Which language (besides En) has the most "second speake

George Graddol   Sun Feb 21, 2010 12:20 pm GMT
<< Nobody believes that French has more secondary speakers than English and Portuguese more than Spanish. That survey is completely fake. I have to see yet a country where people learn French more than English. >>

Stupid. George Weber's figure didn't include the English speakers of India, Egypt, and Sudan because of the higher position of Hindi and MSA over English.

<< Indeed, I stopped taking him seriously when he mentioned French have more secondary speakers. In entire Asia educated people learn English as a second language. How can French compete with only the Arab world and Africa?

Everyone in France is starting to learn English for fuck's sake! I remember very well when I was younger, French women always insisted to speak English to me when we flirted. >>

Here comes another puppet of the English speaking world.

Those who learn English in Asia such as China, Japan, Korea, etc. will not be secondary speakers, stupid but as an acquired tongue.

"In pedagogy, a distinction is often made between 'second language' and foreign language, the latter being learned for use in an area where that language is not generally/widely(not used officially or as a medium of instruction) spoken."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_language
<0   Sun Feb 21, 2010 12:29 pm GMT
So there's no point in learning Spanish?
Tovarich   Sun Feb 21, 2010 12:42 pm GMT
<< There is language switching going on in those places: they're switching from Russian to Ukranian/Kazakh/Kyrgyz. And Russian as a second language is being replaced by English. >>

ANALYSIS

The Russian language in Ukraine: a look at the numbers and trends

by Roman Solchanyk

Official Moscow is concerned about the fate of the Russian language in Ukraine.

At the end of January, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Russia handed a note to the Embassy of Ukraine in Moscow in which it expressed the hope that Kyiv would observe the terms of the bilateral treaty between the two countries when implementing its policies with regard to the Russian-speaking population in Ukraine. Among other things, the 1997 treaty obligates both sides to protect and promote the ethnic, cultural and linguistic features of national minorities in their respective countries.

Several days later, in a less diplomatic fashion, the Russian Foreign Affairs Ministry made public a statement that charged Ukraine with violating its own Constitution, which guarantees Russian and other languages of national minorities "free development, utilization and protection." This was followed by a ministry report made available to Interfax, which quoted the document as saying that "certain forces in Ukraine seem determined to create a phenomenon unseen in Europe before - to make the native language of the overwhelming majority of the population an outcast, reduce its status to marginal and possibly even squeeze it out."

And here is where the problems begin. To claim that Russian is the native language of the overwhelming majority of Ukraine's population is quite obviously nonsense. The last census, which was held in 1989, identified 32.8 percent of the total population as falling into this category. That figure, although over a decade old, has remained fairly stable. Public opinion polls conducted in 1994-1998 by the Institute of Sociology of the National Academy of Sciences in Kyiv show that the proportion of respondents who said that Russian was their native language ranged from 34.7 percent to 36.5 percent.

At the end of February, the Donetsk-based Slavic Party (formerly the Civic Congress of Ukraine) joined the fray, accusing the government of conducting its language policy on the basis of "Russophobia." The majority of Ukraine's population is Russian-speaking and 90 percent prefer to speak Russian, it insisted. Needless to say, the party did not find it necessary to specify how it arrived at its calculations.

Information coming from some government sources in Kyiv also raises questions. On February 12, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs responded to the criticism of its counterpart in Moscow with a statement that, among other things, said that 35 percent of students in Ukraine receive their higher education in Russian.

Several days later, Nina Karpachova, the human rights commissioner in the Ukrainian Parliament, issued her own statement, reporting the proportion of students taught in Russian as 57 percent. Ms. Karpachova was responding to her counterpart in Moscow, Oleg Mironov, who earlier had criticized Kyiv for imposing "forcible restrictions" on the use of the Russian language and urged international monitoring organizations to become more active in Ukraine.

The Ukrainian Foreign Affairs Ministry said that 1,195 newspapers are published in Russian, constituting 49.7 percent of the "overall number of Ukrainian periodical publications." It is not clear, however, whether these figures refer to Russian-language titles, single-issue print runs, or annual circulation, and whether periodicals also include journals.

