What is your favorite EU Country, Culture and Language

traveler   Tue Dec 29, 2009 1:44 am GMT
Question for Americans: (considering the strong European anti-Americanism)

What is your favorite EU Country, Culture and Language?

This question is for Americans only, because they are the ones that are the most ridiculed, bashed and looked down, while traveling in Europe. Despite that please try to be objective and pin down a country that has the highest cultural impact on you.
Provo   Tue Dec 29, 2009 2:38 am GMT
Spain
K. T.   Tue Dec 29, 2009 3:22 am GMT
I think my fav. country in Europe is probably Switzerland, but it's not an EU country. It has several languages that I enjoy, it's clean, and the people work hard.
Damian in Edinburgh   Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:24 pm GMT
I think it would have been better to say Europe, rather than the EU.....some really attractive European countries are outside the EU (at present)......Norway and Switzerland immediately spring to mind - both of them being quite content in their political "isolation" - one on the extreme north west periphery of Continental Europe, and the other slap bang in the very centre of it. Both countries are extremely prosperous - Norway officially being declared as the country with the highest standard of living, the best quality of life all round, and the highest longevity rates - in the entire world.

Switzerland is about as well ordered a country as it's possible to be - everything more or less runs like clockwork, the trains are as well timed as the cuckoo clocks, the banks are havens of cast iron security and secrecy for dosh (either legitimate or ill gotten gains) from all over the world. You can eat your dinner off the pavements, and, as in Germany, everybody, but everybody, waits patiently at the pedestrian crossings for the green lights to show before stepping forward off the pavement even if there is absolutely no traffic approaching from either direction. The Swiss are often mistaken for robots...but nice, very polite and friendly ones though...and very, very dependable..... it's not by any kind of accident that the Holy Father in the Vatican City chose the Swiss to be his bodyguards.

My own favourite European (not just EU!) country? That IS a difficult one to chew over.....I like them all, to be honest with you....I am such a Europhile it's beyond belief....I am so, so proud of my little red pasport bearing the words "European Community".

Cukltures vary widely across Europe, as do lifestyles. Lifestyles.....a great difference there, especially from north to south - east and west are gradually getting closer and closer to each other now, politically and ecomically, and that is a very good thing...but certain factors have a big part to play in the lifestyle differences, and differences in attitude, between Northern and Souther Europe. The most obvious factor is climate, of course.....at this time of the year we in the North are shrouded in darkness for a large part of the day - for about fifteen hours up here in Scotland, plus the cold and the fog and the frost and the rain and the snow the ice and the dampness....all that can have an effect on the lifestyles and the mindsets of the people.

On the other hand...down in Southern Europe.....down there all along the warmer, sunnier shores of the Mediterranean...Europe's great watery boundary in the south......there is definitely a Mediterranean mentality, a far more relaxed and laid back attitude to life generally, seemingly without the hassles and anxieties and stresses of our more northern countries, where things have to be done and dusted soonest - preferably by yesterday morning at the latest, whereas down in sunbaked, laid back Portugal, Spain, the South of France, Italy, Greece, Malta, Cyprus and all the other European islands of the Med - good old "manana" will do.....two hour lunches are the norm, followed by a siesta, and any business meetings can wait until later....the paella and the pasta and the chianti and the ouzo and the medoc and the sangria are much too good to rush.

That is one thing Brits find a bit difficult to emulate during their first year or so of expat existence in the Southern European countries.....and a bit difficult to come to terms with, especially when they hope to get the locals (builders, solicitors, lawyers, officialdom at large) to complete all tasks on time, or to even get started in the first place, or to get things done before the cows come home. But who can blame our Southern European compatriots?.All that sunshine under deep blue Mediterranean skies, the scent of oleander and orange blossom in the gentle breezes.........it's hardly conducive to frantic activity and rigid timetable keeping is it?

