Forms of Spanish are most likely to break from Castilian

-Sp-   Sun Mar 14, 2010 10:27 am GMT
These are the Spanish variants that are most likely to break from Castilian and become independent languages like Afrikaans:

Aregentinian
Cuban
Venezuelan
Uruguayan
Guatemalan
Panamanian
Puerto Rican
Dominican Republican

And the Spanish of Peru and Bolivia will be gobbled up by Quechua and Aymara while that of Paraguay is already swallowed by Guarani.
vv   Sun Mar 14, 2010 10:32 am GMT
You forgot Chilean.
-Sp-   Sun Mar 14, 2010 10:37 am GMT
I believe that Spanish in Guatemala won't end up as another language but instead it will be killed by Quiche, the language of Rigoberta Menchu and now one of the medium of instruction there.

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!
Awesome   Sun Mar 14, 2010 11:00 am GMT
SOON ITALIAN WILL OVERCOME SPANISH IN ARGENTINA!!!!!

There are 21 Spanish speaking countries in the world but not one Italian speaking country outside of Italy. So what is the country outside of Italy that is most like Italy and close to an Italian speaking country? Argentina naturalmente. Argentina has more people of Italian origin than anyother country in the world outside of Italy. Argentina has close to 20 million people of Italian origin. 3/4 of the people from Buenos Aires, Argentina are of Italian origin.

People from Argentina speak Spanish with an Italian accent!!
Ask any native speaker of Spanish and they will tell you that
people from Argentina speak Spanish with an Italian accent.
(I taught high school Spanish for 30 years and have taken over
18 classes of Spanish, lived in Mexico and have gone to many
of the 21 Spanish speaking countries.)(Lived in Italy for 2 years molto tempo fa and went back il anno passato to school in la universita di Perugia)(Am currently in my 4th year of Italian classes here in California, a proposito)

Found this on the internet.

The Argentine accent evinces heavy Italian influence from the large influx of Italian immigrants. Hand gestures derived from Italian are extremely common, and many slang expressions are borrowed from Italian (for example: instead of saying "cerveza", which means beer, argentineans say "birra", which is in italian). Most locals can readily understand most Spanish dialects, and Portuguese or Italian if spoken slowly.

The Italian influence is one of the charms of travel in Argentina, instantly recognizable in the lilting singsong of Argentine Spanish and the use of Italian words like ciao (pronounced "chow"), often used in place of adios. Argentine red wine consumption is among the highest in the world. And pasta is an Argentine staple; it's available at almost any restaurant, and there's even a day of the month (the 29th, just before paycheck time) reserved for gnocchi. Curiously, a ñoqui now refers to a "ghost employee" of the government who only shows up on payday. Spanish is the official language of Argentina spoken almost everywhere. But there are still some small immigrant communities that retain their native language as a badge of identity. Italian is frequently used in some neighborhoods, reflecting the influence of Argentina's single largest immigrant group . In fact, it's not hard to confuse an Argentine with an Italian, as their manner of
speaking is quite similar.

Today in Argentina Italian-language television is almost as prevalent as Spanish TV.

Buenos Aires, Argentina Spanish 1
In this paper we present experimental evidence showing that Buenos Aires Spanish differs from other Spanish varieties in the realization of pre-nuclear pitch accents and in the final fall in broad focus declarative utterances. Whereas other Spanish varieties have been described consistently as showing late peak alignments, Buenos Aires Spanish displays early peak alignments. The alignment pattern found in Buenos Aires broad focus declarative utterances is not totally foreign to Spanish: it is attested in a quite different function, i.e. to signal contrastive focus. In addition, Buenos Aires Spanish also seems to differ from other Spanish varieties in the realization of the intonation contour in utterance-final intonational phrases, where a pronounced tendency for down-stepped peaks is observed. We argue that these patterns, which emerged at the turn of the twentieth century, and coincided with the peak of Italian immigration, are due to a combination of direct and indirect transfer from Italian. (75% of the people in Buenos Aires, Argentina are of Italian origin.)
As a result, two intonational systems that were typologically similar before contact took place (Hualde, 2002) became more similar after contact, in what can be interpreted as a case of convergence.

A proposito, Brazil actually has more people of Italian origin than Argentina but the difference is Argentina has a much higher percentage of people with an Italian origin.

http://forums.about.com/n/pfx/forum.aspx?tsn=1&nav=messages&webtag=ab-italian&tid=7921
Hainzg   Sun Mar 14, 2010 11:11 am GMT
Wow!

Can someone tell me if the spanish's dialects mutual intelligibility is smaller than quebecer and french?

Some argentine on internet forums says that they cant understand spanish from spain and vice-versa.One argentine guy said that he preferred to talk in german,their third language,with one spanish.
Maybe this is only because argentines dont have contact with the others accents?
Vivataliano   Sun Mar 14, 2010 11:16 am GMT
If that happens then the following places will be renamed:

Buenos Aires to Buone Arie
Entre Rios to Tra Fiumi
Corrientes to Correnti
Misones to Missioni
Rio Negro to Fiume Nero
Santa Cruz to Santa Croce
San Luis to San Luigi
Santiago del Estero to Giacomo dell'Estuario
Tierra del Fuego to Terra del Fuoco
Tucumán to Tucumano

I love to see Argentina getting Italianized completely.
jajaja   Sun Mar 14, 2010 12:05 pm GMT
Those places sound nice in Italian. Italian would be more important than French if it was spoken in Argentina:

Argentina +Italia =100 millions.

