Another Proof that Spanish Speaking World is Shrinking

-Sp-   Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:05 am GMT
“You do have a Spanish school system but it’s not mandatory. So for most families, it made no sense to send their kids to school. Why go to school and learn Spanish when really they want their kids to be working on the ranch and helping fish, helping farm?

"For some families, especially if you were living in Hagana, and families who were connected to the Spanish government, they wanted their children to have a Spanish education, and learn the language. But for the majority, it didn’t really make any sense.

"The other school system was the Sunday School, which was taught in Chamorro because the Jesuits learned early on that they had to work in Chamorro if they wanted really true conversion, and that was the school system that most people went to. It was just once a week and it was in Chamorro."

“One thing about Guam that’s different from other areas where the Spaniards went, it’s one place where the Spanish language never thrived. Partly it’s because we never had a big Spanish population. Even the Spanish themselves admitted that the Spanish language fluency was minimal.

"When the Spanish departed and the U.S. Navy took over and reported on the status of the island’s population, they estimated that 20% of the island’s inhabitants could speak Spanish, which if you think about it, after 200 years of colonial rule, didn’t seem very good. That’s not a very strong number."

http://www.pacificworlds.com/guam/visitors/colony.cfm

Spanish language in Philippines

Although English is the official language of Philippines, Spanish is still perceived as an important historical and cultural knowledge and is considered the language of the elite, more than English.

The language in fact is maintained by mestizo families and by educated youth, especially in the province of Cebu, Zamboanga and Bacolod. This is because of the historical roots Spanish has left in the Filipino culture all long the colonial era, from 1565 when the Spanish lnguage was first introduced, till the early 20th century when bagan the American hegemony. In 1990 there were around 2,658 Spanish speakers in the country. This number doesn’t consider however the 300,000 creoles that speak Chavacano, one of the 170 Philippine languages that most sounds like Spanish. Actually there are thousands of Spanish loanwords in the Filipino languages and because of the traditional base and the similarities shared by these languages, Spanish is admitted in written legal documents and courts of law. Additionaly nowadays, a great demand in call center industries has made the interest for the Spanish language growing.

http://www.spanish-in-the-world.net/Spanish/philippines.php
latino   Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:13 am GMT
Es tu opinión.
Hace 10 años te hubiera parecido inimaginable a tí tener que escribir este texto, dentro de otros 10 años me lo cuentas....(pero en español o chino).

! mira lo que me preocupa tu texto!
latino   Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:53 am GMT
Querido Froggy,

Deberias estar mas preocupado de los paises ex-francofonos como Vietnam, Laos, Kampuchea donde casi nadie habla frances.

También deberias preocuparte de Marruecos, Argelia, Tunez, Mauritania, Libano, Djibouti, Comores y Tchad en donde el arabe es ya la lengua internacional y no el frances.

Deberias preocuparte de Camerun, Canada, Rwanda, Burundi, Seychelles, Mauritius en donde la lengua internacional es ya el ingles.

Deberias preocuparte de Guinea Ecuatorial, Sahara Occidental, Andorra y Haiti en donde la lengua internacional es ya el español.


¿Quieres una prueba de que el francés se hunde?

El frances es una lengua MINORITARIA en los paises francofonos, donde no lo habla mas que un 5% de la poblacion.

Solo se habla por la mayoria de la poblacion en Francia.
latinois   Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:01 pm GMT
Cher Fly,
L'espagnol est une langue en danger les pays hispaniques, où il est divergentes du castillan. Seulement 5% de la population parle le castillan ou le bon espagnol.

Seulement en Castille, où la majorité parle espagnol bon.

Tu dois inquiéte plus sur les pays de l'ex-langue espagnol tels que les Philippines et le Vietnam, où personne ne parle espagnol.

Tu dois inquiéte aussi à propos du Pérou, la Bolivie, le Paraguay et le Guatemala, où les langues amérindiennes sont maintenant la langue maternelle, et non pas l'espagnol.

