Is Occitan still alive or can be considered a dead language?

Leona   Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:19 pm GMT
Occitan was prestigous during the Middle Ages. It was the language of trovadours. Now it has almost vanished. How did this happen?
greg   Sat Apr 25, 2009 9:20 am GMT
Au commencement, au sein des élites, par substitution progressive au profit de langue de l'État royal, le français. Processus identique, mais plus tardif et plus long, au sein des masses populaires, avec accélération à partir de la révolution industrielle, accélération encore accrue dans la second moitié du XIXe siècle. Cette évolution a concerné toutes les langues d'Oc et d'Oïl.

Mais il serait faux de considérer que les langues gasconne, provençale, languedocienne, limousine etc ont disparu : elles sont toujours bien vivantes même si leur visibilité n'est plus celle qui était la leur au XVIIe siècle. Avec l'arrivée d'internet et la continuation des migrations infrahexagonales, il y a fort à parier que les langues d'Oc seront renforcées, paradoxalement. Qualitativement, leur base locutive (active & passive) va se disséminer partout où une connexion internet est possible, c'est-à-dire en dehors de leurs bastions géographiques traditionnels, précisément. La recherche sur la littérature et la linguistique d'Oc (moderne & ancien) est vigoureuse, continue, et préfigure probablement une forte diffusion ultérieure à un niveau moins spécialisé.

http://www.revistadoc.org/file/Linguistica%20occitana%206%20CLO.pdf

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7156/clo-sintesi.pdf
PARISIEN   Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:01 pm GMT
<< Now it has almost vanished. How did this happen? >>

-- Because its speakers didn't want it to survive.
Just like Scottish or Bavarian, Occitan dialects have been replaced by a heavy accent which suffices for local identity purposes.

As soon as printing presses were invented, all books in Southern France were written in French. This evolution was further accelerated by Protestant churches (some regions in the South of France are still Calvinist strongholds): from the 16th century on they circulated bibles and psalmbooks printed in French, imported from Geneva.

The French state never encouraged people to abandon Occitan in favour of French, it was actually rather the opposite. When, in the late 17th, there were heavy persecutions against Huguenots, Southerners who spoke French instead of Occitan dialects were under suspicion of beings 'heretics'.

French was so widely accepted as the written norm for Occitan dialects that the phenomenon permeated over the political boundaries. On the Italian side of the Alps, in Piedmont, everybody spoke only a sort of Provençal until Italian linguistic terrorism started in the late 19th century. Up to that point, the only written language taughts in village schools was French, though the area never had been under French authority (except for the years 1794-1814), and even though the local language was arguably more akin to Italian or Piedmontese than to French.
Guest   Sat Apr 25, 2009 2:42 pm GMT
some regions in the South of France are still Calvinist strongholds

Are there Protestants in France? I thought they are were killed.
CommonAswhole   Sat Apr 25, 2009 4:08 pm GMT
Many people from Huguenot descent life outside France. I know for one that one of the last Huguenot emigrations were to the Republic of the Seven Provinces (the Netherlands). Many people in the university town of Leiden have a French surname to this day. Most of these people cannot even pronounce their own name right, too lazy to learn the language of their ancestors.
rep   Sun Apr 26, 2009 9:06 pm GMT
Maybe it is result of linguistic assimilation policy in France.
Guest   Sun Apr 26, 2009 9:24 pm GMT
The French state never encouraged people to abandon Occitan in favour of French, it was actually rather the opposite. When, in the late 17th, there were heavy persecutions against Huguenots, Southerners who spoke French instead of Occitan dialects were under suspicion of beings 'heretics'.


But that happened when France was a Monarchy. After the French Revolution the Huguenots were tolerated again and the new heresy under Republican France was to not speak French .
blanc-niege   Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:00 am GMT
<< Occitan was prestigious during the Middle Ages. It was the language of troubadours. Now it has almost vanished. How did this happen? >>

http://www.orbilat.com/Languages/Occitan/Occitan.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_policy_in_France
guest   Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:22 am GMT
" Are there Protestants in France? I thought they are were killed. "


Yes, between 1 and 2% of the french are protestants. Mainly in Alsace, Cevennes. A part of protestants are also are black evengelists in the suburbs
beneficii   Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:06 am GMT
The correct wording of the thread title is:

Is Occitan still alive or can IT be considered a dead language?
joan-miquèu   Fri May 01, 2009 11:12 pm GMT
l'occitan es pas una lenga mòrta, es encara vivanta, e parlada per mai d'un milion de personas.