do people in england they really speak "english"?

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Yes, that's me who has the unusual habit of talking (in this case: writing) in rhyming couplets! :-)
I haven't even dreamed of being so informative... ;-)

<<Dresden-Prague-Budapest-Blimey>>

Sorry...I just couldn't resist that... :-) No offence was involved anyway.

<<Yep, I heard that the town of Blimey is a lovely place to visit - especially this time of year ( lack of tourists and that).>>

LOL! This time of the year, because of the lack of tourists! Is it a popular place to visit other times of the year? ;-)

<<I mean Prague, Dresden and Bucharest>>

Oops...that's BUDAPEST! Sorry for me being pernickety again but I don't know why everyone mistakes Budapest for Bucharest. However, they sound a bit alike...of course not totally!

<<Living in Germany must be wicked!! !! I suddenly feel like my life is so blinking boring!!!!!!>>

Yes, it is...in every respect. I usually meet two types of people here: those who mistake me for German (which is surprising as my German is a bit rusty, mildly speaking) and those who (as soon as they recognise that I'm a foreigner) immediately begin to talk to me in English. It's quite annoying since it usually means that they assume that I don't speak German. At this point I start to speak German fluently and explain them that I do speak German and I don't understand the language they are trying to speak to me. I don't know what language it is anyway. :-)
But most of the time they are hopeless...they go on talking in English. Aaaargh!!!!
Furthermore, English with a thick Saxonian accent is extremely hard to understand...Check out this video (it isn't specifically Saxonian but certainly is *the* epitome of German accent - well hilarious):

http://youtube.com/watch?v=FrYRY6kx550

My future...that's a tough stuff. I haven't got the vaguest notion of what exactly I am gonna do with my life after graduation. Actually, I'm training to become a teacher. I might as well apply for a job in any kind of secondary educational institution. I'm still flirting with the idea but I'm not sure any more. You know, that could be really nerve-wrecking and it's not the type of job that you'd call a life insurance by any stretch of the imagination. To be more precise, you desperately need a life insurance if you want to pursue a carreer like that! (Of course I'm exaggerating slightly...unless you want to teach in Bronx (US) or in one of the worst comprehensive schools in the East End ;-))

I need some further education to become a translator -- that's a different kettle of fish.
Or I might complete a PhD, which I don't feel capable for. But never say never!

I'm Hungarian by origin and nationality, too. However, I'm a British speaker as I spent considerable time in the UK. Unfortunately, I haven't settled down in one place or the other for a long time, so it was a constant travel (, which seems to be in my line). I say "unfortunately" because it has an undesirable effect on my English accent: it's mainly southern English with some northern influence here and there. What's more, after a while my Hungarian (not specifically, I'd rather say Central/Eastern European) intonation patterns start to creep in...

However, the Aussie girl (whom I've mistaken for British) thought I was a native Briton! Wow! :-)

Happy Birthday to your mum!!!!

<<Apologies for the typos.....>>

No probs. :-)

By undesirable effect I mean that my accent is a hotchpotch of southern and northern dialects (the former being more easily noticeable) and a slight foreign undertone, I suppose.

Correction:

It isn't "a life insurance", just "life insurance".

And so on, and so forth. I could go on correcting myself ad infinitum but I don't want to seem even more boring than I actually am. So, I can't be bothered to correct myself any more...or at least not all the mistakes I make.

<<Dresden-Prague-Budapest-Blimey>>

None taken Liz, I told you my English is bad.

<< LOL! This time of the year, because of the lack of tourists! Is it a popular place to visit other times of the year? ;-) >>

Sadly, no.

Yes, you are right about that life insurance needed to teach lark. I go to college in Newham (East London), and the way the kids act there (16-18 generally) is unbelievable!!!!The lip on them!!!! Aarrgghhh!!! In the old days (my school days) if a kid was cheeky, he was taken out of the classroom, taken to the headmaster, literally s*** himself, returned to the lesson and NEVER spoke again. But now days, these kids are tooled up with all sorts of things. As I see on a daily basis, the teachers are actually scared of the pupils. I would last about a second before I would get the sack, I'd slap these mouthy little gits something rotten. It's sad really.

