Where did that Frisian song go?

LAA   Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:13 pm GMT
Frederick from Norway posted a link to a song in Frisian a while back in another thread. Where was that? Fred, can you post it again here? Thank you.
LAA   Tue Aug 08, 2006 9:51 pm GMT
What the hell does this say? Could someone please translate?

"Doe't ik dy seach lang ferlyn
Wat docht it dochs sear as ik d'r wer oan tink

Ik sjoch dy
Ik hear dy
Ik fiel dy, eltse kear opnij

Hjir bin ik
Wêr bisto
It is al lang lyn
Hjir bin ik
Wêr bisto
It is te lang lyn

Do bist net oars as leaf
Want do dochst gewoan neat ferkeard
Ik hâld fan dy, sa asto bist
Datst dat dan wol efkes wist

Hjir bin ik
Wêr bisto
It is al lang lyn
Hjir bin ik
Wêr bisto
It is te lang lyn

Ik sjoch dy
Ik hear dy
Ik fiel dy, eltse kear opnij"
LAA   Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:01 pm GMT
I just realized something. This song comes from a homosexual site!
zxczxc   Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:38 pm GMT
I seek you, I hear you, I feel you (something)

"Here I am, where are you" or something. I can pick out other words but they don't seem to make sense. That said, I only know English and German.
LAA   Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:21 pm GMT
See, Frisian is supposed to be the closest language to English, and I still couldn't understand the most basic of verbs. With Spanish as my second language, I bet I would understand the Portuguese or Italian equivalents. This is not the case with English and other Germanic languages. I carried on a conversation with an Italian again today, in Spanish. We conversed just fine. We had to speak slow, and we repeated things a couple of times, but we understood each other's main points. You could never do this with English and Dutch or English and German or English and Danish, etc.
Fredrik from Norway   Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:19 am GMT
Here is the song again:
http://home.wanadoo.nl/inspiritus/TwarresWerbisto.htm

LOL! I just got the link from a (gay?) guy on Langcafé and had not checked out the rest of the site, LAA, but now I see that it's a gay site! Funny, and not surprising for something from the Netherlands.....:-)

I think the lyrics translate as this:

Ik sjoch dy = I see you
Ik hear dy = I hear you
Ik fiel dy, eltse kear opnij = I feel you, every time as new

Hjir bin ik = Here I am
Wêr bisto = Where/who are you
It is al lang lyn = It's a long time/line?

Do bist net oars as leaf = You are not anything else than dear?
Want do dochst gewoan neat ferkeard = What you think ? not wrong
Ik hâld fan dy, sa asto bist = I like you, the way you are
Datst dat dan wol efkes wist = ?
Guest   Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:41 pm GMT
<<See, Frisian is supposed to be the closest language to English, and I still couldn't understand the most basic of verbs. With Spanish as my second language, I bet I would understand the Portuguese or Italian equivalents. This is not the case with English and other Germanic languages. I carried on a conversation with an Italian again today, in Spanish. We conversed just fine. We had to speak slow, and we repeated things a couple of times, but we understood each other's main points. You could never do this with English and Dutch or English and German or English and Danish, etc.>>

Wrong. The closest language to English is Scots, not Frisian. A song written in Scots would be much more intelligible. Besides, Germanic languages, possibly with the exception of the North Germanic languages, tend to be more divergent from each other than the romance languages are from each other. Dutch and German, as similar as they are when written, are still very much mutually unintelligible when spoken.
Sander   Wed Aug 09, 2006 10:11 pm GMT
>> Dutch and German, as similar as they are when written, are still very much mutually unintelligible when spoken. <<

No, this is a common misunderstanding, German and Dutch are not mutually intelligble. Most of time, not even when written.

Now, the translation of the Frisian song. (Written West Frisian is very phonetical and mostly uses Dutch ortography)

"Doe't ik dy seach lang ferlyn = When I saw you long ago.
Wat docht it dochs sear as ik d'r wer oan tink = How it hurts when I think of you.

