"Half ten" - nine-thirty or ten-thirty?

Uriel   Mon Dec 05, 2005 8:39 am GMT
What are you doing up, Lazar? It's like 3:30 am for you!
(or should I say, half-three...)
Lazar   Mon Dec 05, 2005 8:47 am GMT
<<I know what fortnight means, I could hazard a guess at what half-ten might mean, but gormless -- WTF?>>

I was actually surprised when I found out that most of my compatriots didn't know what "gormless" meant - it had always been used in my household as a result of my (English-influenced) mother. My mother was born in the US, but her mother was a British war bride who took her to live in England for several months as a child. My mother picked up a subtle perception that "home" was really back in England, and she's always had a little more of a UK-influenced view of things. Linguistically she's an interesting case, because although she spent most of her childhood with a Worcester accent, she spent other parts with a Lancashire accent. ;-)
Lazar   Mon Dec 05, 2005 8:48 am GMT
<<What are you doing up, Lazar? It's like 3:30 am for you!>>

I'm a night owl. I knew that someday someone was going to notice the ridiculous hours that I post. ;-)
Candy   Mon Dec 05, 2005 8:54 am GMT
<<Or how about, "you daft git!" ;-) >>

Aahh, the sound of home! :-)
Uriel   Mon Dec 05, 2005 9:04 am GMT
We can start calling you that, if you like -- wouldn't want you to get TOO homesick! ;)
Candy   Mon Dec 05, 2005 9:20 am GMT
<<We can start calling you that, if you like -- wouldn't want you to get TOO homesick! ;) >>

LOL! I wouldn't mind at all, actually. ;) It sounds affectionate, rather than insulting! I'm off home for Xmas fairly soon, so no doubt I'll be hearing it a lot then!
Uriel   Mon Dec 05, 2005 9:22 am GMT
Aren't moms great? ;)
Candy   Mon Dec 05, 2005 9:25 am GMT
Oh yeah - my mum knows how to make me feel good about myself, alright! :)
Damian in Edinburgh   Mon Dec 05, 2005 11:44 am GMT
It is now eleven forty here and I've just had a coffee break. I use eleven forty because it takes less time and effort than twenty to twelve. In five minutes it will be eleven forty five....better than a quarter to twelve. In my job we have to use the 24 hour clock because it is more functional and avoids confusion between AM and PM times. I hope to get home by eighteen hundred this evening and out again later by twenty one hours.

Of course, with mates we do lapse into the "nine pm" or "nine o clock" or "nine thirty" or "half nine" whatever.
Damian   Mon Dec 05, 2005 11:47 am GMT
Candy: Home is where the heart is......it could be a lovely Lakeland fell....
Bardioc   Mon Dec 05, 2005 5:29 pm GMT
JGC Sun Dec 04, 2005 7:50 am GMT

I am an ex-pat and while arranging a future meeting with a departing ex-London guest last night she used the expression "half-ten". This led to a discussion on the meaning of the expression. I remember that, as a child, I used the expression to mean "half before ten" as in the German construction "halb vor zehn". I then began to wonder if there are regional differences in the UK in the meaning of this construction, or, as in many other things, has the meaning flipped over the decades from one meaning to another?

In German, we only use ''halb zehn'', not the construction you mentioned. But you can of course say ''viertel vor zehn'' or even ''viertel nach zehn''.
Bill the Yank   Tue Dec 06, 2005 11:40 am GMT
About Noon, and AM, and PM

12 PM is NOT noon, it's midnight. Noon is neither AM nor PM, because noon is NOON. No, I'm not being cute.

The "M" in AM, and PM stands for Meridian. That's when the sun is directly overhead, at its highest point, mid-day. Noon.

The "A" stands for Ante, which means "before," or in this case, "in the fore noon." 1 AM is the first hour of the fore noon, or morning. Nobody says "fore noon" anymore, I'm just trying to stay close to the Latin, "Ante Meridian," AM. You could also think of it as "After Midnight" if you like, but you must remember that there is no such time as 12 AM. No. That would be "the 12th hour of the fore noon" which cannot exist, since noon cannot be before itself. Noon is just noon. All time is relative to it. So, 86 12 AM.

The "P" stands for Post, which means "after." 12 PM is the 12th hour after the Meridian (noon), or midnight. 00:01 AM is one minute after midnight.

Unfortunately, you will find timetables, and schedules here in the US where 12 PM, or 12 AM clearly are intended to mean noon. It's as if people think that all times MUST be followed by either an AM or a PM. And, indeed, all must, EXCEPT noon.

So, do Britons use the expression "to 86" something meaning to get rid of it? I think it comes from the days of morse code on short wave radio.
Meh   Tue Dec 06, 2005 12:14 pm GMT
Meh... this AM, PM, midnight, noon stuff is a storm in a tea cup.

As mjd says, "12 PM" to represent noon is just fine, considering 1200 hours plus a fraction of a second is PM. The same goes for "12 AM" in representing midnight. This convention is clear to everyone who reads a timetable as to what time is being communicated. We're not going to bicker over a fraction of a second to satisfy some technicality which might render time keeping ambiguous or impractical.
mary anne   Tue Dec 06, 2005 12:20 pm GMT
why dont u just use the numerical terms instead!!!!!!!!!
Bill the Yank   Tue Dec 06, 2005 12:26 pm GMT
I see, then 11 PM is followed an hour later by......noon?

Sorry.

You said:

As mjd says, "12 PM" to represent noon is just fine, considering 1200 hours plus a fraction of a second is PM. The same goes for "12 AM" in representing midnight.
-------------

You've got it exactly reversed while calling me ambiguous. We're not talking about seconds, but 12 hours of difference.

11 PM cannot logically be followed by midnight called 12 AM which is then followed by 1 AM. The 12th hour of the morning cannot logically be followed by the FIRST hour of the morning.

I am sorry, but midnight, one hour after 11 PM, is, not surprisingly, followed by 12 PM.

Please think about this.