<< Oops...that's BUDAPEST! Sorry for me being pernickety again but I don't know why everyone mistakes Budapest for Bucharest. However, they sound a bit alike...of course not totally!>>

Arrgghh - so sorry, I don’t know why I got both of them mixed up. Budapest is in Hungary right?? It was made up of two towns, Buda and Pest (I think). I don't know much about Hungary. I have heard about a few places that are meant to be lovely places to visit. Budapest looks beautiful of course (I’d love to see the castle and the palace as well as the bridge and St Stephen's church). I have also heard that Szeged and Visegrad are very nice. Any recommendations???

You’re Hungarian by birth - wow. That surprised me for some reason. I suppose just going by your excellent English skills; I had you down as a public school toff!!

<< By undesirable effect I mean that my accent is a hotchpotch of southern and northern dialects (the former being more easily noticeable) and a slight foreign undertone, I suppose. >>

Mixed in with a little Hungarian as well?? Ladies and gentleman that must be a worlds first. I can't even begin to imagine what that mix must sound like. Don't worry about not having an English accent; all accents are great (except South African - dodgy).

I'm surprised the Germans don't speak to you in German when it is obvious that you can speak it. I'd have imagined them to be well impressed and actually chuffed that you were making an effort to blend in. Oh well.

That was a funny link by the way. I have no clue regarding German accents, dialects, and rather embarrassingly did not think they really had any. To me that Saxon accent sounded quintessentially German, And as an Englishman, when I hear a German talk alarm bells ring, I think that something is not quite right there. No no, I have a pen pal in Monchengladbach, from a school exchange a few years back, he is a top lad. My untrained years can not tell the difference between that accent and the Saxon one though. It all sounds German.

Actually, have a look at this Liz, me and brother argue about whether this is real or fake. I am convinced that no kid can act like this. As you can speak German, you may be able to shed some light on the matter. Anyway, it is quite funny - but I bet it is funnier in German (the bit with the escape button creased me up).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNoxytRqbHc

<<My untrained years>> Arrggghh
<<me and brother>> Aaaarrggghhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PUB LUNCH:

A college in Newham, East London...? Sounds great... Isn't it a school in which the vast majority of pupils are non-native English speakers? I don't know which one it is but I know there is a particularly infamous school (among the many :-)) in East London.

Yes, Budapest is in Hungary, Bucharest is in Romania. Pécs is a beautiful town, too. Szentendre is my all-time favourite. This town represents our "bleating" language with the abundance of "e" sounds. :-) Just like Szeged.

Me as a public school toff ??? I don't want to be stuffed into those horrrrrible uniforms! Thank god it's uni. :-) Not to mention my half upper-class half working-class family! That's a rare blend. :-)

I DO have an English accent, at least people claim so. I don't know. Ask Damian... Once I posted here my accent sample just out of curiosity. Damian said that sometimes he could make out some foreign undertones here and there but I might as well have lived all my life in Henley-upon-Thames, Surry etc, anywhere in South East England or something like that. (I couldn't find the exact thread.) These are the names of places I have never been to!!!!! ;-) But why not?

I could post my accent sample if you want to hear that...I hope it isn't such a strange mixture as I have described it.

Don't you like South African? Sounds strange...just a wee bit.

Germans are a strange bunch of people...don't be surprised at anything they do! :-) My latest German experience:
I was having a chat in English with international students who couldn't speak German, when a German girl addressed me. Our fantastic dialogue was something like that:

German: Are you from England?
Me: Nein, ich komme aus Ungarn.
German: Almost...

Almost??? A "near" miss, I have to say. Bit of a distance. :-)
However, being mistaken for English doesn't usually result in the lack of recieving proper service in McDonalds in Germany (anyway, Hungarian McDonalds is sooo much better... :-)) unlike in France. That's another story... :-)

No, I'm not sure which accent it was or it was just a parody...Just *the* quintessential German accent, as you put it quite rightly. There is an incredibly wide range of accents and dialects in Germany. Saxonian is pretty much stigmatised as it grates on the ear a bit. Still, I prefer it to Bavarian. Bavarians are extremely proud of their own dialect. You can read in some job advertisements that it's essential for applicants to speak with that particular accent. But, to me, they sound like louts. But it's probably just MY lack of taste.

Thanks for the link...Sorry, but I don't have an audio device installed. I'm saaaaaad... :-(

Surry=Surrey...Aaargh!!!!!!!!

