Euro state names etymology

Baldewin   Thu Feb 25, 2010 5:45 pm GMT
Celts in Spain ??? Are you joking !!!
Franco   Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:16 pm GMT
In fact in the Iberian peninsula there was the only tribe that was called themselves "Celtici".
Franco   Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:21 pm GMT
The Celtici were a Celtic tribe of the Iberian peninsula, akin either to the Lusitanians and Gallaecians or the Celtiberians, living in what today are the provinces of Alentejo and the Algarve in Portugal, though some migrated north alongside the Turduli. Their presence was the result of a third or even fourth wave of migrations of Celts (or other speakers of Indo-European languages) into Iberia. Their migration most likely occurred in the 4th century BC.

Strabo (3, 1, 6) echoed Poseidonius when he mentioned the Keltikoi as the main inhabitants of the region located between the rivers Tagus and Guadiana, approximately where the Alentejo (Portugal) stands today.

The celtici were not considered a barbarian people, on the contrary they were what the greeks considered a civilized people almost in the same degree as the Turdetani.

They shared the same "gentle and civilized" character of the Turdetani. Strabo put this down to the fact that they
were neighbouring populations, and Polybius proposed that they were related, "although the Celtici are less [civilized] because they generally live in hamlets (Str., 3, 2, 15)." [2]

The origin of the Baeturian Celts was, according to Pliny, from the Celtici of Lusitania and were also kin to the gallaeci:

Celticos a Celtiberis ex Lusitania advenisse manifestum est sacris, lingua, oppidorum vocabulis, quae cognominibus in Baetica distinguntur.[4]

The Celtici from Guadiana had blood links with the Galician Celts, since there had been large-scale migration to the northwest of these Celts along with the Turduli (Str., 3, 3, 5).[5]


...[Pliny] appears to regard [Celtici´s Lusitania] the original seat of the whole celtic population of the Iberian peninsula including the celtiberians, on the ground of an identity of sacred rites, language, and names of cities.[6]
SwarthyFranquito   Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:25 pm GMT
Franco i love spaniards.
Mujeres calientes,tango.Hmmm.I love chocolate.
Franco   Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:29 pm GMT
In fact in the Iberian peninsula there was the only tribe that was called by* themselves "Celtici".
PARISIEN   Thu Feb 25, 2010 9:42 pm GMT
Nos peuples d'Europe (Espagnols, Italiens, Français, Anglais, Allemands, Russes etc.) sont tous des synthèses spécifiques qui ont cristallisé il y a entre 12 et 15 siècles.

Dans ces conditions, je ne comprends pas pourquoi certains veulent absolument se rattacher à des ascendances à demi imaginaires avec d'antiques peuplades (Celtes, Germains, Romains etc.) qui ont duré bien moins longtemps.

C'est risible.
man   Thu Feb 25, 2010 10:43 pm GMT
'tis indeed laughable.
Foxcity   Fri Feb 26, 2010 6:06 pm GMT
"In fact in the Iberian peninsula there was the only tribe that was called themselves "Celtici". "

We are celtic...Blah blah blah...We are nordic...Blah blah blah...We are european...Blah blah blah...

Franco in wonderland.
Franco   Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:29 pm GMT
Spain is the homeland of the Celts. From here they spread to the rest of Europe.
cacenmewnbysgoch   Mon Mar 01, 2010 10:38 am GMT
gaul - "The name 'WALES' was gotten from the English word for foreigner."
Welsh means foreign in the same way as French means foreign. It means foreign people who come from France.
The works in Old English must contain well over 100,000 words and if the AngloSaxons needed to use the adjective "foreign" they would not use "Welsh", they would use their *real* word for foreign.
However modern dictionaries say Welsh means foreign.
Quite disheartening.
rep   Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:13 am GMT
<<Welsh means foreign in the same way as French means foreign. It means foreign people who come from France.
The works in Old English must contain well over 100,000 words and if the AngloSaxons needed to use the adjective "foreign" they would not use "Welsh", they would use their *real* word for foreign.
However modern dictionaries say Welsh means foreign.
Quite disheartening. >>

"Walha
Walh (singular) or Walha (plural) (ᚹᚨᛚᚺᚨ) is an ancient Germanic word, meaning "foreigner", "stranger" or "roman", German: welsch. The word can be found in Old High German walhisk, meaning "Roman, in Old English wilisc, meaning "foreign, non-Anglo-Saxon, Cymric", and in Old Norse as valskr, meaning "French". Thus it will be derived from an Proto-Germanic form such as *walhiska-. [1]

It is attested in the Roman Iron Age Tjurkö Bracteate inscription as walhakurne "Roman/Gallic grain", apparently a kenning for "gold" (referring to the "bracteate" itself). The term was used by the ancient Germanic peoples to describe inhabitants of the former Roman Empire, who were largely romanised and spoke Latin or Celtic languages. Today, in German Welsche refers to Latin (or Romanic) peoples: the Italians in particular, but also the French, and thus the Romanic neighbours of the German speakers in general.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walha"

Contents [hide]
1 From *Walhaz to welsch
2 Toponyms and exonyms
2.1 Pennsylvania Dutch
2.2 Yiddish
3 Welsch/Walsch in family names
4 References
5 See also

[edit] From *Walhaz to welsch
Walh is probably derived from the name of the tribe which was known to the Romans as Volcae (in the writings of Julius Caesar) and to the Greeks as Ouólkai (Strabo and Ptolemy).[2] With the Old Germanic name *Walhaz, plural *Walhôz, adjectival form *walhiska-, this neighbouring people of the Germanics were meant some centuries before Christ. It is assumed that this term specifically referred to the Celtic Volcae, because by a precise application of the first Germanic sound change the exact Germanic equivalent *Walh- would have come out. Subsequently, this term Walhôz has rather indiscriminately been applied to the southern neighbours of the Germanics, which is shown in geographic names such as Walchgau and Walchensee in Bavaria. [1]. These southern neighbours, however, were then already completely romanised. Thus, by Germanic speakers this name was generalized first onto all Celts, and later onto all Romans. The Old High German Walh became Walch in Middle High German, and adjectival OHG walhisk became MHG welsch, e.g. in the Romance of Alexander by Rudolf von Ems – resulting in Welsche in Early New High German and Modern German as the exonym for all Romanic speakers.
"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walha
GuestUser   Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:28 am GMT
<<Spain is the homeland of the Celts. From here they spread to the rest of Europe. >>

I have no knowledge of genetic/migration routes, but some of the sorts in Ireland don't like unlike many Spaniards.
GuestUser   Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:30 am GMT
look*, not like.
ok   Mon Mar 01, 2010 1:35 pm GMT
yes there was a tribe of mixed celts and iberians in spain before the romans, called celtiberians, along with the lusitanians of portugal, but to say they originated in spain is probably not true.

i wonder if that walha and the name for wales is connected to walloons, which would have been a foreign latin-speaking population to the germans. or even wallachia as the old name for romania in eastern europe. hmm...
Blanco   Mon Mar 01, 2010 2:15 pm GMT
<<Toledo is a Germanic - Celtic mixed name. It came from us French Germanic settlers. The 'Tol' is cognate to the southern French city of 'Tolouse' (Tollhouse in old Frankish) which is related to 'Mulhouse' (pronounced Mool-loose) in Alsace. Segovia is cognate to the southern French places of Segur which is comes from Icelandic Kopavogur. >>

Toulouse was 'Tolosa' BEFORE the germanic invasion, so it's impossible it has a germanic origin.