Tu dois inquiéte au sujet du Mexique, Amérique centrale, Puerto Rico, République Dominicaine, Venezuela, Colombie, Argentine, où la langue internationale est l'anglais.

Tu dois inquiéte soucier de la Guinée équatoriale, le Sahara occidental, en République dominicaine, et Andorre, où la langue internationale espagnole.
latinois   Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:02 pm GMT
Cher Fly,
L'espagnol est une langue en danger les pays hispaniques, où il est divergentes du castillan. Seulement 5% de la population parle le castillan ou le bon espagnol.

Seulement en Castille, où la majorité parle espagnol bon.

Tu dois inquiéte plus sur les pays de l'ex-langue espagnol tels que les Philippines et le Vietnam, où personne ne parle espagnol.

Tu dois inquiéte aussi à propos du Pérou, la Bolivie, le Paraguay et le Guatemala, où les langues amérindiennes sont maintenant la langue maternelle, et non pas l'espagnol.

Tu dois inquiéte au sujet du Mexique, Amérique centrale, Puerto Rico, République Dominicaine, Venezuela, Colombie, Argentine, où la langue internationale est l'anglais.

Tu dois inquiéte soucier de la Guinée équatoriale, le Sahara occidental, en République dominicaine, et Andorre, où la langue internationale est le français
Frenchito   Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:41 pm GMT
EL INFORME FORD DE 1916
-----------------------------

Otra fuente reveladora de la extensión nacional en que se utilizaba el idioma español en Filipinas es el Informe de Henry Ford de 1916 al Presidente de Estados Unidos.

Aunque el Censo de 1903, preparado por el gobierno de ocupación usense, dió a entender que el idioma español "lo hablaría tan solamente el diez (10) porciento de los filipinos", el citado Informe de Ford nos lo desmiente con sus observaciones. Dice:
"Hay, sin embargo, otro aspecto en este caso que se debe considerar. Este aspecto se me presentó a mi mismo cuando yo iba viajando por las islas, usando la trasportación ordinaria y mezclándome con toda clase de gente de todas las condiciones. Aunque a base de estadísticas escolares se hace la declaración de que son más (numerosos) los filipinos que hablan inglés frente a cualquier otro lenguaje, nadie ha de estar de acuerdo con esta declaración si ha de depender del testimonio de lo que le llega al oído. "En todas partes el español es el idioma del negocio y del intercambio social."

"Para que cualquiera pueda conseguir una pronta atención de quienes sea, el español resulta ser más útil que el inglés. Y fuera de Manila, es casi indispensable. Los Americanos que viajan por todas las islas lo usan de costumbre." ." (The Ford Report of 1916. #3. The Use of English. Pages 365-366.Op.cit.)

PRENSA EN ESPAÑOL, NO EN INGLÉS

Como ya lo hemos señalado con las observaciones, en 1908, del Director de Educación, Mr. Barrows, la preponderancia del español seguía alarmando a los WASP usenses puesto que su agenda, de tiránicamente imponer el idioma inglés sobre el pueblo filipino, corría el peligro de fracasar. Bien seguros estaban de imponer el inglés en sólo diez años más a partir de 1916, año en que también se aprobó la supuesta ley Jones de independencia para Filipinas.

Pero, es el mismo Henry Ford, el que, en 1916, dió la segunda voz de alarma. Y la dio en los siguientes términos.

"Mientras tanto, el uso del español, en vez de disminuir ante la propagación del Inglés, parece expandirse por su propia cuenta. Este hecho ha merecido la atención oficial. El informe del Director de Educación para el año 1908 dice en su página 9 lo que sigue:
"El español continúa siendo la lengua más prominente e importante hablada en los círculos políticos, periodísticos y comerciales. El inglés tiene rivales activos como el lenguaje de intercambio y de instrucción. Es igualmente probable que ha ocurrido una disminución de interés por parte de la población adulta de aprender el idioma inglés. Creo que es un hecho el que mucha más gente ahora conoce más el idioma español que cuando los norteamericanos zarparon a estas islas y ocurrió su ocupación. La demanda general de los despachadores es que sepan el inglés y el español. A través del gran aumento en número y circulación de diarios y periódicos, hay mucha más lectura ahora en español que antes.

