Closest NE dialect to Western dialect

Chris   Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:32 am GMT
Which Northeastern accent is the closest to the Western dialect? Such as having the cot-caught merger, merry-marry-Mary merger, and no tensing before nasals or NCVS?
Lazar   Wed Jun 21, 2006 5:23 am GMT
<<Such as having the cot-caught merger>>

Well...most speakers in Massachusetts and Northern New England have the c-c erger, but I don't think it's the kind of c-c merger that you're after. You see, c-c merged New Englanders still maintain a phonemic distinction between /A/ and /Q/; it's just that we distinguish between "father"-"bother" and merge "cot"-"caught", where speakers in other parts of the country would merge "father"-"bother" and distinguish "cot"-caught". What you're looking for is a full low vowel merger (ie, all "cot", "caught", "father", and "bother" vowels collapsing into one phoneme, like /A/), which isn't a feature of any NE dialect to my knowledge.

<<merry-marry-Mary merger>>

The 3M merger (and related mergers like "serious-Sirius", "hurry-furry", and "Tory-torrent") occur variably in suburban parts of Massachusetts; and I think the mergers are pretty much predominant in the other New England states except Rhode Island. I'm not as knowledgeable in dialects outside New England, but I think that those mergers would be more common in Upstate NY than in NYC.

(The mergers are the least common in urban areas traditionally associated with non-rhoticism: NY, Boston, Worcester, Providence)

<<and no tensing before nasals>>

This one is harder to judge since pre-nasal tensing in New England is non-phonemic (phonemic /{/-tensing occurs in NYC and Philly, but not in New England). In New England, strong pre-nasal tensing tends to be associated with traditional non-rhotic urban accents. My guess would be that the more rhotic and the more 3M-merged an area is, the less pre-nasal tensing it will have.

<<NCVS?>>

I don't hear much NCVS here in Massachusetts. Checking this map ( http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/de/Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift.png ), it seems that the NCVS may be starting to make some inroads into southern New England, but it hasn't spread into my area yet. Elsewhere in the Northeast, the map seems to indicate that the NCVS is strongest in western NY State.

So basically, I don't think there are many speakers in New England, NYC, or New Jersey who would meet all your criteria. But if the Northeast includes Pennsylvania (admittedly, when I think "Northeast" I tend to mainly think about New England, New York, and New Jersey), then I think we do have one region that might share those Western features: Western Pennsylvania. I've read that Western Pennsylvania has a full "cot"-"caught" and "father"-"bother" merger; and according to this map ( http://cfprod01.imt.uwm.edu/Dept/FLL/linguistics/dialect/staticmaps/q_15.html ) they seem to have a full 3M merger; and according to the Wikipedia map, they don't seem to be a NCVS area.
Kirk   Wed Jun 21, 2006 6:12 am GMT
<<I've read that Western Pennsylvania has a full "cot"-"caught" and "father"-"bother" merger; and according to this map ( http://cfprod01.imt.uwm.edu/Dept/FLL/linguistics/dialect/staticmaps/q_15.html ) they seem to have a full 3M merger; and according to the Wikipedia map, they don't seem to be a NCVS area.>>

So, in theory, if I up and went to Western Pennsylvania maybe I wouldn't stand out so much? :D

<<Which Northeastern accent is the closest to the Western dialect? Such as having the cot-caught merger, merry-marry-Mary merger, and no tensing before nasals or NCVS?>>

Hmm, not sure. Just out of curiosity, where are you from, Chris?
Kirk   Wed Jun 21, 2006 8:20 am GMT
<<Radio and television are doubtlessly changing the linguistic landscape in these places too but it may take several more decades to assess their full impact.>>

False. I've mentioned this to you before but just another reminder that the mass media have been shown time and time again by comprehensive linguistic studies to have no effect on phonological changes. They don't bring them about or spread them.

<<The accents that we call "Northeastern" in the United States are generally "non-rhotic" e.g. ga'den and æn'suh (for "garden" and "answer) like most of present day England. The western accents of American English are "rhotic" e.g. gaRden; æn'suR.>>

Well it also depends on whether or not you're talking about traditional dialects of the Northeast or not--Lazar, for instance, is from the Northeast and is completely rhotic.

Anyway, I'm not sure if your response really answered Chris' question but of course if we're looking for a Northeastern dialect closest to the Western one it would definitely need to be a rhotic one.