Americans with French

Katy   Tue Aug 23, 2005 5:33 pm GMT
Hello I was wondering something. This question is to the Americans by the way. A few weeks ago I watched America's Next Top Model. The girls were asked to read out a passage from the screen for a challenge. The passage was mostly in french. They couldn't pronounce the colours or the names or even the greetings. So my question is; are you taught other languages in the US? At my school it was compulsory; that is where I was taught french. I can't remember all of it now but I can still speak a fair amount. I am British by the way.
Sander   Tue Aug 23, 2005 5:46 pm GMT
Katy,I think we have to bare in mind that the people who participate in programs like ' America's Next Top Model ' arren't the brightest ones.
Candy   Tue Aug 23, 2005 6:06 pm GMT
BEAR in mind...

aren't....
Travis   Tue Aug 23, 2005 6:28 pm GMT
Where I went to school, in Wauwatosa, WI, they taught four languages, Spanish, German, French, and Japanese in both middle school and high school. Even though such were not required, to my knowledge, besides in sixth grade, when one was required to take one quarter of each language, primarily to inform one for choosing what language to actually take in seventh grade and most likely from thereon, having taken a foreign language in high school was still highly advantageous for the sake of getting into colleges. Nonetheless, many students still approached such things as simply school subjects and very often did not take them that seriously, and in the long run most likely forgot it not long after they leave high school, primarily because of the general (not unjustified) view that the only language one really needs to know in the US at all is English combined with very little contact with other languages in situations where one could not simply use English anyways.

As for what languages people took, the most taken one was Spanish, which was often taken by people who just had to take *some* language for college admissions purposes, due to the general perception of it being "easy", the Spanish verbal system all to the contrary, and the idea that if one is to know any language in the US other than English, it might as well be Spanish. After that, the next most popular language was German, for the obvious reason that it is a Germanic language, but from what it seemed to me about the German students at my school is that they probably took it more seriously than, say, Spanish, which seems to be the cop-out foreign language in most schools in the US. After that was French, which was quite unpopular and not taken by nearly as many students as Spanish or German. (Most likely) last was Japanese, which was not taken by that many students at all, and which was considered quite difficult, but which at the same time seemed to be perceived as cooler and more interesting than French. Unfortunately, though, Japanese was being phased out as I left high school, due to the school board citing insufficient enrollment for such, even though by their criteria they could have easily gotten rid of French instead; therefore, I think they targeted Japanese specifically simply because it is not a "standard" foreign language in middle and high schools in the US.
Katy   Tue Aug 23, 2005 7:31 pm GMT
Sander: This is a question my mum wanted me to ask. I, on the other hand know how "thick" (can I use that word?) they can be.

Travis: Interesting; see I knew Spanish was the main language taught. I just didn't know about the others. Thank you.
Sander   Tue Aug 23, 2005 7:33 pm GMT
Katy,

=>This is a question my mum wanted me to ask. I, on the other hand know how "thick" (can I use that word?) they can be<=

Sorry I really don't know, I'm not a native speaker you see, maybe Candy can give you the answer,she's an English teacher.
american nic   Tue Aug 23, 2005 9:02 pm GMT
Katy, not all schools in the States have as much choice. Travis was lucky to be in a school system that seemed to respect the importance of foreign languages. At my high school, there were only Spanish and German (both viewed as in your school). Although we were required to take Spanish in 7th and 8th grades (German wasn't a choice), by the time I was in sophomore year, Spanish was phased out of the middle school. As the situation stands, the only kids who ever really knew a non-English language in school were those who spoke a non-English language at home.
Travis   Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:57 pm GMT
american nic, well, it is still irritating that they phased out Japanese in the school district where I'd went to school before college. On another note, it is interesting that they required you to take specifically Spanish during 7th and 8th grades, rather than even giving you a choice between Spanish or German then. Any ideas why they did such? Lack of teachers to teach German during said grades?
Kirk   Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:25 am GMT
I went to a public high school in the US and it offered Spanish, Portuguese, French, German, Chinese, Farsi, Russian, Arabic, Japanese, and Assyrian (yes, it hasn't been a country for a millennium but there are still speakers of Assyrian, especially in my hometown). My high school wasn't anything amazing or in a rich area with lots of funding, but it had a good choice of languages due to people's interest in languages as well as the interest to learn languages of the immigrants that have historically and recently moved to where I grew up. We weren't required to learn a specific language but we had to take a foreign language of our choosing. Most people choose Spanish here, but obviously there are other choices as well.
Mason   Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:27 am GMT
Americans with French fries :)
Uriel   Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:22 am GMT
Of course we learn other languages in school. Not all of them are French. What a stupid question.
Katy   Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:15 pm GMT
In my school it wasn't about choice until a certain age, say 15-16 yrs old. The teacher would still teach a small amount of students even if the others skipped school. It wasn't about popuality, that's what college is for. Compulsory education is learning about subjects and you have to take all subjects whether you like it or not!! But it's true that you have a different system etc.

Uriel: I was going to scratch you eyes right out with my claws but I've decided not to because I can't think of a witty come back. So I'll just say this: I'm not naive, I'm aware that you study other languages. We (my mum & me) were just curious on the subject that's all. I myself knew from other forums online that Spanish was the main language you were taught. I knew that at university you'd have the choice on what languages you'd take next. I was just wondering if at school you were taught these languages under a compulsory system.

Which brings me to another question: Does compulsory education have the same meaning in the US as it does in the UK? To be honest from your posts, I'm having doubts that it is.
Uriel   Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:55 pm GMT
Education in the US is free (if you want) and compulsory until the age of 16. If you don't go, it's illegal, and your parents can go to jail. As to which courses are compulsory in US schools, they vary from state to state, because juvenile education is none of the federal government's business; it's administered by the individual states. So some schools may require you to take a foreign language, and some may not. At the university level, foreign language requirements may vary by degree program -- the one I started in did require a language, but the one I eventually switched to did not (that requirement was replaced by another).
Apparently I was little testy the other day, and I misinterpreted your original question. I apologize!
Katy   Wed Aug 24, 2005 10:56 pm GMT
Uriel: I understand and you are forgiven. I can't think of many schools in my hometown that teach other languages. My school was and still is different from the others, it's a special education school for children with special needs. I learnt French in my 8th year when I was 12-13 years old.

However I have to confess that the french teacher who believe it or not was called Miss French was only at the school for one year. My class was the only class lucky enough to take those lessons and we enjoyed it, more then we thought we would!

Another confession, she only taught us the basics! But hey that's enough you need to know when you're on holiday, you only need the more complex stuff when you decide to study or move there!
american nic   Thu Aug 25, 2005 2:27 am GMT
<< it is interesting that they required you to take specifically Spanish during 7th and 8th grades, rather than even giving you a choice between Spanish or German then. Any ideas why they did such? >>

Well, there was a phasing out here, also. Back in the day (until early 90s), French was also taught at the high school. And at that point, Spanish and German were both choices down to 6th grade. That lasted until I was in 5th grade (so I didn't get that). Then when I was in 6th grade, Spanish and German were both taken out for our grade, while German was phased out annually following the youngest grade who had access to it. When I was in 7th and 8th grade, we had no choice: we had to take Spanish. Then when I went to the high school, they took Spanish away from 7th grade, and by the next year, they had completely phased out foreign language education in the middle school. It's quite sad, really.

The official reason was lack of money, which is true, plus in my area I don't think foreign language education is considered all that important. Oh well, it's a college town with an industrial base, so the majority of the kids come back after college anyway. Other than conversing with immigrants, there really is no real need to learn a foreign language, unless you travel or need it for business. I guess that's the primary attitude around here.