ESL speakers speaking English in their accents...

enraged beyond all measur   Wed Mar 25, 2009 8:46 pm GMT
I paid $500 for a university course on CHEMISTRY (ie unrelated to language) and yet the lecturer couldn't handle English and I understood shit all. I was infuriated at this waste of money and I complained to the university authorities and they are speaking with her now. Hopefully they will have her replaced and even more hopefully she will be fired and never allowed back on the campus in her life. Such atrocities should not be allowed! You need English to be a lecturer, get it! All you non-natives out there who want to come teach in English speaking countries, keep this in mind and work on your English!
Blanc le Blanc   Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:14 pm GMT
As a non-native speaker, I whole-heartedly agree with 'very very furious'. But I also think that the people who select a non-native person with weak command of English needs to share the blame, in the above example, the university which selected the Chemistry professor.

As to the original question, of course ANYONE who is serious about learning a foreign language also tries to imitate the pronunciation/accent. Some find it reasonably easy, some difficult, and some impossible. Thats just the way it is.
ninnie   Fri Mar 27, 2009 11:43 pm GMT
I am an ESL teacher. I teach English to students whose native language is Spanish. In order to become an ESL teacher I had to take A LOT of courses related to how we learn a second language and how the brain plays an important role in this. According to research, when a person learns a second language after the age of 8, the brain does not help this person to speak the second language with a native-like accent. But it's not the person's fault. It's not that they're not trying hard enough. This has to do with the functions of the brain. Now, if a child learns a second language, he/she will acquire the language and speak it fluently and native-like because the brain is still "flexible". This is why adults learning English in the United States might learn how to speak it but will not sound native-like. The brain has already matured.
livid with rage   Sat Mar 28, 2009 2:30 am GMT
<<This has to do with the functions of the brain. Now, if a child learns a second language, he/she will acquire the language and speak it fluently and native-like because the brain is still "flexible". This is why adults learning English in the United States might learn how to speak it but will not sound native-like. The brain has already matured. >>


Well, and is this a reason to give a job to someone who is impossible to understand? If their brain is insufficient then their brain is insufficient.

You wouldn't hire an engineer who can't read mathematical symbols (the language of engineering) just because their brain naturally isn't made for maths. So why would you hire a teacher who can't read English (the language of teaching in the country) just because their brain naturally isn't made for it?
I say this:   Sat Mar 28, 2009 8:32 pm GMT
Getting your pronunciation right is such a waste of time when you can communicate in written language.
Emeline   Sun Mar 29, 2009 12:23 am GMT
I totally understand the people who say that having a native-like accent is necessary. I'm myself aiming for a native-like accent in English, and have already been taken for an American (by Americans) a few times. I have no gift for languages whatsoever, and used to sound truly awful in English, and just decided to do something about it.
That said, you have to be prepared to put in the amount of hours. That's where the problem lies, really. And I honestly don't think that people who just want to communicate and be understood need to go that extra mile. Any understandable accent is okay, as long as it sounds not that far from native-like but not really native-like yet. I have several Anglophone friends who sound just a little English or American in my native language, but it isn't distracting because their pronunciation is really accurate.
One word of advice: talk SLOWLY. I didn't understand why I couldn't pass for a native speaker, at least some of the time, until a teacher told me to slow down. I then noticed that my consonants and vowels were perfectly fine but that I needed to work on my rhythm, that is, my speed also. I also often get "some of you words sound native, but the rest doesn't, but you're close". Well, that is good enough for most people.
Some Southerners speak ridiculously slowly, and yet, they are educated native speakers of English. Why not take it slow? I'm one of those people who think that rushing through a sentence is way better than taking my time, but I've got to be wrong. You can always speed up later.
Anyway, that was my two cents, peace out.
y   Sun Mar 29, 2009 1:43 am GMT
How much difference is there in the accent of British people vs. Americans while speaking you language?
T   Mon Mar 30, 2009 3:06 am GMT
First of all, there's a huge difference between learning to speak clear, understandable English and learning to speak like a native. Provided you have the grammar, the former is relatively easy to accomplish - you can learn the phonetic system in a few months of study (under a qualified instructor). I have had numerous non-native teachers who were perfectly intelligible and easy to follow despite their accent. There is simply no excuse for being difficult to understand if you're going to be teaching in English.

Yes, learning to speak like a native is really, really difficult. I don't buy the "it's impossible" part, however, because I'm getting there. People assume I'm American over the phone all the time, and sometimes also in person (or else they assume I'm a Brit trying to speak with an American accent). A while ago I posted a longish speech sample on antimoon and no one caught on to the fact that I was foreign. But it took me 1.5 years of weekly classes with a top teacher to get where I am.

It's not that after a certain age you can't learn native-sounding accents. It's that after a certain age it's no longer handed to you on a platter. You have to work very, very hard at it. I wish people would stop spreading the "it's impossible" message, because that just discourages students from trying. The brain is a lot more plastic than we give it credit for.