Relaxed, casual dining out en famille on long tables placed under the shade of olive trees is a sign of absolute civilised living. Family bonds are so much stronger down there than they are up here and it shows.

So that's it for me......Portugal, Spain, Southern France, Italy, Greece.....
Jasper   Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:28 pm GMT
"and a bit difficult to come to terms with, especially when they hope to get the locals (builders, solicitors, lawyers, officialdom at large) to complete all tasks on time, or to even get started in the first place, or to get things done before the cows come home."

Damian, that's the reason I could never be happy in a Latin country. They're absolutely never on time for anything. Besides this, they have a lax attitude towards law enforcement.

Anyway: my vote? Sweden.
blanc   Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:36 pm GMT
thats a stereotype from 1960s. Quality of life is ten times better in south Europe. That's why you have 20 million northern europeans living in South European countries (including 5 million Brits)
Damian in Edinburgh   Wed Dec 30, 2009 12:50 am GMT
Jasper....Sweden? It's even darker and colder than Scotland at this time of the year! And it's a balmy -28C in most of Sverige right now...but at least Sweden is a sort of "half way paradise" between benign socialism (paid for out of exorbitant taxes) and the far more "heartless" (to use your words) form of extreme capitalism over in America which you appear to deplore so much, and understandably so.

But think on a we bit now, Jasper.....according to our news reports over here in the UK your President is about to put all that to rights now, especially over the matter of universal Healthcare for ALL Americans - assuming he overcomes all the hurdles that may, just may, stop him dead in his tracts., which somehow I don't think will happen.

Once you DO get a Swedish style/European style/British style Healthcare system in America, accessible to all (deserving) Americans at point of need at all times without any more nightmares over cost and possible bankruptcies and all that kind of thing we read about over here, just make sure it never becomes bogged down with bureaucracy or, more importantly, make bloody sure it isn't ever abused by people who do NOT deserve to be treated free of charge on a regular basis, as it is here in the UK as I have said before. I'm speaking of drunks and drug addicts now, as you may well have guessed.....people who SHOULD be made to pay at point of issue for all treatment of injuries inflicted on themselves by their own irresponsible behaviour, even though the British Health Service was designed to be used by all in need, irrespective of circumstance.

I think it's time for a change on that one. Why should I pay for a pisshead drunkard to be patched up and put together again after a "good" night out on the sauce? Grrrrr......

Guid nicht fae Scotland.
Charles   Wed Dec 30, 2009 1:37 am GMT
Damian in Edinburgh, your post about European countries is a catalogue of the stereotypes to be found in any travel brochure.
Damian in Edinburgh   Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:27 am GMT
***Quality of life is ten times better in south Europe. That's why you have 20 million northern europeans living in South European countries (including 5 million Brits)***

Exactly so - Southern Europe.....the sun is brighter and warmer and it shines far more frequently from skies that are a deeper blue than they are up here in Northern Europe.....and this makes Southern European climates more reliable than ours up here in the North of Europe.....and climates definitely have a pronounced effect of human behaviour and attitudes, and in turn this affects lifestyles and Southern European lifestyles are generally more relaxed, more laid back and in turn this can produce a mindset of "why rush to do something today if it can still be done tomorrow as this makes life so much easier and more pleasant".......with constant fine weather there can be better things to do....

That is the main reason so many of our Northern European peoples seek this sort of "dolce vita" in those Mediterranean lands, especially once the reach the age of free bus passes and pensions. I belive that these people are called "snowbirds" over in America, and here in Europe this can particularly apply to Scandinavians...less so for the British, although it could be applicable as far as the present winter is concerned.

Stereotypes do exist for a reason sometimes, and to be honest I think the stereotypical "Latin" lifestyle is not exactly a guide book fairy tale. All those people enjoying themselves with a glass of vino along with the local dish of the day in a casual, relaxed manner in all those open air cafes and bars in sunny and warm Barcelona or Monte Carlo or Portofino or Athens or even in some remote village way up in the Italian Appennines or in some Spanish sierra are all part of that very same lifestyle so sterotypical of Southern Europe.

