Hungarian Mongoloid language?

Romanian   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 05:31 GMT
coach...sorry
Romanian   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 05:35 GMT
Nadia's coach was Bela Karolyi (who later coached Mary Lou Retton) He is Hungarian...
Brennus   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 05:54 GMT
Chamonix and Romanian,

Thanks for your posts . I had a history professor at the Univesity of Washington once, a Dr. Peter Sugar (also spelled Szugar), from Hungary originally, who told us that nationality in Eastern Europe is more what you feel you are rather than what you really are. By this logic, if Nadia feels she is Romanian then she would be Romanian.

The flip side is, however, that most Romanians I've met are very Mediterranean in appearance and Nadia doesn't look all that Mediterranean. If she was born in Moldavia, that isn't to far from Transylvania and the old Austro-Hungarian Empire.

Anyhow, no harm done in taking issue with my statement. I realize that a lot of people could care less about Nadia's ethnicity. However, for those of us who do have an interest in things like geography, anthropology or geneology, these things always worth discussing a little bit.
Frances   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 06:16 GMT
""Her coach's name sounded Romanian though "

what do you mean? her couch ?"

Sorry I meant to say Hungarian - his name sounds very Hungarian
Frances   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 06:18 GMT
Brennus - but there surely is more than one characteristic look for a culture. I met a Romanian the other day and he was definitely a Romanian but had blonde hair and blue eyes, it doesn't mean they are all dark with olive complexion.
evilnerd   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 19:17 GMT
Easterner,

«Two proofs that present-day Hungarian is a continuation of the language spoken by the ancient Magyars are an old prayer to Mary and a funeral speech, which are still intelligible.»

I was not implying that present-day Hungarian wasn't a continuation of 9th-century Magyar. Sorry if indeed I gave that impression. I was actually surprised as to how Hungarian could've survived through all those hardships. Obviously, immigrants picked up Hungarian as their language, as testimonied by the sheer number of Hungarians having a German- or Slavic-sounding surname.

cheers,

the evil nerd
Brennus   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 21:45 GMT
Frances,

Don't forget that Romania has a German minority like Hungary called the "Saxons" who have been living there since the 12th century. In fact, the Germans and the Jews were kind of the same thing to Eastern Europe that the Chinese have been to Southeast Asia and they are just about everywhere there.
Chamonix   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 22:38 GMT
"but there surely is more than one characteristic look for a culture. I met a Romanian the other day and he was definitely a Romanian but had blonde hair and blue eyes, it doesn't mean they are all dark with olive complexion"

Frances,

Who told you that Romanians are all dark olive complexion?
It's very wrong, unless you were talking about Gypsies, which are a different category of people even if there are many in Romania.
Majority of Romanians are white complexion, some are really blond and blue eyes. You can tell that Greeks are dark complexion, but not Romanians.
Chamonix   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 22:41 GMT
"Nadia's coach was Bela Karolyi (who later coached Mary Lou Retton) He is Hungarian"

..and before that, it was a Romanian(100%) guy named Munteanu Valeriu who actually discovered her and initiated her in gymnastics.
Frances   Thursday, April 14, 2005, 23:09 GMT
Chamnoix & Brennus

Sorry - sloppy language. When "Mediterranean" is used it gives me and I suppose other readers an image of someone with dark hair and olive skin. I didn't mean to insert "dark". I am very well aware as to how most Balkan/Pannonian people look like. Although I didn't grow up in the Balkans, my stock is from the Balkans. I've seen enough Romanians with my eyes to know that like that rest of Europe (including other Balkan races) have variation in skin tone, eye colour etc. Although I have never met a gypsy in person, I've seen enough of them on TV to know how they look like. My mother also grew up in Romania and has told me enough also about their appearances

As for Greeks, not all are dark. I've seen many with light brown hair and blue eyes and skin whiter than mine (and my skin is relatively light).

Brennus - there are of course Germans and Jews in Romania but blonde Romanians do exist as well!
Easterner   Friday, April 15, 2005, 00:06 GMT
>>I was not implying that present-day Hungarian wasn't a continuation of 9th-century Magyar.<<

I know, it was just an added remark of mine. No hard feelings at all. And yes, actually those who speak Hungarian at the moment are mostly descendants of Slavs and Germans. What is interesting about the language is that it doesn't reflect this intermixture that much. Most Slavic loanwords date from the time after the Hungarian settlement (one proof of this is "galamb", meaning "dove", which contains the old nasal sound that later disappeared from most Slavic languages), but the later borrowings from both Slavic and German are sporadic. A reason for this may be that the ruling aristocracy was consistently using Hungarian through the most part of history (besides Latin, of course), and new settlers adapted themselves to this practice. The Croatian aristocracy, for example, was bilingual, while that of the Slovaks became gradually assimilated. A proof of this is the amount of Slovak names among noble families: Podmaniczky, Jeszenszky, Rudnyánszky, etc. Even some of the noblemen representing the Habsburg rule spoke some Hungarian.
Romanian   Friday, April 15, 2005, 01:52 GMT
With respect for the “Hungarian language” topic I’ve posted a reply on my “Re:Romanian language and history” subject…
Romanian   Friday, April 15, 2005, 01:54 GMT