Ik sjoch dy = I sought you
Ik hear dy = I hear you
Ik fiel dy, eltse kear opnij = I feel you, always

Hjir bin ik = Here I am
Wêr bisto = Where are you
It is al lang lyn = It's been so long
Hjir bin ik = Here am I
Wêr bisto = Where are you
It is te lang lyn =It's been so long

Do bist net oars as leaf = You're nothing (not other) than sweet
Want do dochst gewoan neat ferkeard = Because you do nothing wrong
Ik hâld fan dy, sa asto bist = I love you the way you are
Datst dat dan wol efkes wist = Just so you know

Hjir bin ik = Here I am
Wêr bisto = Where are you
It is al lang lyn = It's been so long
Hjir bin ik = Here I am
Wêr bisto = Where are you
It is te lang lyn = It's been so long

Ik sjoch dy = I sought you
Ik hear dy = I hear you
Ik fiel dy, eltse kear opnij = I feel you, always
LAA - Juaquin en la caja!   Wed Aug 09, 2006 10:31 pm GMT
I would like to take the time to demonstrate something. Although the vocabulary in this song, is of the same origin that the English equivalent would be, the words are both in written and spoken form, incomprehensible for English speakers.

How many laymen would know that "zwei" and "two" are the same thing, or "you" and "sie" are the same word. Compare that to Romance similiarites, like "tu" and "tu" or "due" and "deux". The words are so different between English and other Germanic languages, that although they are essentially the same word, of the same origin, they are completely unintelligable to an English speaker. English is by far, the most divergent Germanic language, and is in no way as similar to other Germanic languages, as Romance languages are to each other.
zxczxc   Wed Aug 09, 2006 10:39 pm GMT
True, but that's just the evolution of the language. Still, if you learn to see past those small but key changes you'll see just how similar the West Germanic languages are.
LAA - Juaquin en la caja!   Wed Aug 09, 2006 11:14 pm GMT
Well, then show me. I mean, I would like to see past those small but key changes.
Sander   Wed Aug 09, 2006 11:26 pm GMT
>>How many laymen would know that "zwei" and "two" are the same thing<<

Yeah you're right LAA, "two" and "deux" is much more obvious than "zwei" or "twee".
Sander   Wed Aug 09, 2006 11:34 pm GMT
Just noticed, Frederik,

>>LOL! I just got the link from a (gay?) guy on Langcafé and had not checked out the rest of the site, LAA, but now I see that it's a gay site! Funny, and not surprising for something from the Netherlands.....:-)
<<

Who exactly gave you that link?

(Thanks for the Holland-bashing though ;-) ... it balances out my feelings on whaling, Norwegian)
Johnathan Mark   Wed Aug 09, 2006 11:47 pm GMT
It is te lang lyn =It's been so long=Hace tanto tiempo
Ik hear dy = I hear you=Te oigo

Notice the similarities in structure between Frisian and English, and the difference between these and Spanish.

Although it is clear that the vocabulary of English is very Romance influenced.

Also, as far as numbers go:

German English
eins one
zwei two
drei three
fier four
fuenf five
sechs six
sieben seven
acht eight
neun nine
zehn ten
elf eleven
zwoelf twelve
dreizehn thirteen
feirzehn fourteen
... ...
fierzig forty
funfzig fifty
... ...
hundart hundred
tousand thousand

So, while it appears that 1,2, and 3 are romance based, the other numbers are clearly Germannic.
Guest   Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:40 am GMT
<<How many laymen would know that "zwei" and "two" are the same thing, or "you" and "sie" are the same word. Compare that to Romance similiarites, like "tu" and "tu" or "due" and "deux". The words are so different between English and other Germanic languages, that although they are essentially the same word, of the same origin, they are completely unintelligable to an English speaker. >>

You're right that not many layman would know that 'zwei' and 'two' come from the same source. But one thing I have found is that many cognates between English and the other Germanic languages, German in particular, the relationship is obscured because of sound changes that have taken place since the languages diverged. Most notably, the High German Consonant Shift and in English the Great Vowel Shift. Once a person becomes familiar with these changes, it is easier to spot cognates. There were other little changes that happened to oscure the relationships with the other languages, such as 'th' becoming 'd' or 't' in the other germanic languages,'g' in English softening into a 'y' in some words and 'k' becoming 'ch' in some words also.