I was right on the southern shores of the Mediterranean Sea, on the coast of Libya, in late November...yes, late November.......and on one day in particular, when we were exploring the ancient site of Sabathra, the sky was about the bluest I have ever seen it, there was not a cloud in sight,it was a very pleasant +25C and there was hardly a hint of a breeze as we watched the tiny waves lapping against the remains of an ancient Roman port, and the Med looked as if it had been deliberately dyed a deep blue colour. Quite idyllic.

I can assure you that in late November, and quite often at most other times of the year, the North Sea, which I can see from the hilltop close to my parental home here in Scotland, is much more of a muddy grey colour, even when the sun dares to shine.

Southern Europeans have a much better chance to enjoy relaxed outdoor pursuits than we do up here...and that is bound to affect lifestyles.

Here endeth the second lesson......or is it the third? Who cares - let it all wash over you....there is always tomorrow......
Damian in Edinburgh   Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:47 am GMT
And before anyone hauls me over the coals....I do know that Libya is not in Europe.....it's in Africa....but it's still very much a Mediterranean country, at least as far as the coastal strip is concerned...it is a vast country and mostly consisting of barren desert.
blanc   Wed Dec 30, 2009 10:48 am GMT
Damian,

Your vision of southern Europe seems very "cliché"... even if many aspects your are talking about might find some reality; you give, in my opinion the idealised stereotipical vision of mediterranean Europe than many northern Europeans have (that seems base on a vision of costal areas in summertime mainly) which seems closer to a dream than to the reality.


Of course the south of Europe generally has sunnier weather than Northern Europe (especially the cloudy British isles); but is not the tropics, neither it is always sunny or warm.

Mediterranean climate means dry and hot summers, but also wet and cool winters. The mediterranean climate generally concerns costal areas...
As soon as you leave the coasts the climate can be harsh in all southern Europe (more continental climate, mountainous cold influences, southern Europe is full of cold/cool plateaus and mountains: Alps, Pyrennes, Apenins, Massif central, Castillan Plateaus, Cantabric sierra, guadarama sierra, etc. ). The winters in central Spain are far to be that pleasant: Madrid, Salamanca, Burgos, Toledo, etc. can have much colder temperatures than in London in winter, especially in the night. (Madrid's motto says "three months of Hell; nine mounts of winter" (tres meses de infierno, nueve meses de invierno))

In many parts of Spain, (but also of France), the wet Atlantic coasts in winter have often a warmer oceanic climate than the inland areas; sometimes even warmer than in the mediterranean costal areas: that was the case yesterday; in Tours, (Loire valley, North-west France, where I live) we had 15°C with a very wet weather; while in Nice it was only 12°C.
In the same time, in Castilla-y-Leon the temps were between 8°C and 10°C only (they are usually much lower in this time of year in north-central Spain). Well, on only real warm areas in winter are some parts of Andalucian coasts were the temp is about 20°C.

http://cjoint.com/data/mElDMj5IWz.htm

You and northern Europeans in general makes me laugh when speaking about stereotyping southern European climatic conditions... many people in Northern Europe seem not being able to understand that winter does exist in southern Europe; and it is not always the "constant fine weather"...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15ZiCgexT6M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBXkmodV6f8
It's so funny! It is like those people on these videos expected that Spain would be hot as Mexico or Colombia in winter! Maybe they confuse southern European climate with the tropical Caribean one?


(the last "blanc" was not me)
til   Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:34 am GMT
The UK actually has no real winter, also. The Brits don't know how snow looks like.
Uriel   Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:48 am GMT
I've been to a number of countries in Europe, but it never occurred to me to pick a favorite, per se; they are all different, and I have enjoyed or dislike various aspects of each. But they aren't like people for me, where I might warm to one more than another. Maybe I just haven't found one that really jibes with me yet! I know I liked Europe more than I liked Japan or Korea, but that's probably due to the fact that American culture is essentially European in nature, and has less in common with Asian cultures.