The latest official data from the Ukrainian State Committee on Statistics, which is for the 1998-1999 school year, present the following picture:

* Primary and secondary education (general education schools): The proportion of pupils taught in Russian was 34 percent; the corresponding figure for instruction in Ukrainian was 65 percent. It should be noted, however, that the Ukrainian Foreign Affairs Ministry statement gives 31.7 percent as the proportion of pupils taught in Russian. In all likelihood, this is the figure for the current school year.

* Higher education: In universities, institutes and academies, 34 percent of students were taught in Russian; at the lower level of technicums or trade schools, which still qualify as institutions of higher learning, the corresponding figure was 28 percent.

* Pre-school: The figure for all pre-schoolers taught in Russian was 25.3 percent.

By comparison, in the 1991-1992 school year 50 percent of pupils were taught in Russian; 76.6 percent of academic groups received their higher education in Russian; and in 1991, 48.8 percent of pre-schoolers were taught in Russian.

This is at the national level. In those regions of Ukraine that are home to large numbers of Russians and Russian speakers, the situation looks rather different.

In Crimea 98.1 percent of schoolchildren were taught in Russian in 1998-1999; in the Donbas the corresponding figure was between 87 percent (Luhansk Oblast) and 90 percent (Donetsk Oblast); in Zaporizhia Oblast it was 62 percent; in Kharkiv Oblast 53 percent; and in Dnipropetrovsk Oblast 41 percent. In short, the Russian language continues to largely predominate in these regions, although here too the proportion of primary and secondary school children taught in Russian has dropped.

Clearly, the Russian language has lost considerable ground in the educational system since independence. But given the accusations emanating from Moscow and the complaints that are increasingly voiced by Russian rights activists in Ukraine, probably the most important issue that needs to be addressed is whether Kyiv's policies in the educational and other spheres is limiting the role, status and functioning of the Russian language for what might be termed the pool of would-be users. The answer to that question depends on how these users are defined.

If "native language" is used as a measuring stick, then the data for general education schools and universities more or less overlaps - although the trend has been for Russian-language instruction to decline with every year. But the "native language" is not a very precise term. For some this could mean the language they know best and use most often; for others, it could a language that they are not able to converse in freely but to which they feel emotionally tied. In short, the "native language" may not be the best indicator of the language situation in Ukraine.

Another way of looking at language affiliation is to determine its use in the family setting. The polls mentioned above reveal that in Ukraine between 32.4 percent and 34.5 percent converse exclusively in Russian; another 26.8 percent (1997) to 34.5 percent (1995) use either Russian or Ukrainian depending upon circumstances. Interestingly, these figures are largely in line with the data for "native language." (Maybe this last category is not such an unreliable indicator after all.)

There is, however, a third way of gauging language affiliation, which some analysts, both in Ukraine and in the West, claim is the most objective. This is the language of "preference" or "convenience," which is the language that respondents choose to use during public opinion surveys. According to one source, Russian is the language of convenience for about 55 percent of the population; another source gives the lower figure of 43 percent. In any case, these data are significantly out of line with what is happening in Ukraine's schools and universities. The question of whether the language of convenience is in fact the most objective criterion for determining the language situation is another matter.

But there is something strange in all of this. In a recent article in a Moscow newspaper, the president of the Kyiv-based Foundation for the Support of Russian Culture in Ukraine reported that between 1994 and 1999 the proportion of Ukrainians who chose Russian as their language of "convenience" increased from 43.5 percent to 50.9 percent. The question that arises is: If the Russian language in Ukraine is under threat, being "forcibly restricted," declining in prestige, losing its viability, and the like, why are increasingly more people in Ukraine finding it "convenient"?

Dr. Roman Solchanyk is an international security policy analyst in Santa Monica, Calif.

Copyright © The Ukrainian Weekly, March 5, 2000, No. 10, Vol. LXVIII

http://www.ukrweekly.com/old/archive/2000/100005.shtml

The Lithuanians, Latvians, and Estonians tried to learn English not Russian after they broke up form Soviet Union. They ended up reverting to Russian because they realized that there's no future for them with English. I fact they're the main reason why the percentage of Russian speakers in EU is 7%.
Tovarich   Sun Feb 21, 2010 12:49 pm GMT
06.11.08. Russkiy Mir Assembly Participants Discuss “Russian Language in International Communication”

As part of the Second Russkiy Mir Assembly a session “Russian Language in International Communication” was held. The speakers were Maksim Krongauz, director of the Institute of Linguistics at the Russian State University for the Humanities; Evgeny Yurkov, Deputy Secretary General of the International Association of Teachers of Russian Language and Literature, Dean of Special Department of Philology at the St. Petersburg State University and member of the board of trustees of the Russkiy Mir Foundation; Vera Stepanenko, Deputy Director of the Center for International Education at the Lomonosov Moscow State University; Eleonora Suleimenova, President of the Kazakhstan Association of Teachers of Russian Language and Literature, Dean of General Linguistics Department at the Al-Farabi Kazakh National University.