By the way...toff...Am I supposed to take it as a backhanded compliment? If
it is a compliment at all. Sounds slightly pejorative, doesn't it? That's not quite the impression I want to make, but it seems I manage to do sometimes. Do I sound (well, write) snooty? :-) :-)

<<A college in Newham, East London...? Sounds great... Isn't it a school in which the vast majority of pupils are non-native English speakers? I don't know which one it is but I know there is a particularly infamous school (among the many :-)) in East London.>>

Nope - it’s not so great. It’s weird, being half 'Sri Lankan' and growing up in a 'white area' such as Basildon, you'd think I’d enjoy being surrounded by people that perhaps erm - 'look like me??' (Not sure if that really says what I am trying to say). But I really don't, despite being just 14 miles away, it’s a culture shock for me. I don't really fit in at all. The college I go to consists of mostly British 'Asians' and ' blacks' so most do speak English (although their are many new Asian and Eastern European immigrants as well who speak very limited English).

But I still can't understand a word, we speak soooo different!! Ok, that is an exaggeration. But their is a huge difference, for example, our slang is different (no blimeys !!!!) and the accent is completely different - I can't really say what it is. Just a big mix of Asian and Caribbean - its odd because even the few white people around speak like it (which makes me laugh, it just sounds too different - not saying its bad though to what I am used to - not that its bad). Mind you, they don't understand me much either, my family were sticklers for BrE pronunciations (whatever that is) and some of the words I pronounce raises some giggles (not in a bad way though). But then I get a lot of stick for sounding like an Essex man as well (despite most people thinking I'm a yank or an aussie!!!).

Actually, the accent interests me, you can learn so much from it. Not just new words (everyone says 'bare' - which means 'a lot of ' as in 'I have got bare homework', this is a new one to me), but also culture wise. For example a geezer in my lesson speaks with 'this accent' but when I met his parents, they sound proper 'East End'. So from that you can see (hear??) how the culture has changed in an area in just a generation. My best friend is of Indian origin, and is from Ilford, but he does not have this accent either (but does have definite Indian tones though) so I wonder how or when this accent came about. ( how boring am I becoming??)

Actually, most of the British 'Asians' speak in Hindi or Guajarati outside the classroom, so this makes it a bit more difficult to mix, luckily my best friend is Hindu, so I can understand (but not speak) some of what is being said (I never let on though).

The violence is also surprising. When I tell people I am from Basildon (I am moving back next month) people always say oh that's a white area 'innit'??' 'I would not go their man, its proper racist 'innit'??'. The funny thing is, Basildon (in my opinion) is FAR safer than areas such as Barking, East Ham (although we are slowly catching up). All I can say is, I do not feel comfortable as soon as I get off the train and in my short time at the college, I have seen and been in more trouble than in my entire life. I never thought the day would come that I actually looked forward to getting back to Basildon!!!

Szentrendre and Pecs?? - I'll take note; they must be lovely places - cheers for that! I am planning a few months travelling Europe next summer so I need all the ideas I can get.

<<By the way...toff...Am I supposed to take it as a backhanded compliment? If
it is a compliment at all. Sounds slightly pejorative, doesn't it? That's not quite the impression I want to make, but it seems I manage to do sometimes. Do I sound (well, write) snooty? :-) :-) >>

Yeah, in around about way it was a compliment. You write very well and in a manner that I am not used to reading. But then I am not very articulate and as this IS a language forum, it is to be expected. The funny thing is, in asking the question you made my point - pejorative??? I had to look that one up!! I now know what it means - and NO I was not belittling you. I'll add 'pejorative' to the list of new words as learned by Liz!!! I suppose what I am saying is, how does a girl from Hungary learn these words.

I am not the sharpest tool in the box but I'm not the bluntest either. But I have never heard of these words, and I suppose because neither I nor the people around me use these words, I can only equate someone that would, as an English language major/teacher or something (or a toff!!). It is probably a class thing as well as an intelligence thing, you did say half your family are middle class!!!

It's very good though, I can only dream of having such a command of the English language.

I'd never mean to cause any offence Liz, I think I need to start using those :) thingymejigs!!!