FORZANDO EL INGLÉS POR LEY

Sigue diciendo el Ford Report.
"El archivo sobre la acción oficial en cuanto al idioma demuestra una serie de pasos de rendición frente al continuado uso del español ante el stress, o el apuro, de la necesidad. La intención original fue imponer la rápida substitución del inglés.

"La ley No. 190 de la Comisión tenía provisto que el inglés debe imponerse como la lengua oficial de todos los tribunales y todos sus archivos después del 1 de enero de 1906. La ley No. 1427 extendió ese tiempo al 1 de enero de 1911.

"La Ley No. 1946 extendió ese tiempo a enero 1 de 1913. Por Orden Ejecutiva No. 44, fechada 8 de agosto de 1912, el requisito legal fue enmendado y terminó siendo nada más que una expresión de preferencia por el inglés. Este documento instructivo se incluye aquí (Anejo B).

"La imposibilidad de sustituir el español con el inglés en el proceso judicial y en los gobiernos provincial y municipal es de tal índole que aun queda la probabilidad de que aunque se declare oficial el idioma inglés el 1 de enero de 1913, el español ha de continuar usándose por conivencia oficial.

"Esta situación anormal fue terminada por una ley pasada el 11 de febrero de 1913. Esta ley tiene provisto que mientras el inglés es la lengua oficial, el español también será una lengua oficial hasta el 1 de enero de 1920. (Vea el Anejo C)"

"No existe ninguna perspectiva en el tiempo actual que nos indique que el español pueda ser descartado en 1920 o en otro año futuro ya que, por lo visto, su puesto como lengua oficial queda aseguradamente establecido." (Ford Report of 1916, #4. Increasing the use of Spanish, páginas 366 y 368; #5. Legislation as to Language. Páginas 368-369, Op. Cit.).
English   Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:51 pm GMT
Correction:

"More proof that the spanish-speaking world is shrinking."

Explanation:

-Proof is an uncountable noun

-the adjective "spanish-speaking" is hyphenated

-'world' should be accompanied by the definite article
Nostradamus   Thu Apr 29, 2010 6:45 pm GMT
Spanish language will be to english what greek was to latin one. A very little funny dialect from nowhere.
Eliot Spitzer is my bitch   Fri Apr 30, 2010 1:25 am GMT
Nostradamus, you're not well versed into Ancient History, are you? In the Ancient world, Latin was the lingua franca for administration and public affairs, but Greek was the language of culture (even in Rome) and the lingua franca in the Eastern parts of the Empire.
Ever wonder why the New Testament was written in Greek, not Latin?
Franco   Fri Apr 30, 2010 1:38 am GMT
There is only a language that has more prestige than Latin and it is Greek. If Humanity had to choose a single language among those that have existed, exist or will exist, it is Greek.
Homme Fatal   Sat May 01, 2010 1:13 am GMT
Correction:

<< "More proof that the spanish-speaking world is shrinking." >>

You mean "More proofs that the Spanish-speaking world is shrinking." but very awkward.

Explanation:

-More is a plural adjective.

- the adjective "Spanish-speaking". The demonym "Spanish" should be capitalized

- Whether "Another Proof that Spanish Speaking World is Shrinking" is preceded by definite article "the" or not, it's still correct. In Spanish it would be wrong if it there is no definite article.

BTW, it's so obvious that you come from Spanish country and it looks to me that your English is not Grammatically perfect.

Listen, you don't have a right to correct my English. Perfect your English first before you do that.
English   Sat May 01, 2010 1:29 am GMT
<<You mean "More proofs that the Spanish-speaking world is shrinking." but very awkward.>>

Wrong. Proof is an uncountable noun. If you don't know what that is, look it up.

