Article on Foreign Talents: http://www.pliink.com/mt/marxy/archives/000665.html
I don't know anything about this site. I'm just sharing the article.
I don't know anything about this site. I'm just sharing the article.
Models for Multilinguals
"Your target accent should, imo, somehow match you as a person. I don't want to end up like Eliza - speaking a prestigious accent without matching social status and knowledge for surviving with the unmatching status."
Xie- Thanks for the proverb. I'll try to put it in practice!! :)
I agree with your affirmation and usually choose accents which fit my "carioca attitude". In the US I Like the Californian accent, in Germany I like the Bayern southern attitude and in Japan Osaka is the best accent (Osaka people call themselves the "Latin Japanese").
I didn't understand what you meant with "Eliza"...
"Brazilian Accents:
I've mostly been around people from SP. I listen to recordings, though. "
K.T. -Well, even though I was born in Sao Paulo I don't like this accent very much and I think most people in Brazil don't like it, even people from southern Brazil...I guess Carioca accent is the mostly widespread in Brazil and has its influence in the media to the point of people from northern Brazil imitating the carioca accent (There even actors who try to do the accent to have more popularity).On the other hand, when people from Rio go to other states they NEVER change their accent. It's like people from Osaka in Japan!!! Well, if you don't wanna look like a carioca and be teases by the "paulistas", "Brasília" or "Minas Gerais" accent would be nice because both have characteristics of the Rio and São Paulo accents (The "s" is like São Paulo and "r" is like Rio). Many people think I'm "candango"(Native of Brasília) or "mineiro" (Native from Minas Gerais) because my final "s" isn't always like the [sh].
"Foreign Japanese Pets: I know what you mean. Dave Spector has been making the rounds on Japanese TV for a long time. I like it when they have another talent instead of just being able to speak Japanese."
K.T.-To be honest I don't like him very much because his Japanese might be excellent but he isn't one of the kindest people I've seen. But I guess he'll keep on appearing because the Japanese LOVE to see a foreigner speaking in their "difficult language"...
"Oh, I didn't know of any foreign succeeding in Japanese TV!
Can you tell me that guy's name?
What does he usually talk about? "
@zatsu-san- The guy's name is JEFF and he has an English school in Kyoto and started teaching at a university I used to give lessons in Kyoto. He always appears on a program that interviews handicapped people on channel 12 (NHK educational channel). His Japanese is AWESOME!!He also appears on Kyoto television a lot.
"Actually I'm trying to improve my Japanese and think I'll move to Japan soon enough."
Zatsu-san- Let me know when you're coming!! If you come to the Kansai region maybe I can help you talk like a native. :)
"You have a really interesting background, already speaking a few Japanese dialects, Chinese and even learning other languages... wow, well done!"
Well, I'm just trying to improve my Chinese, which is enough for traveling (Had no problem in Taiwan or China) and started learning Russian again because there's a guy from Estonia who works with me and I might be able to use what I've learned. I also hope to be able to speak/write French and Spanish in order to pass the DELE and DELF certificates. If I can learn these languages well I'll keep on learning languages just to have an idea on how they work and sound like...
Cheers!!
Xie- Thanks for the proverb. I'll try to put it in practice!! :)
I agree with your affirmation and usually choose accents which fit my "carioca attitude". In the US I Like the Californian accent, in Germany I like the Bayern southern attitude and in Japan Osaka is the best accent (Osaka people call themselves the "Latin Japanese").
I didn't understand what you meant with "Eliza"...
"Brazilian Accents:
I've mostly been around people from SP. I listen to recordings, though. "
K.T. -Well, even though I was born in Sao Paulo I don't like this accent very much and I think most people in Brazil don't like it, even people from southern Brazil...I guess Carioca accent is the mostly widespread in Brazil and has its influence in the media to the point of people from northern Brazil imitating the carioca accent (There even actors who try to do the accent to have more popularity).On the other hand, when people from Rio go to other states they NEVER change their accent. It's like people from Osaka in Japan!!! Well, if you don't wanna look like a carioca and be teases by the "paulistas", "Brasília" or "Minas Gerais" accent would be nice because both have characteristics of the Rio and São Paulo accents (The "s" is like São Paulo and "r" is like Rio). Many people think I'm "candango"(Native of Brasília) or "mineiro" (Native from Minas Gerais) because my final "s" isn't always like the [sh].
"Foreign Japanese Pets: I know what you mean. Dave Spector has been making the rounds on Japanese TV for a long time. I like it when they have another talent instead of just being able to speak Japanese."
K.T.-To be honest I don't like him very much because his Japanese might be excellent but he isn't one of the kindest people I've seen. But I guess he'll keep on appearing because the Japanese LOVE to see a foreigner speaking in their "difficult language"...
"Oh, I didn't know of any foreign succeeding in Japanese TV!
Can you tell me that guy's name?
What does he usually talk about? "
@zatsu-san- The guy's name is JEFF and he has an English school in Kyoto and started teaching at a university I used to give lessons in Kyoto. He always appears on a program that interviews handicapped people on channel 12 (NHK educational channel). His Japanese is AWESOME!!He also appears on Kyoto television a lot.