<<Germans are a strange bunch of people...don't be surprised at anything they do! :-) My latest German experience:
I was having a chat in English with international students who couldn't speak German, when a German girl addressed me. Our fantastic dialogue was something like that:

German: Are you from England?
Me: Nein, ich komme aus Ungarn.
German: Almost... >>

Classic!!!!

How is the Hungarian McDonalds better, Mac - E -D’s is is the same everywhere surely?? Actually, saying that, I do remember the sausage in the Aussie 'Big Breakfast' being spicier!!! Not a big fan of fast food anymore, I did like KFC but it has gone downhill. I blame the colonel. I think he should have shared the secret spices recipe, because I think he has simply got too old now, his memory is probably not what it was, and I think he has forgotten one of the seven spices - KFC just does not taste like it used to. Actually, the worst KFC (and Burger King) I had was in the States surprisingly, so I suppose they are not all the same then are they??

Ok that's it; I really have hit an all-time low with that fast food rant!!!! I better get back to my chemistry - arrgghhhh!!!!

Sorry for the typos in advance (I have nor the time nor the will to read everything again).

<<Nope - it’s not so great.>>

Okay...I should have written "great". A tinge of irony was involved, of course. :-)

I took a course in sociolinguistics and we had to make presentations on one of the topics. There are loads of international students here, most of whom don't speak German at all. Besides, this course was English-speaking, and all these people have their distinct ways of speaking, and some German students have quite funny accents as well. Some Turkish boys and girls made an oral presentation on Pidgin and Creole, and they really spoke accordingly! Normally they aren't Pidgin or Creole speakers but they sounded to be so.

<<Actually, most of the British 'Asians' speak in Hindi or Guajarati outside the classroom, so this makes it a bit more difficult to mix, luckily my best friend is Hindu, so I can understand (but not speak) some of what is being said (I never let on though).>>

I used to have a professor at uni who had lived in India before, and she sounds almost like an Indian! I still can hear the way she speaks...I'm quite good at taking her off. I would show you if you were here. ;-)

<<Szentrendre and Pecs?? - I'll take note; they must be lovely places - cheers for that! I am planning a few months travelling Europe next summer so I need all the ideas I can get.>>

Really? Good luck then. :-)

<<Yeah, in around about way it was a compliment. You write very well and in a manner that I am not used to reading. But then I am not very articulate and as this IS a language forum, it is to be expected. The funny thing is, in asking the question you made my point - pejorative??? I had to look that one up!! I now know what it means - and NO I was not belittling you. I'll add 'pejorative' to the list of new words as learned by Liz!!! I suppose what I am saying is, how does a girl from Hungary learn these words.>>

I'm happy again to have taught you a new word. I would never have thought I could. Mind you, I taught two new German words to Germans! It's unbelievable, considering that my German vocab is somewhere around zero, converging to minus infinite! Probably because one of the words was of Latin, the other was of French origin. My penchant for mixing French and Latinate words into my English and German speech is due to the fact that I'm running out of my basic Anglo-Saxon vocab relatively quickly. As opposed to most people who use fancy words in order to show off. :-) (No-one believes me but I don't give a toss...I know it's true, and that's what counts. ;-))

Yes, I tend to write quite eloquently (even if my punctuation is rubbish), but, funnily enough, when it comes to speaking I'm not that meticulous. I speak rather colloquially, on the level of pronunciation, grammar and vocab, too. What's even worse, I have the unusual habit of mixing slangish/informaly style with formal/eloquent style. I do it occassionally in writing, too. People find it amusing in a positive sense, though. :-)

<<It is probably a class thing as well as an intelligence thing, you did say half your family are middle class!!!>>

working class (half of my family)+upper class (half of my family)=middle class
Yes, a good estimation! I'm definitely middle class as no-one says mixed class. It's time to introduce some new terms... ;-)

<<It's very good though, I can only dream of having such a command of the English language.>>

No, you, being a native speaker, DO have a way better command of English than me.

<<I'd never mean to cause any offence Liz, I think I need to start using those :) thingymejigs!!!>>

I was using them for the same reason. I never mean to cause or take any offence...I'm either being pernickety (as per usual :-() or just taking the piss (or extracting the Michael as some would say)...

