English >> GErman

blanchette   Mon Sep 07, 2009 2:20 pm GMT
Which language is more difficult between German and English taking into account grammar, vocabulary, pronunciation, spelling, syntax. I know, most people think German is much harder than English but I'm not that sure, probably it is only a cliché, like most statements on this forum, who knows??! Personally, I have been learning both languages and in my opinion German is more logical and in addition the extreme simplicity of English morphology makes its syntax unpredictable.
guessed   Mon Sep 07, 2009 4:20 pm GMT
As an E1Ler, perhaps I'm biased, but clearly German is vastly more difficult (except perhaps in spelling).

However, I do recall someone from China, telling me how much more difficult German was, compared to English.
koala   Mon Sep 07, 2009 6:18 pm GMT
Advanced English is rather difficult
bécs   Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:25 am GMT
Of course, English is harder than German! English Spelling and pronunciation are light years harder than the German ones. the only difficult aspect in German is morphology but English Syntax isn't simple at all, particularly at an advanced level.
sss   Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:54 pm GMT
English
namuhbus   Thu Sep 10, 2009 3:01 am GMT
<<Advanced English is rather difficult >>

Aren't all lagugages quite difficult at the advanced level. How much effort would it be for someone from China to study German enough to pass for a native of Germany?
gesundheit   Mon Sep 14, 2009 12:08 am GMT
They're both difficult, but for different reasons. German grammar is complicated with the three definite articles and the need to change them based on the case and such. Word order at times is confusing as well. There is also of course like other languages the formal and informal speech which each have to be learned as well. Pronunciation can also be a bit hard until the rules are learned, but the language itself is a phonetic language, so its spelled and pronounced exactly as it sounds and looks.

English grammar in some ways is easier. No definite articles to worry about, no formal/informal forms of speech depending on who you're talking to, etc., but once you get farther into it, english is hard too. One thing that does make english hard for foreigners though is to gain the nuance of the language.

But someone can become very proficient in either language in just ten months living in a country that speaks the language, so in comparison to other languages, they're considerably easy.
Angus McBrinn   Mon Sep 14, 2009 2:16 am GMT
<<One thing that does make english hard for foreigners though is to gain the nuance of the language.>>

Surely, German also has nuances, that can never be learned without decades of total immersion?
--   Mon Sep 14, 2009 12:03 pm GMT
<< German grammar is complicated with the three definite articles and the need to change them based on the case and such. >>

We also have indefinite articles with ''the need to change them based on the case''!

<< Word order at times is confusing as well. >>

Really?

<< There is also of course like other languages the formal and informal speech which each have to be learned as well. >>

If you're a foreigner, regardless in which country, you should stick to formal speech.

<< Pronunciation can also be a bit hard until the rules are learned, but the language itself is a phonetic language, so its spelled and pronounced exactly as it sounds and looks. >>

I''ve already heard other opinions. Standard German pronunciation is much closer to the ''orthography'' than say Englisch pronunciation, but claiming ''so its spelled and pronounced exactly as it sounds and looks''
is surely wrong. Due to the ''Rechtschreibreform'', there are many composit words -- especially verbs -- arbitrarily torn apart, so that they are pronunced differently than written. Even a native speaker has to use a dictionary if he wants to write them correctly according the reform, and theses dictionary were changed several times after 1996. Another issue is the omission of commata due to the reform, which sometimes leads to the sentence being unintelligible, even for a native speaker.

<< English grammar in some ways is easier. No definite articles to worry about, no formal/informal forms of speech depending on who you're talking to, etc., but once you get farther into it, english is hard too.>>

English has a definite article, too, and for non-native speakers coming form languages without articles at all, it is very difficult to use it correctly.
There's also formal/informal speech in English, see the discussion about the use of ''sir'' and ma'am''.
Lhhlanguage   Mon Sep 14, 2009 1:01 pm GMT
"If you're a foreigner, regardless in which country, you should stick to formal speech."

I disagree with that. If the situation is reasonably formal (for example, meeting someone on the street for the first time, or attending a formal party or meeting) then yes, it's better to be formal. But if you're in a situation where virtually everybody uses the informal, then being formal can sound dorky, snobbish, or like you're walking on eggshells. I don't think you should automatically use formal speech just because you're a foreigner. Instead, you should look at the formality of the situation, and what others around you are doing, and adjust your speech accordingly.
--   Mon Sep 14, 2009 1:23 pm GMT
If your command of that foreign language is good enought, you should adjust to the situation, but otherwise, it's better to stick to formal speech.
Helena   Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:13 pm GMT
Sticking to formal speech will certainly make you sound foreign:


''It is we.
Whom shall I invite?
She is better than I.''

Most people would laugh at you
LOL
to Helena   Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:30 am GMT
Yeah, if you live they live in a village or a ghetto!

You have no idea how fancy rich New York is.
--   Tue Sep 15, 2009 8:40 am GMT
If I'm foreign, why not sound foreign? It's only natural. I don't want to pretend I'm a native!
fraz   Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:53 am GMT
Exactly. When I'm Germany, I'm sure my speech patterns instantly identify me as a foreigner but I couldn't care less to be honest. If I can understand people and they can understand me then that's all I'm interested in.