France+Quebec+Wallonia+Swiss France= 75 millions

Do you really want that?.
Reality check   Sun Mar 14, 2010 6:53 pm GMT
You wankers keep on dreaming, French, Portuguese and English are WAY more likely to disintegrate into different dialects than Spanish, for example the French have a hard time understanding Quebeckers, Brazilians have a hard time understanding the Portuguese, Americans have a hard time understanding some English accents (not all), etc.

On the other hand, all Spanish speaking countries understand each other perfectly (in spite of what you fuckers might wish), and unlike the other languages, since Spanish has such simple phonetics, if someone don't pronounce words correctly it is seen as wrong, it is not like... Portuguese for example, where whether you pronounce "Continentji" or "Continent" both are acceptable, or English where you can pronounce "Potaito" or "Potahto" and both are okay, etc. those type of things are what makes languages disintegrate.
Desintegration looms   Sun Mar 14, 2010 7:55 pm GMT
<<Portuguese for example, where whether you pronounce "Continentji" or "Continent" both are acceptable, or English where you can pronounce "Potaito" or "Potahto" and both are okay, etc. those type of things are what makes languages disintegrate. >>


españoles/ehpañoleh/epañole/ethpañoles
llegar/yegar/chegar/shegar/jegar(English j)
Poder latino   Sun Mar 14, 2010 8:18 pm GMT
Este Visitor esta obsesionado con la lengua española, pero lo tiene bastante dificil.

La realidad es que nos podemos entender perfectamente un sudamericano, un español y un mexicano.

Creo que bastante mejor que uno de Quebec, otro de Haiti y otro de Paris.
Franco   Sun Mar 14, 2010 8:37 pm GMT
<<llegar/yegar/chegar/shegar/jegar(English j)

>>

Wow, stupidity of the day.

First off, chegar and jegar don't exist. Nobody says "chegar" or "jegar". If you mean English j, it is the same as yegar.
So we have: llegar/yegar/shegar

LL pronounced as Italian gl is almost defunct in Spanish. 99.5% of Spanish speakers pronounce LL and Y the same way, so finally we have:

yegar/shegar.

And "shegar" is reduced to Buenos Aires and surrounding zones..
Valentin   Sun Mar 14, 2010 9:03 pm GMT
Castillan Spanish for me is less understandable than standard Brazilian portuguese.
I understant portuguese better than castillan spanish.
Greetings from Argentina.
Boludo   Sun Mar 14, 2010 10:52 pm GMT
Bollocks, you are NOT from Argentina "Valentin", you're just some [insert nationality] being stupid.
Franco   Sun Mar 14, 2010 11:21 pm GMT
Es un faveleiro tal vez.
Pete from Peru   Mon Mar 15, 2010 1:03 am GMT
-Sp- I don't mean to be rude but this is ridiculous.

Where do those assumptions come from?

Aregentinian
Cuban
Venezuelan
Uruguayan
Guatemalan
Panamanian
Puerto Rican
Dominican Republican ´

They're all mutually intelligible dialects. And all of them are intelligible for native speakers from Spain.

Of course a person with poor education... bah I don't have to sugarcoat it for you; an illiterate anywhere in the Spanish speaking world will always find it difficult to understand any dialect but his/hers.

<<And the Spanish of Peru and Bolivia will be gobbled up by Quechua and Aymara while that of Paraguay is already swallowed by Guarani.>>

Oh my God. As I heard on an American film: "Same bullshit, different day." Where the bloody hell do you get such thing from? I believe you don't have the slightest idea of what Peruvian Spanish sounds like.

I don't know why I even bother posting here. There's a part of me that just think "F*ck off, you idiots". But another part of me wants to try and give you some real knowledge and so I hope some ignorant people here at Antimoon can stop being stupid.

Anyway, here you are to videos of what Peruvian Spanish sounds like.


This is a common TV program in the mornings. The main presenter is an Argentine lady speaking in a modified Argentinian accent, actually her accent is becoming more and more Peruvian everyday. The rest speak standard Peruvian Spanish.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nPRqcIOnlA


This other video show a sort of exchange of opinions between a Spanish program, with presenters using various Spanish accents and a Peruvian program whose presenter used an accent I consider somewhat neutral, still it's tipically Peruvian. All of this features perfectly understandable Spanish.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3Tr1vwFoUY&feature=fvsre1

This one is a Peruvian beer spot. I find it interesting because it shows acurately what Afro Peruvians sound like. And it also shows some Afro Peruvian music. Although I don't speak like this myself, my dad does, and so do most Afro Peruvians

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tBPjrT-w2A&feature=channel


This one shows two gentlemen singing and playing Peruvian creole music. They feature an accent typical of the last generation. It's slowly disappearing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-5SXPumxO0&NR=1


This one is a guy which speaks with a sort of working class Peruvian accent. It's a little funny as well. To be honest, I'd say about half the population in Peru speak like this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXTZd00hQYU&feature=related


This shows two guys, one speaking with a somewhat working class accent and the other using a Adean Spanish accent. Although they exaggerate a bit because it's supposed to be commical.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ct0D6GjpliM


These two funny videos with English captions are Telefonica spots filmed in the streets of Lima at a crossroads. You can see some real people from Lima and most importantly the guy speaking at the end uses the typical urban Lima accent.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmeatUFj1T8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0ZZczgzUAU


This is spot featuring a common guy from Lima using a neutral standard Peruvian accent. He's talking about Peru.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zarj9PQHjbM&feature=channel


And finally this spot shows some Peruvians speaking Quechua it's got captions in Spanish. The first lady is not a Quechua native speaker that's why her accent when speaking Quechua sucks. The second lady is bilingual so her accent is more native-like. The male voice is that of a native Quechua speaker. Although I don't speak Quechua myself I plan to study it seriously someday.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtCie4VHNdY&feature=channel


I hope that's helpful


Kind regards