Celtic Languages

Jordan   Fri Jun 11, 2010 9:50 pm GMT
I find Celtic languages to be interesting because they're so different from Germanic & Romance languages; yet they stem from the same family.

What's your favorite Celtic language?

Mine's Irish.

The only thing is even though I'm 1/5 Irish and 1/10 Welsh; I don't think I would have enough motivation to learn them because they're not widely spoken anymore.

Cymru   Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:02 pm GMT
Cymraeg yw iaith y rhan fwyaf o uwch Celtaidd!
Ick   Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:19 pm GMT
Celtic languages are ugly! Don't even bother.
PARISIEN   Sat Jun 12, 2010 12:30 am GMT
- My favourite is Breton
- Ma préférée est le Breton
Jordan   Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:20 am GMT
Oui. Je préfère l'irlandais dans la catégorie celtique, mais ma langue favorite est le français!

Je finis la classe de français hier. Je vais prendre le classe de français deux l'année prochaine. Je suis très excité!

Je regarde des videos d'irlandais sur YouTube, parce que je veux apprendre un peu, mais la langue est très difficile!

Pardon mon français, n'est pas parfait maintenant...
PARISIEN   Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:47 am GMT
Mais non, ton français est très bon.

Juste 2 détails :

. "Pardon" seul est une interjection, lorsqu'il est combiné avec un complément, il faut le conjuguer ("Pardonnez/pardonne mon français")

. "Je finis la classe de français hier" : impossible, on peut utiliser le temps présent pour le futur ("je termine le gaélique dans 60 ans...."), mais pour le passé immédiat il faut un temps passé : "J'ai fini la classe de français il y a 30 secondes".
La seule tolérance est le "présent de narration", lorsque le temps présent est en quelque sorte encapsulé dans du passé. Exemple : "Hier j'ai eu un cours d'allemand. J'arrive en classe, le prof m'interroge, constate que je n'ai rien appris. Il n'était pas content, il me l'a fait savoir..."
Jordan   Sat Jun 12, 2010 2:00 am GMT
Merci pour l'information :)

Je prends le classe de français un. Je n'apprends pas le tense passé cet année, donc je ne sais pas...

Basically what I'm trying to explain to you in French is that I don't learn past tense until next year in French II. I think I learn all the tenses next year, but I'm not sure.
Vercingetorix   Sat Jun 12, 2010 4:08 am GMT
Gall-Gael   Sat Jun 12, 2010 5:08 am GMT
@ Jordan:
>>I don't think I would have enough motivation to learn them because they're not widely spoken anymore.<<

I have a feeling this does not matter so much with regard to Celtic Languages. If you know Irish you will be some kind of Druid who can look down on those still under the Anglophone colonial yoke!
--   Sat Jun 12, 2010 5:40 pm GMT
Baldewin   Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:26 pm GMT
I know literally nothing about Celtic languages, but it's true that the Celts were a civilized people even 2000 years ago, despite Roman and Greek propaganda. The Gauls even had coinage before the Romans. Also, in Celtic culture women were able to grow in power, more than in Roman society. Celts respected their women, while Roman women practically didn't have any rights. they also had a more developed calendar than the Romans. Still, it's probable they still didn't write down philosophy and religion and relied on oral tradition, as we the practice in European societies far into the Middle Ages (this is how knowledge about their mythology survives to this day).
Sadly, they also were heavily decentralized and that was the end of their significance in the world, but it's remarkable how Celtic culture is still alive, although among very small populations.
Wellwell   Sat Jun 12, 2010 8:14 pm GMT
Single-track minded PARISIN thinks that french is celtic language.
Baldewin   Sat Jun 12, 2010 8:52 pm GMT
PARISIEN is a descendant of Romanized Celts.
Breton   Sat Jun 12, 2010 9:05 pm GMT
Französisch raus!
gvn   Sun Jun 13, 2010 1:47 am GMT

If we are only talking about the Celtic languages of Ireland and the UK...then I would say Welsh would be my choice.

On the islands, I think it is really now down to Welsh and Irish only.

I really don't know a lot about these languages. I read a little about them on the internet, and I have now listened to them both on the internet, so everything I am about to say is on first impressions only.

If there are fans of Welsh and Irish, the following is my understand from about a single day's reading ;)

Both are nice languages.

I love the history and romanticism of the Celtic cultures.

Looking at the written language, Irish wins. As a native speaker of English, I feel that the Irish spellings are more pleasing to me. While the words are foreign, they are not very exotic and appear to be something that I could learn quite easily.

Welsh is nice, but the spelling system creates words that are rather exotic looking to my native English eyes. They just appear a little more difficult to learn for myself. Also, the fact that there more of a distance between the written and spoken language than there is in the written and spoken Irish language is a little scary.

Now having said all that, I love how Welsh spelling is more phonetic than Irish spelling. One you learn the sound system, it appears that Welsh is spoken how it is written, so in that category it seems a little better than Irish who like French can be very misleading with its spelling system.

But the reason I choose Welsh is that language is spoken first, and in this category I think that the Welsh language is more pleasant to listen to than Irish.

I listened to a radio talk show in both Irish and Welsh. There were times when the Irish lady sounding like she was mumbling. And when there were two people speaking, it did not sound like it was a natural thing. I felt like they were reading from a script, even if they were having a live conversation. One person would talk, then there would be a pause, and then the other person would speak. It did not feel like a very fluid conversation.

When the Welsh speakers were talking there was a natural flow to their voices, and when I heard them speaking together...I felt the natural flow between them. It sounded like two people speaking naturally, as you would hear in any language. I just didn't get that feeling with the Irish speakers.

Also, I think that the sounds of the Welsh language are cleaner easier to hear with my English speaking ears. Irish like those "airy" aspirations, which is nice, but not my personally favorite. Welsh definitely sounded better I think.

And finally, you have to consider the politics of the language.

With Irish, there is this dialect war being fought. There are many regional dialects that fall under three main dialects. And for some reason, there seems to be this separate but equal treatment among the three dialects. Now I know that a speaker of one dialect can easily understand another dialect, but for a learner it would be nice if there was one dialect that officially represented the Irish language instead of the separate but equal treatment.

Welsh also has dialects, but there is not the political divides I feel.

And finally, with Welsh you can find more contemporary usage of the language.

Now this is just my opinion, but looking at the way the language is presented on the internet...

It seems that Welsh is being presented as real live functional language of the present, and Irish is being presented like some bridge that connects people to the past.

But again that's just my opinion.