Accent evolution in English

andre in usa   Saturday, April 30, 2005, 05:51 GMT
I was thinking I might be corrected for typing "Worcesterian." Heh heh. I did know the correct pronunciation of the city name, however. :)
Damian   Saturday, April 30, 2005, 07:25 GMT
Worcester is also a city in England, the county town of Worcestershire. It's pronounced "Wooster". Up here we roll the R at the end. In England they don't..in fact many of them seem to say "Woostah".

The same applies to places like Gloucester (Gloucestershire) and Leicester (Leicestershire) and non county town places like Bicester and Frocester. [Gloster, Lester, Bister].

Actually there is a town in Gloucestershire called Cirencester, originally the site of a Roman fortress called Corinium around which the town eventually developed. That name seems to go against the trend as it's pronounced "'SIREN-sester", with emphasis on first syllable. However, it used to be pronounced "SIS-is-ter" apparently. That is weird.

No wonder foreigners (or non locals) in England get confused.
greg   Saturday, April 30, 2005, 07:31 GMT
Travis : "Den stad Boston muut een dialekt med rootskisme nok dan hevven, ik wurt sien".

Could you translate please ?

Why not IG <Boston Sted> for <den stad Boston> ?
Damian   Saturday, April 30, 2005, 07:40 GMT
I can't really understand why anybody would deliberately choose to change his/her accent when speaking English. Maybe I'm wrong but to me it seems a wee bit "strange and unnatural". I enjoy listening to the various accents of people when they speak my native Language English.....even if they come from England! :-) Hee hee.....just a dig at poor ADAM...couldnae resist it.

I think there's a difference when you go and live in another English speaking country though. Aftr a while you are bound to adopt certain elements of the local accent to a certain degree without any conscious desire to change completely. That's unless you are determined to totally hang onto your "native" accent at all costs, as Brits have done in America, and Americans over here, of course. I would think it's easy to (involuntarily) adopt local speech patterns after some time living among people who all generally speak the same way.
andre in usa   Monday, May 02, 2005, 06:41 GMT
"I would think it's easy to (involuntarily) adopt local speech patterns after some time living among people who all generally speak the same way."

Yes, Damian, it is pretty easy. My mother, who is a native AmE speaker, lived in Scotland for 5 months of her life, and she said that even within the span of 5 months she adopted a bit of a Scottish accent. It quickly went away once she came back here.
Lazar   Monday, May 02, 2005, 06:53 GMT
<<My mother, who is a native AmE speaker, lived in Scotland for 5 months of her life, and she said that even within the span of 5 months she adopted a bit of a Scottish accent. It quickly went away once she came back here.>>

That's interesting! As a child, my mother lived with her family in Lancashire for several months and adopted the distinctive local accent, although she soon lost it upon returning to Massachusetts.
Inigo   Monday, May 02, 2005, 07:53 GMT
"That's unless you are determined to totally hang onto your "native" accent at all costs, as Brits have done in America, and Americans over here,"

Interesting that you should mention only Americans "over here", Damian.

Is that an indication that Americans are living "over there" in greater numbers than are native-English speakers from Commonwealth countries?

How do they manage to get residency?
Jordi   Monday, May 02, 2005, 08:10 GMT
Damian,

If you were to live in southern England for a few years do you think you'd lose your Scottish accent and sound like a Sassenach? ;-)

I feel the further away the varieties are the more difficult it is to lose your original accent. I've known Australians who've been living in London for a few years and who sound like Londoners. There might be an occasional Aussie thing here and there but they would easily be taken for Londoners. They tend to get a bit more Aussie again when speaking to another Aussie.

I've known Scots who've lived in London for years and they still sound Scot. They will, of course, have some London influence in their speech but that never tricks anybody. Very much the same happens with Americans.

On the other hand, children do adapt to a new accent very quickly (the same way they learn a new language very quickly.) It's a different story when you're an adult.

The last time I was London I went clubbing with a Scottish friend. I will only have a couple of glasses or three (at my utmost) but my Scottish friend had a bottle or so. All I know is that I could perfectly understand him during dinner (he did have a heavy Scottish accent, but quite clear). I couldn't understand him at all at 3 a.m. although he did speak quite a lot. I still understood the other English guy although he probably drank even more.
Adam   Monday, May 02, 2005, 08:15 GMT
".....even if they come from England! :-) Hee hee"

It's true when they say Scots have an inferiority complex towards the English, just like the French have an inferiority complex towards all of Britain.
Kenneth   Monday, May 02, 2005, 08:33 GMT
Keeping or losing your accent in a different environment depends entirely on how susceptible you are, how much it means to you to retain your persona and very much on your level of maturity.

Jordi mentioned some Australians who have lived in London for a few years and sound like Londoners. There are also many examples of young people who have gone to the US and adopted the speech patterns used there.

However most people who live overseas for years make a conscious decision to resist the insidious influence of their surroundings, as they are well aware of how such changes are viewed by family and friends.
Damian   Tuesday, May 03, 2005, 11:26 GMT
**How do they manage to get residency?**

I really don't know the ins and outs of obtaining UK residency INIGO, but there are a great many Americans living in the UK. If interested further, you can check into this site:

http://www.americanexpats.co.uk/forum

You will get some idea of the experiences and viewpoints of Americans living here among us Brits. It's cool to see that American impressions of living in Scotland rate pretty high. Maybe it's the Scotch they like...it can't be the rain! But hey.. believe it or not some of them like that as well, especially if they come from Arzona! :-)
Damian   Tuesday, May 03, 2005, 11:30 GMT
**If you were to live in southern England for a few years do you think you'd lose your Scottish accent and sound like a Sassenach? ;-) **

JORDI: Hell would freeze over first! :-)

Sorry not to reply to these posts before now.....sort of missed the thread.
Damian   Tuesday, May 03, 2005, 11:33 GMT
Big apology..sawwyyyy!

This is the correct link for American expats in UK. Notice the link to explain British terms used in the UK which otherwise baffle our American cousins.

Anyway, here you go:

http://www.americanexpats.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=General
Damian   Tuesday, May 03, 2005, 11:42 GMT
I'm going loopy today..blame all the pressure...anyway this is the link that will take you directly to the Britspeak listing (American style). It's hilarious really how the common language divide thing causes misunderstandings.

http://www.americanexpats.co.uk/britspeak.htm
greg   Tuesday, May 03, 2005, 11:45 GMT
Adam : "The French have an inferiority complex towards all of Britain".

Such as ?