<<How is the Hungarian McDonalds better, Mac - E -D’s is is the same everywhere surely??>>

Well, well...I could bet you'd ask this question. I wanted to elaborate on that but I didn't have time or energy to do so...
Yes, in theory, McDonald's supposed to be the same everywhere. However, burgers are cold and dry, chips are dry and cold, not to mention the mayonnaise which is nothing but crap here, plus you don't have it in a box but it's in a plastic-paper "who-the-bloody-hell-knows-what-it-is". Then you are stuck with that...you can't dip, you have to put it in top of the chips. Of course, you can't becase the chips aren't on a plate. Aarrrgh! But I'm creative enough to put the mayonnaise into the emptied box of the burger. Mind you, I don't have guts to eat hamburgers (I usually eat a fishburger...but I eat quite rarely in McDonalds). No-one's entirely sure what exactly the ham bit is made of. I bet it isn't pure ham...It starts to dawn on me why Americans call it junk food...

I by no means want to generalise here. This might not be so in other parts of Germany. It's just my area...ex-GDR for real! :-)

<<Ok that's it; I really have hit an all-time low with that fast food rant!!!! I better get back to my chemistry - arrgghhhh!!!!>>

Not at all. No probs, anyway. Life would be far too boring without fast-food rants! ;-)

Chemistry???? You must be very smart! Quite frankly I was hopeless at chemistry...I liked physics and maths (apart form the "geometry" bit, which has never been my forte) but chemistry...It's not even worth mentioning...well shameful, though.

<<Sorry for the typos in advance (I have nor the time nor the will to read everything again).>>

Now you can read my posts, too, especially the last one. I never do proof-reading, however, I should.

<<but they sounded to be so.>> sounded like that

What kind of language is this???? Hungarian pidgin (or creole)???? Aarrrgh!

<<Life would be far too boring without fast-food rants! ;-)>>

I said...fast-food (restau)rants... ;-)

"Oddly enough, literally a day will not go by without someone asking whether I am an Australian or an American - it is unbelievable!!!"

Try being asked by foreigners whether your Welsh or Scottish when you are English (no offence to members of those countries) but why do the English think I'm English and foreigners think I'm from over the boarder.

I felt quite bad when an American lady asked whether I was Welsh, and I said no quite abruptly, even after I tried to make amends I still felt like a jerk.

Most people in Germany/France are able to speak standard German/French accent.
Only 3 % Britishers seem to speak standard English (RP).
A cousin of mine went to England, and there were times she couldn't be able to understand what the locals were saying...So, British people, please stick to RP. Don't ruin your language!

>>Most people in Germany/France are able to speak standard German/French accent.
Only 3 % Britishers seem to speak standard English (RP).
A cousin of mine went to England, and there were times she couldn't be able to understand what the locals were saying...So, British people, please stick to RP. Don't ruin your language!<<

How is speaking something other than RP "ruining your language", especially when RP was never spoken by the majority of the British population in the first place?

And by the way, RP is not "standard English" - it is an English standard not *the* English standard.

Mark - Initially I was about to say that I have no idea how an English accent can be confused with a Welsh or Scottish accent, but then thinking about it, it depends on which part of England you are from. If you are, say from Birmingham, Newcastle, Liverpool or maybe even West country, 'foreigners' who do seem to think we all speak like Hugh Grant may equate those accents with Scotland or Wales. It depends on where you are from I imagine. But as an Essex man how do my fellow Britons think I'm an aussie or a yank??

Americans are notorious for getting accents wrong (in my experience). I met a nice lady from New York in Disneyland a few years ago while queuing for some Ice cream (if only it was that easy). She kept staring at me and my family and was clearly listening to what we were saying, after a few minutes she came over and said 'your scouser’s aren’t you'!!!. It turned out she meant to say 'cockney'.

I'm from Essex but my mate I was with really does have as close to a cockney accent as you'll get these days, and she seemed fascinated by our accent. My mate did get frustrated a few times on that trip though as no-one could understand a word he said (I had a couple of probs also). I tell you man it was funny, we would go to a drive through and ordering would take ages. I remember one lady asking if we spoke Spanish because she felt she might be able to converse better that way!!! My friend has a short fuse and a few times I thought it was going to kick off, he really felt that the Americans were mocking him, I myself was surprised at the difficulty at the time, but thinking about it, here in the South, we really do speak differently. As far as I know, Americans can understand a difficult accent such as scouse (for me anyway) much easier, due to similar pronunciation I suppose.

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