"Actually I'm trying to improve my Japanese and think I'll move to Japan soon enough."
Zatsu-san- Let me know when you're coming!! If you come to the Kansai region maybe I can help you talk like a native. :)
"You have a really interesting background, already speaking a few Japanese dialects, Chinese and even learning other languages... wow, well done!"
Well, I'm just trying to improve my Chinese, which is enough for traveling (Had no problem in Taiwan or China) and started learning Russian again because there's a guy from Estonia who works with me and I might be able to use what I've learned. I also hope to be able to speak/write French and Spanish in order to pass the DELE and DELF certificates. If I can learn these languages well I'll keep on learning languages just to have an idea on how they work and sound like...
Cheers!!
"Article on Foreign Talents: http://www.pliink.com/mt/marxy/archives/000665.html
I don't know anything about this site. I'm just sharing the article."
K.T.-san:Thanks for the list.From all of these guys I feel pity for "bobby" because he talks just like "Crayon Shinchan" even though I believe he knows much more Japanese. Before there was another African guy from Benin who was very famous and smart called "Zomahon" (Not sure about the spelling)but he started appearing because he's TOO SMART and said pretty much what he thought about Japan. I believe he came to Japan for studying.
On the list there are also some Koreans but that isn't considered very by the Japanese because they somehow feel that asians SHOULD speak Japanese well whereas westerners should speak a SLOPPY Japanese.
On the list there's also the PAKKUN dude, who only appears mostly on the "eigo the Shabera Night" program and tries to entertain the Japanese...
From all the guys I've seen on TV Daniel-san impresses me with his PERFECT yamagata dialect（山形弁) and even his gestures and facial expressions became Japanese. He's the man!!! But still, he appears only on programs about traveling and stuff that might please the Japanese...
I guess there'll never be a foreigner announcer in Japan...
Maybe we should appear on TV and say what we think about the "gaijin" (Please don't use this derogatory word!!!) "tarentos", who just need to speak Japanese (The worse the better for the Japanese).
Cheers!!
I don't know anything about this site. I'm just sharing the article."
K.T.-san:Thanks for the list.From all of these guys I feel pity for "bobby" because he talks just like "Crayon Shinchan" even though I believe he knows much more Japanese. Before there was another African guy from Benin who was very famous and smart called "Zomahon" (Not sure about the spelling)but he started appearing because he's TOO SMART and said pretty much what he thought about Japan. I believe he came to Japan for studying.
On the list there are also some Koreans but that isn't considered very by the Japanese because they somehow feel that asians SHOULD speak Japanese well whereas westerners should speak a SLOPPY Japanese.
On the list there's also the PAKKUN dude, who only appears mostly on the "eigo the Shabera Night" program and tries to entertain the Japanese...
From all the guys I've seen on TV Daniel-san impresses me with his PERFECT yamagata dialect（山形弁) and even his gestures and facial expressions became Japanese. He's the man!!! But still, he appears only on programs about traveling and stuff that might please the Japanese...
I guess there'll never be a foreigner announcer in Japan...
Maybe we should appear on TV and say what we think about the "gaijin" (Please don't use this derogatory word!!!) "tarentos", who just need to speak Japanese (The worse the better for the Japanese).
Cheers!!
J. C.,
Interesting post. Osaka ben is a good accent for men. I'm not really a Dave Spector fan. I heard him imitating a Texan accent or a Southern accent. I don't think he nailed the accent at all; it was mocking, but the guy has to make a living. He started learning Japanese as a child from a Japanese classmate in the US.
Xie, will tell you, but I think he means "Eliza" from "My Fair Lady".
Thank-you for the good insights on accents in Brazil. I enjoy Portuguese, but I'll probably have to settle for the accents I hear around me. I'd like to go to Rio, but I wouldn't be surprised if I ended up visiting SP.
Interesting post. Osaka ben is a good accent for men. I'm not really a Dave Spector fan. I heard him imitating a Texan accent or a Southern accent. I don't think he nailed the accent at all; it was mocking, but the guy has to make a living. He started learning Japanese as a child from a Japanese classmate in the US.
Xie, will tell you, but I think he means "Eliza" from "My Fair Lady".
Thank-you for the good insights on accents in Brazil. I enjoy Portuguese, but I'll probably have to settle for the accents I hear around me. I'd like to go to Rio, but I wouldn't be surprised if I ended up visiting SP.
J. C.,
I suppose I could use "gaikokujin". I've heard this word even from the kindest people I know in Japan. Of course, in the country kids would yell this at me. Par for the course.
I suppose I could use "gaikokujin". I've heard this word even from the kindest people I know in Japan. Of course, in the country kids would yell this at me. Par for the course.
Good clip! Thank-you. They subtitled the students too. They often do this in Japan. It's actually very helpful for learners.
"Is his Japanese so bad they need to subtitle him?"
Guest:That's not the guy I referred to. His name is Daniel Kahl and he speaks PERFECT yamagata-ben. Well, if someone from southern or northeast (specially) Japan speaks it is necessary to have subtitles because it's TOTALLY different from Standard Japanese.