As for languages, that's a really hard thing (for me) to express a preference for. If you don't understand them, they are all equally gibberish to you. If you really like a particular sound you hear, maybe you can say that you like one over the other, but really, they are all just alien noises. If you do understand a foreign language, you probably don't "hear" it as much, especially if you are focused on translating the meaning as you listen. Your enjoyment may come more from a sense of accomplishment in decoding it, at that point.
blanc   Wed Dec 30, 2009 12:18 pm GMT
"....I am such a Europhile it's beyond belief....I am so, so proud of my little red pasport bearing the words "European Community".

You must be seen as an alien by your British compatriots!




" ...our more northern countries, where things have to be done and dusted soonest - preferably by yesterday morning at the latest, whereas down in sunbaked, laid back Portugal, Spain, the South of France, Italy, Greece, Malta, Cyprus and all the other European islands of the Med - good old "manana" will do.....two hour lunches are the norm, followed by a siesta, and any business meetings can wait until later....the paella and the pasta and the chianti and the ouzo and the medoc and the sangria are much too good to rush. "


Well you must know that the real difference is inside each country between big cities and "provincial" way of life. Most north-Europeans tourists come in summertime to relax in countryside of southern Europe, whatever it is Dordogne, Provence, Tuscany or Balearic islands. their vision might be quite distorted. Professional life in Madrid or Rome is as much stressing than in Berlin or London; and no one in Madrid has time to make siesta.

But it is true that we have different conceptions to work relations, tend to take much longer break-time to have a real meal for lunch. We more emphise on social relation in work contracting (generally with a good meal); We generally drink red wine as everyday beverage with our food, etc. But these behavious are not limited to southern France as you let think. I think it has to do with the historic impact of Catholicism and Roman inprint than just by having "warm" climate. (well, California or southern Australia have a mediterranean climate but I don't think the way of life, social life and working relations follow this "mediterranean way of life" we can observe in latin Europe.)



" But who can blame our Southern European compatriots?"

Well, your southern European compatriots still are British, even when they lhave moved to southern Europe. I don't want to criticize your compatriots but they often stay appart with their own culture, sometimes they don't even try to speak the language, which, obviously is really unrespectfull. I remember having seen at my parents village's bookstore in Var (Provence) a British woman making a scandal (in English) because she could'nt find her British papers in the store...



" All that sunshine under deep blue Mediterranean skies, the scent of oleander and orange blossom in the gentle breezes.........it's hardly conducive to frantic activity and rigid timetable keeping is it? "

That's really a huge and hardly realistic stereotype!



" Relaxed, casual dining out en famille on long tables placed under the shade of olive trees is a sign of absolute civilised living. "

well, there are other ways of being civilized...



" Family bonds are so much stronger down there than they are up here and it shows. "

This might be true (even it is much less true since the "modernization" of the 60's); but it has few to see with the climatic conditions; but more with a protestant-shaped society/catholic-shaped society opposition. Protestant cultures tend to be more individualistic than familial.




" So that's it for me......Portugal, Spain, Southern France, Italy, Greece..... "

It is strange that you said to Prefer London over Paris. Paris is 400km south of London, Paris is much more "urbanly" mediterranean (if not climatically): dense and compact city; terrasse/cafe culture; wine culture; etc.
Traveler   Wed Dec 30, 2009 2:57 pm GMT
<<This question is for Americans only, because they are the ones that are the most ridiculed, bashed and looked down, while traveling in Europe. Despite that please try to be objective and pin down a country that has the highest cultural impact on you. >>

I just got back from Europe.
I didn't feel any Anti-Americanism at all. None. Nada.

To the gainside, I noticed that people perked up and became happy when they realized I was American (and no, it wasn't only for my $$).

I don't have a favorite EU country. They are all quite nice.