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The Antimoon Way
Here's what Antimoon says. Do you agree on each point?
Myth #1: "The best way to learn a foreign language is to go to a foreign country"
Myth #2: "The best way to learn a foreign language is to speak it"
Myth #3: "It is OK to make mistakes"
Myth #4: "As a beginner, you're bound to make a lot of mistakes"
Myth #5: "You are a foreigner, therefore you will always have a foreign accent"
Myth #6: "If you didn't learn a foreign language as a child, you will never be fully proficient in its grammar"
Myth #7: "Studying pronunciation is not important"
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Foreign Country: Agree, it is not necessary, but it helps a lot with the colloquial speech, culture and hones the language.
Speak it: You need all the skills to really know the language, so I partly agree.
Mistakes: This is the edgy one. It's not "sinning" to make a mistake in a foreign language, but it's best to try to avoid making mistakes.
Beginner: You'll make some mistakes, whether a lot, I don't know.
Foreign Accent: Agree with Antimoon. You do NOT have to have a foreign accent in a foreign language. (If you do, hopefully it's not the end of the road for you like the British guy in 'The Great Escape', an old movie that may make you want to polish your accent to a higher level.)
Grammar: Not sure about this. I make mistakes in English grammar sometimes, so...
Pronunciation: Agree with Antimoon. You had better study pronunciation unless you have a really good ear. In English and French it's vital to get a grip on spelling and pronunciation.
Sorry, look on Youtube for "Great Escape 1963".
Myth #1: "The best way to learn a foreign language is to go to a foreign country"
If you're a legend you might manage, but for 96.699% it is definitely the best way.
Myth #2: "The best way to learn a foreign language is to speak it"
Maybe, but good writing is not gained by speaking well.
Myth #3: "It is OK to make mistakes"
It is ok, but it's better not to, although to make no mistakes at all is unrealistic - languages are about communication, for a non-advanced speaker at least, not impeccable grammar.
Myth #4: "As a beginner, you're bound to make a lot of mistakes"
You are bound to, there's no way aruond it.
Myth #5: "You are a foreigner, therefore you will always have a foreign accent"
Most people will always have an accent, to expect otherwise is like expecting every child football player to end up in the champions' league.
Myth #6: "If you didn't learn a foreign language as a child, you will never be fully proficient in its grammar"
I agree with this. Children often ingrain their own mistakes, an adult has a more objective perspective from which to learn grammar properply.
Myth #7: "Studying pronunciation is not important"
Depends on your goals. As long as your accent is easily understandable it's not an issue.
Myth 1: "The best way to learn a foreign language is to go to a foreign country"
Yes, it's the best way: you're surrounded linguistically and culturally. Exposure to the language is ideal
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Myth #2: "The best way to learn a foreign language is to speak it"
And read, listen and write. All 4 skills are important.
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Myth #3: "It is OK to make mistakes"
yes, it's OK and normal. They only matter when they prevent communication.
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Myth #4: "As a beginner, you're bound to make a lot of mistakes"
Yes, especially if it's your first foreign language or an unrelated language (to your L1)
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Myth #5: "You are a foreigner, therefore you will always have a foreign accent"
Probably true, but so what? Accents can be charming, certainly nothing to be ashamed of.
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Myth #6: "If you didn't learn a foreign language as a child, you will never be fully proficient in its grammar"
Learning as a child under 12 does make a difference, but as an adult you CAN be proficient in its grammar. This one really IS a myth.
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Myth #7: "Studying pronunciation is not important"
Pronunciation is important because unless it's reasonably accurate you won't be understood and being understood is generally the reason behind speaking. You also need to understand the others when they speak.
HOWEVER you might not have to "study" the pronunciation if you've got a good ear and can tune in naturally.You might simply acquire it well enough as you learn/listen.
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MYTHS #8-12
ALL METHODS WORK FOR EVERYONE
EVERYONE SHOULD LEARN AS YOU DID
EVERYONE IS EQUALLY CAPABLE/TALENTED/ABLE
YOUR MOTHER TONGUE IS IRRELEVANT
YOU HAVE TO SPEAK/WRITE PERFECTLY
Very interesting comments. These myths are interesting too.
All methods work for everyone: Definitely a myth
Everyone should learn as you did: I hope not! Must be a myth.
Everyone is equally capable/talented/able: Sadly, this is a myth.