Only Osaka dialect doesn't require subtitles because most comedians are from Osaka and the dialect is pretty much widespread.
Cheers!!
p.s I found some links with Daniel-san but not with him speaking.
http://www.domos.jp/
http://br.youtube.com/watch?v=t6ODpy4VKSM
Guest:That's not the guy I referred to. His name is Daniel Kahl and he speaks PERFECT yamagata-ben. Well, if someone from southern or northeast (specially) Japan speaks it is necessary to have subtitles because it's TOTALLY different from Standard Japanese.
Only Osaka dialect doesn't require subtitles because most comedians are from Osaka and the dialect is pretty much widespread.
Cheers!!
p.s I found some links with Daniel-san but not with him speaking.
http://www.domos.jp/
http://br.youtube.com/watch?v=t6ODpy4VKSM
Yes, I think that's correct. Someone told me that anything there is a chance the person won't be understood, there will be subtitles.
I saw his profile and his languages are...English, German and Yamagata ben. That's a first for me, lol.
I saw his profile and his languages are...English, German and Yamagata ben. That's a first for me, lol.
Sorry-anytime there is a chance...Maybe we need a thread for Japanese
dialects. Not now, though.
dialects. Not now, though.
What's that all about? Are you following me from that other thread?
Do you want to discuss Japanese dialects? Very well, go ahead and start a thread or not. I simply meant that I might not be up to a big discussion right now. I enjoy it very much when we actually have language-related threads instead of guessing games about who is gay, etc.
Do you want to discuss Japanese dialects? Very well, go ahead and start a thread or not. I simply meant that I might not be up to a big discussion right now. I enjoy it very much when we actually have language-related threads instead of guessing games about who is gay, etc.
Off the top of my head, this is my impression of Japanese dialects.
Tokyo-standard.
Osaka-used by comedians, good for men-The Manly Accent.
Kyoto-refined, good for women. Words differ from Tokyo ben for many common words.
Hokkaido-I've heard it's standard. I almost never have trouble understanding people from this island.
Okinawa-it's different, but I don't know much about it. They used to have another language, but I don't know how this has or if it has influenced the language.
Kobe: It seems the stress is reversed at times to Tokyo.
Tokyo-standard.
Osaka-used by comedians, good for men-The Manly Accent.
Kyoto-refined, good for women. Words differ from Tokyo ben for many common words.
Hokkaido-I've heard it's standard. I almost never have trouble understanding people from this island.
Okinawa-it's different, but I don't know much about it. They used to have another language, but I don't know how this has or if it has influenced the language.
Kobe: It seems the stress is reversed at times to Tokyo.
" Osaka ben is a good accent for men. "
K.T.san-Oh yeah. The good thing about Osaka-ben is that people will probably will laugh with you and not at you!! :)
After 3 years living in northern Osaka(Lived 6 years close to Osaka city) people stopped laughing at me, though. But I gotta be careful not to sound like a yakuza dude!! :)
"I suppose I could use "gaikokujin"."
K.T- Right again!! That's the PC word I wish all Japanese used. Gaijin sounds like saying "Jap" to a Japanese person, which I would NEVER use.
"I enjoy Portuguese, but I'll probably have to settle for the accents I hear around me. I'd like to go to Rio, but I wouldn't be surprised if I ended up visiting SP."
K.T.- As long as you don't talk like someone from "Bahia" or another northern accent you'll be fine. Personally my mom's family is from Paraíba and I've heard a lot of racist comments and just ask: What's the problem with the northern accents? But if you wanna work as in a Brazilian company, northern accent doesn't work (I heard of cases of people who were turned down at EMBRATEL because of their northern accents...)
"I saw his profile and his languages are...English, German and Yamagata ben. That's a first for me, lol."
He's INDEED the man!! Never heard his German but if he speaks as good as he speaks Japanese he's my master!!! :)
In my opinion he's a TRUE bilingual!!!(When it comes to Japanese and English)
K.T.san-Oh yeah. The good thing about Osaka-ben is that people will probably will laugh with you and not at you!! :)
After 3 years living in northern Osaka(Lived 6 years close to Osaka city) people stopped laughing at me, though. But I gotta be careful not to sound like a yakuza dude!! :)
"I suppose I could use "gaikokujin"."
K.T- Right again!! That's the PC word I wish all Japanese used. Gaijin sounds like saying "Jap" to a Japanese person, which I would NEVER use.
"I enjoy Portuguese, but I'll probably have to settle for the accents I hear around me. I'd like to go to Rio, but I wouldn't be surprised if I ended up visiting SP."
K.T.- As long as you don't talk like someone from "Bahia" or another northern accent you'll be fine. Personally my mom's family is from Paraíba and I've heard a lot of racist comments and just ask: What's the problem with the northern accents? But if you wanna work as in a Brazilian company, northern accent doesn't work (I heard of cases of people who were turned down at EMBRATEL because of their northern accents...)
"I saw his profile and his languages are...English, German and Yamagata ben. That's a first for me, lol."
He's INDEED the man!! Never heard his German but if he speaks as good as he speaks Japanese he's my master!!! :)
In my opinion he's a TRUE bilingual!!!(When it comes to Japanese and English)