<< Whether "Another Proof that Spanish Speaking World is Shrinking" is preceded by definite article "the" or not, it's still correct.>>

No it is not. The definite article is necessary in this sentence.
Homme Fatal   Sat May 01, 2010 2:31 am GMT
<< Wrong. Proof is an uncountable noun. If you don't know what that is, look it up. >>

The word "more" is used for countable nouns like "More and more people are switching to this brand".

The correct adjective for uncountable noun is much or few not more or some.

Oh common it's the same as "Another Evidence that......".

"Proof" is either countable/uncountable noun. The plural of it is "proofs" http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/proof.

Example: "You shall have many proofs to show your skill."
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/proof

And as a rule in English, countable nouns can be expressed in English in their plural form by just adding 's' at the end of them and it's obvious that "proof" falls into that category.

It maybe uncountable noun but notice it cannot be used as "A glass of water" or "A bottle of wine".

But in this case it's OK to for it to be preceded by "Another".

If you want to use "more" before it then it has to be "proofs".

<<No it is not. The definite article is necessary in this sentence.>>

Are you kidding? Even if there is no definite article in this case, it's still correct and that is allowed in English. But in Spanish, the definite article cannot be omitted.

Next time don't write demonym words like "Spanish" that begin in lower case letters in English. It's only allowed in Spanish unless if it's at the beginning of the sentence.

BTW, "proof" is also an adjective.

Just analyze the sentences below using "proof"

* The proof of the pudding will be in the eating.
* On your first visit, please bring proof of identity to allow the issue of a reader's ticket.
* Either take along a passport sized photograph with the application form and your proof of eligibility to any of the ' Registration Centers ' .
* Proof of residency, such as a gas, electricity or council tax bill.
* Please obtain proof of postage otherwise we cannot refund should an item not arrive.
* By law a software license or proof of purchase must be obtained for every item of software used.
* They also played a new version of ' Dark Clouds ' , which seems conclusive proof that they accept their past.
* Of course mathematical proofs do not have personal characters.
* You will have to take my word that there is convincing proof for what I'm about to say.
* The reference number and date issued is not definitive proof of exemption.
* Evidence of identity With every new application for benefit you must also provide documentary proof of your identity.
* The easy to apply 2 coat damp proof membrane, ARDEX DPM, was applied to the prepared concrete base.
* When I spoke to him this evening, he told me that six men wearing bullet proof vests had searched his house again today.
* The inner two were made of stout trees, lined with flax making them almost bullet proof.
* The skate park is made of high quality concrete which is hard wearing and Vandal proof.
* It is almost fool proof that someone can create a great speech from what you provide.
* A frost proof shelter measuring four feet x four feet is attached to the flight at the rear.
* Page Proofs All first or corresponding authors will receive galley proofs for checking.
* You can protect your tax disk with a tamper proof disk holder, available from the Post Office.

http://www.yourdictionary.com/examples/proof
English   Sat May 01, 2010 6:01 am GMT
When proof means "information that proves something" it is *always* an uncountable noun, so you cannot say "a proof" and much less "another proof". The correct usage is "more proof" - NOT pluralized. If you don't believe me, search "more proof" in google and you'll see thousands of headlines with this usage.

...and no, the definite article is not optional in that sentence; you absolutely have to say *the* Spanish-speaking world.

I'm not going to argue about it anymore seeing that you are stubbornly determined to continue writing/speaking broken English like a typical ignorant foreigner. So I'll leave you to it.
Commentator   Sat May 01, 2010 6:29 am GMT
Actually, using "a proof" like he did is a display of mastery of the English language. In mathematics, "a proof" is a logical argument which demonstrates irrefutably a hypothesis. So by using "a proof" instead of "more proof" he makes an allusion to a mathematical proof, implying that his proof is absolute, final and irrefutable. A good use of metaphor to add eloquence to his argument.