Your mother tongue is irrelevant-Very interesting (worth a thread)
You have to speak/write perfectly-Usually a myth unless you work for a lawyer...
I thought it would be a thread about the studying method. Anyway...
I think... people have different opinions AND different focuses on the same topic. Antimoon says #1 is a myth because you can do pronunciation drills at home, even without the help of real people. While I often think it's a bit fake to do pronunciation...when it's unusual to meet a "foreigner", it's ok to learn a language for whatever reason without meeting foreigners at all. I think ordinary people LIKE to go to a foreign country to practice a language just because they want to have social exposure. Antimoon guys might have put it as a myth when they focused on the practical (learning) value of it.
English could be a special case (at least here in Hong Kong), when I can actually see a lot of foreign faces in places like Central, but I don't normally talk to a complete stranger - and I think I may even be more reserved than an Anglophone gentleman (as some of your Anglophone brothers say - they are reserved).
It's thinkable to practice another foreign language with some expats here, but the chance is literally "slim", but practically "zero". So, you can see I'm considering #1 from a social perspective. I have a constant lack of motivation to learn English, exactly because I can't use it very often.
The chronic curse for an average Chan here is: there have been some stereotypical views about himself being an Asian guy, who "doesn't normally date a white girl, while the reserve is so commonplace everywhere, like in his city" (Now, some of you westerners say: that's simple. I don't want to be over-generalizing, but I think there have been much more foreign GUYS than girls in China. In my own view, China includes my city as well)
Even if he doesn't believe it, stereotypes do survive as social norms. Even if you are a staunch supporter anti-racism and many many other PC ideas... you can't change what many people think. So now, even if you just want to go out and try to seek foreigners... I can find nobody. University should be the best place to meet foreigners of my age and sharing some of my interests (as young people), but... just becoz I don't have the money to live in a dorm, I only got to know *one* Anglophone guy, but practically I don't talk to him very often. None of us is being cold, but it's just .... at least for me, sometimes it sounds pointless to know a foreigner who won't be staying very long (and more so when he doesn't want to learn my language). If he does, it's alright for him to make a million of mistakes. At least I can see him try to do so - though he never does, and all that he can do now is to swear in my language.
I'm still not used to how foreign girls look - well, there must be someone who I may love, right? But in real terms I just have no way of meeting any of them (at the moment). I'm not the kind of person who is staunchly loyal to his blood. My significant other could be someone not Chinese, but then the question is quite irrelevant (atm). As long as I can't meet a foreigner (or even a Chinese from elsewhere who speaks Mandarin) almost every day, I'd just remain monolingual, and my own langauge collection would only be better than nothing.
As some people may say, there's a price of learning a language that hard. In my analogy... it's like saying: at least for some Chinese guys, the time spent on learning English, just to chase an Anglophone girl (and, to be exact, not Chinese), is better spent on chasing fellow Chinese girls. Yeah, "educated, polite, knowledgeable" people normally say either choice is OK and up to you, but we all know how much effort you need to start a relationship with a person who speaks a different native language.
But having that said, like others, I'd treasure any chance of traveling in a foreign country, since it's so RARE. Kato Lomb says foreign stones can't talk, but practically EVERYBODY in an Anglophone country can speak English (somehow)... at least this experience is good to brag about.
So now, about the antimoon studying method...
I'm trying it now. I don't have time to review, but now I can see the method makes sense. I want to speak well. I want to comprehend what you guys say on TV. I have very little time, but at least it sounds great to memorize countless vocab items by an SRS. And I'm recommending it to some of my friends.
But if I can stay with an Anglophone all the time... then doing SRS might not be as helpful.
Well, your English is improving, Xie, if that's any consolation.
You have to move overseas or out of your comfort zone if you want to be multilingual. It "ain't" comfortable to do. You could try an English-speaking church perhaps or a social group. I'm sure HK has changed since I was there. You could go to an Indian restaurant and speak in English there perhaps.
You have to make use of most opportunities, without being a pest-if possible, to learn your target language.
I talked to a young lady a couple of nights ago. She was in HK and she didn't learn much Cantonese. I think she is starting to understand how I learn languages, the mercenary way of chatting with people with whom you do not intend to have a deep friendship.
It's not possible to be close friends with everyone, and I don't think that everyone expects this.
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