In his speech, Maksim Krongauz noted the absence of two important components regulating the functioning of a language. People lack normal grammar of the Russian language now (if not to consider complicated academic editions) and have no universally acknowledged dictionary of the modern Russian language, as various dictionaries that are currently issued may include different standards, Krongauz said. In addition, he noted, the young generation rarely uses traditional dictionaries and trusts more to searching systems and spell checking programs.

Krongauz expressed confidence that in the past decades people have started to perceive linguists as odious figures, whose activities’ products are of no real value for ordinary consumers. To change the situation, philologists must more actively use new technological possibilities. In particular, Krongauz believes, it is necessary to created a respected and constantly replenished online-dictionary of the Russian language. In addition, the grammar of the Russian language must also be available in the Internet, it should sensitively react to changes taking place in the language and reflect them.

Evgeny Yurkov in his report noted that since the collapse of the USSR, the functions of the Russian language have reduced and changed. However, Yurkov noted, some changes in this trends have appeared lately – more and more people started to learn Russian. Several years ago we could state that Western European and far foreign countries showed no interest in our language, whereas now the situation is different. Due to the economic growth in Russia and expansion of cooperation, citizens of Central Europe as well as our former compatriots living in the post-Soviet space, began to learn Russian. However, Yurkov emphasized that teaching of the Russian language should be complex. Even if a person studies Russian on pragmatic reasons, it is necessary to give him information on the culture and traditions of the Russian people, besides grammar and vocabulary. Only in this case this person will not forget the language when he does not need it in his work anymore. The representative of MAPRYAL stressed the special role Russian compatriots abroad play in supporting and spreading the Russian language in the countries they live. At the same time he noted the importance of Russian compatriots’ children communicating with age-mates in Russia. It is hence very important to organize various summer camps and schools in Russia aimed at solving this task.

Vera Stepanenko talked about her experience of work at the Center for International Education in the Moscow State University. In the past 20 years the methods of teaching Russian as a foreign language has been integrated into the world practice. New textbooks and methodical materials have been developed and issued, as well as a multimedia course “Time to Speak Russian” and a textbook for distant learning. At the same time Stepanenko noted the problems the Russian language has faced in the past several years. She spoke, particularly, about the changed status of Russian in the post-soviet space, where it is no longer a native language for many children, but can hardly be called a foreign language either. These changes require reaction from teachers and Russian language specialists, including preparing of new methods of teaching Russian in these countries. Besides, all training materials are still oriented at the classic Russian language which went out of use long ago. Stepanenko said that it is necessary to work out textbooks that would reflect the modern living Russian language. In conclusion, she once again called the present for consolidation and cooperation.

Professor of the Russian Peoples’ Friendship University, Uldanay Bakhtikareeva focused on the unique characteristic of the Russian language as a uniting language. She said that Russian is the only language in the world that unites 75 cultures. Bakhtikareeva noted that this is the number of cultures which express their art images in Russian. Even Latin can not be compared with Russian in this quantity. At the same time she said that Russian can remain great and mighty language only when not only Russians but other peoples of the world speak it.

Eleonora Suleimenova reported on the state of the Russian language in Kazakhstan. Suleimenova noted that the language climate in the country is quite favorable. 26% of citizens are Russians, most schools are Russian-language, and 96% of the Kazakshtanis speak Russian. The Russian language is also present in education, and no one is going to change the situation, periodical print editions are issued in Russian, as well as television and radio stations broadcast in Russian. Suleimenova said that the language policy in the country is directed at supporting and promoting Russian. And this is one of the important examples how the Russian language does not contradict to state building but in a certain measure contribute to strengthening the society’s unity.

Concluding the discussion, participants of the roundtable noted the necessity of further exchanging experience and attentive learning of the modern state of the Russian language in Russia and abroad.

http://russkiymir.org/en/events/index.php?id4=5542