Occitan, Provençal, Catalan

Jordi   Tuesday, August 31, 2004, 17:36 GMT
It's a phonetic transcription of an Occitan dialect to make it look impossible. It's speaks of the "patuè" or "patois", which is a way the French have to refer to great languages that aren't official in their territories. The intention is clearly negative.
Jâco   Tuesday, August 31, 2004, 21:07 GMT
Un système graphique a été codifié par les linguistes du Centre de la Culture Savoyarde, dont le siège se trouve à Conflans, au dessus d'Albertville en Savoie. C'est cette "graphie de Conflans" qui j'ai écrit au-dessus.

Principe: On n'écrit que les sons prononcés, on ne prononce que ce qui est écrit.
to Jâco   Thursday, September 02, 2004, 01:43 GMT
That system looks weird.
nic   Thursday, September 02, 2004, 12:26 GMT
If it's savoyard, it's not occitan but franco-provençal
Hermano Germanus Germà   Friday, September 03, 2004, 22:05 GMT
ger·man2 ( P ) Pronunciation Key (jûrmn)
Having the same parents or the same grandparents on either the mother's or the father's side. Often used in combination: a cousin-german; a brother-german.

[Middle English germain, from Old French, from Latin germnus, from germen, offshoot. See gen- in Indo-European Roots.]

Whence Spanish Hermano , Portuguese Irmão , Catalan Germà , French Germain ....


Ger·man ( P ) Pronunciation Key (jûrmn)
Of, relating to, or characteristic of Germany or its people.
Of or relating to the German language.


A native or inhabitant of Germany.
A person of German ancestry.
Any of the West Germanic languages and dialects spoken or originating in Germany, Austria, or Switzerland, especially standard High German.

[Middle English, from Latin Germnus.]

So , According to philologists , Spanish Hermano , Portuguese Irmão ...
Have Nothing to do with Germanic Tribes.
Xatufan   Friday, September 03, 2004, 23:59 GMT
Both words have the same origin, don't they?
Hermano Germanus Germà   Saturday, September 04, 2004, 20:51 GMT

Yes , "Frater Germanus" (blood Brother in latin) , Whence Spanish Hermano / Portuguese irmão , derives from Latin Germanus ; But Germanus In this Case has a indo-european Origin [gen-] .

(Nothing to do with German Tribes)

But German

A native or inhabitant of Germany

Also Derives From Latin Germanus but Has a Different Root , Maybe Celtic or Germanic.

FRATER GERMANUS www.bartleby.com

Also gen-. To give birth, beget; with derivatives referring to aspects and results of procreation and to familial and tribal groups. Oldest form *en1-, becoming *gen1- in centum languages.
Derivatives include kin, king, jaunty, genius, pregnant, gingerly, and nature.
I. Basic form *gen-. 1. Suffixed form *gen-es-. a. gender, general, generate, generation, generic, generous, genre, genus; congener, degenerate, engender, miscegenation, from Latin genus, race, kind; b. gene; allogeneic, genealogy, genocide, genotype, heterogeneous, syngeneic, from Greek genos and gene, race, family; c. –gen, –geny; epigene, from Greek suffix -gens, “-born.” 2. Suffixed form *gen()-yo-. a. genial1, genius; congenial, from Latin genius, procreative divinity, inborn tutelary spirit, innate quality; b. engine, ingenious, from Latin ingenium, inborn character (in-, in; see en). 3. Suffixed form *gen--. indigen, indigenous, from Latin indigena, born in (a place), indigenous (indu-, within; see en). 4. Suffixed form *gen-wo-. genuine, ingenuous, from Latin ingenuus, born in (a place), native, natural, freeborn (in-, in; see en). 5. Suffixed form *gen()-men-. germ, german2, germane, germinal, germinate, from dissimilated Latin germen, shoot, bud, embryo, germ.
II. O-grade form *gon-, reduced to *gon- in suffixed form *gon-o-. 1. gonad, gono-, –gony; archegonium, epigone, hormogonium, from Greek gonos, child, procreation, seed. 2. Harijan, from Sanskrit jana, offspring, child, person.
III. Zero-grade form *g-. 1. Suffixed form *g-yo-. a. kin; kindred, from Old English cyn(n), race, family, kin; b. king, from Old English cyning, king, from Germanic *kuningaz, king. Both a and b from Germanic *kunjam, family. 2. Suffixed form *g-t-. a. kind2, from Old English cynd, gecynd(e), origin, birth, race, family, kind, from Germanic *kundjaz, family, race; b. kind1, from Old English gecynde, natural, native, fitting (ge-, collective prefix; see kom), from Germanic *kundiz, natural, native; c. suffixed form *g-ti-. (i) gens, genteel, gentile, gentle, gentry, jaunty; gendarme, from Latin gns (stem genti-), race, clan; (ii) genesis, –genesis, from Greek genesis, birth, beginning; d. kindergarten, Kriss Kringle, wunderkind, from Old High German kind, child, from Germanic secondary full-grade variant *kentham; e. suffixed form *g-to-. Jataka, from Sanskrit jta-, born (verbal adjective of janate, he is born). 3. Reduplicated form *gi-gn()-. genital, genitive, genitor, geniture, gent1, gingerly; congenital, primogenitor, primogeniture, progenitor, progeny, from Latin gignere (past participle genitus), to beget. 4. Reduced form *gn- in suffixed form *-gn-o-. benign, malign, from Latin benignus, good-natured, kindly (bene, well; see deu-2), and malignus, evil-natured, malevolent (male, ill; see mel-3). 5. Zero-grade form *g- becoming *gn-. pregnant1; impregnate, from Latin praegns, pregnant (prae-, before; see per1). 6. Suffixed form *g-sko- becoming *gn-sko-. naive, nascent, natal, nation, native, nature, née, Noël; adnate, agnate, cognate, connate, enate, innate, neonate, puisne, puny, renaissance, from Latin gnsc, nsc (past participle gntus, ntus), to be born. 7. Reduced form *g- in Sanskrit compound kmi-ja- (see kwmi-). (Pokorny 1. en- 373.)

But very different is the origin of German
Xatufan   Saturday, September 04, 2004, 20:54 GMT
I understood. In a Latin language you would find the word germanus like this:

germanus 1:

germanus 2:

Because they have a different origin.
nic   Monday, September 06, 2004, 10:58 GMT
In french when we speak about someone who's form Germany we say "un allemand", when we speak about a cousin (example the son of my father's sister) we say "un cousin germain" if it's a girl it will be "une cousine germaine".

We never say les "germanis" we all the time use the word "les allemands", if i remember well my spanish courses spanish use a similar term.
Xatufan   Monday, September 06, 2004, 19:47 GMT
In Spanish:

German = Alemán