "those poor Germans should be damned thankful that the Romans gave them too a quick visit, although they liked us way way better!"
Why not just admit that there exists a Central Europe where some people speak French, others German and others Czech.
fabbrice   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:27 GMT
"fabuleux destin d'amélie Poulain" = the fabolous Amelie from Monmartre?
If yes, then I saw most of it, I think. Nice film, but more subtle, not with so big passions as La vita e bella.


No, it is a very french conception of latinity. Italians are more "exuberants" (I don't know how to say it in english), but it is a tipical italian characteristic that usually don't share other latins (and that don't share all italians !!)
Spanish are more "serious" and tragic, while Portugueses are very calm and nostalgic dreamers (they call it "saudade")

all of us are all of latin culture, with our own way, with our own culture. Like your way of being scandinavian and germanic should be different from the way it is for a swedish, dutch or german... depending of your history, geographical localisation ,etc...


Bon, maintenant je vais aller dormir, bonne nuit !
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:27 GMT
The landscape is the same, the architecture, the light, the looks of the people - from Bourgogne to Bohemia.
Only a turn of history made the north-south axis more important in our minds!
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:30 GMT
Frenchmen are as much related to and culturally connected to Germans as to Italians or Spanish.
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:36 GMT
"Like your way of being scandinavian and germanic should be different from the way it is for a swedish, dutch or german... depending of your history, geographical localisation ,etc... "

Most Norwegians would be horrified if you called them Germanic! No, we are NOT Germanic, we are not barbarians, we are not Nazis, we are Scandinavians, we are Nordic, we are not like the Germans etc etc.
Does this remind you of somebody?...:-)) LOL
fabb   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:42 GMT
Why not just admit that there exists a Central Europe where some people speak French, others German and others Czech.

I'm sorry but I don't feel culturally close to those people. I respect them but I'm not close to them. Central europe could just be a geographical concept (very very unprisice), but is not a cultural or human concept. when I travel in germany, people see that immidiatly that I'm not german, even if I don't speak (anayway I would be unable to express me in that language. They usually think I'm spanish.


"those poor Germans should be damned thankful that the Romans gave them too a quick visit, although they liked us way way better!"

I don't think that. I don't consider that latin culture is superior to anyone. Even if I'm not a specialist in germanic cultures I respect them and I don't think there is a shame of being germanic ! great philosophers, composers, great literrature, etc... That's not what I am that's all...
There is a lot of things in germanic cultures that we should look at and imitate.
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:49 GMT
Might be different if you were from Eastern Bourgogne or Alsace.
fabb   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:54 GMT
Frenchmen are as much related to and culturally connected to Germans as to Italians or Spanish.

I'm sorry but you should stop speaking about things you don't know.
we have economic link with germans, they are our neighbours. we share the european continent , the european union, but culturally germans are as foreign for us than russians (they also make wine inear black sea ! hehehe)


"Most Norwegians would be horrified if you called them Germanic! No, we are NOT Germanic, we are not barbarians, we are not Nazis, we are Scandinavians, we are Nordic, we are not like the Germans etc etc.
Does this remind you of somebody?...:-)) LOL"

No I don't see who is it should remind me ?
In my mouth "germanic" doesn't mean "german". but all germanic-languages speaking peoples. I don't see why I should exclude anyone. Germans are not the sunique stereotype of what a germanic is.
There no reason to exclude scandinavians from the germanic group, there is no reason to exclude either dutch or english people. Along with their similiarities and depites their differences they still germanic people.
fabb   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:57 GMT
"Might be different if you were from Eastern Bourgogne or Alsace."

you"re confunding cultural similarities (what I am talking about) and the similarities due to geographical similarity.
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 02:59 GMT
I am just trying to point out that these concepts are very unclear and differently defined by each of us.
The British would also mind being called Germanic. They would say they were a mix of Germanic people and Celtic peoplea and speaking a mix of Saxon and French!
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 03:02 GMT
In my opinion geographical closeness (proximity) IS often cultural similarity!
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 03:04 GMT
Normandy looks like Southern England and people behave a bit like English people. Scotland looks like Norway and people behave a bit like Norwegians.
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 03:07 GMT
Languages / dialects work just similar
People in Provence better understand Italians than Normands understand Italians, just like Eastern Norwegians understand Swedes better than Western Norwegians do!
Fredrik from Norway   Saturday, March 05, 2005, 03:09 GMT
All regions are some percent of their neighbour regions, when it comes to culture, language, history, mentality etc.