importance of the ancient languages

Somebdoy asked about Old Norse:

Yes, it was the language of the Vikings. And although Old Norse was in no way as influential as Greek or Latin, it left behind a large, fine literature (three shelf metres, my teacher said!). The most well-known are the Icelandic sagas, some of which are counted among the world's great literature. Njáll's Saga, for instance, is regarded as the world's first true novel - objective, realistic and still a good read, something that you can't say about the average Medieval literature!

The Lord's Prayer in Old Norse:

Faþer vár es ert í himenríki,
verði nafn þitt hæilagt
Til kome ríke þitt,
værði vili þin
sva a iarðu sem í himnum.
Gef oss í dag brauð vort dagligt
Ok fyr gefþu oss synþer órar,
sem vér fyr gefom þeim er viþ oss hafa misgert
Leiðd oss eigi í freistni,
heldr leys þv oss frá öllu illu.

<< Pauline: ''My aim is to study medicine for be a doctor, ...''

As I know what kind of doctor you want to become, see here (german site) for making up your mind if this is the right choice: www.kvpm.de/ >>

hello Guest,

Thank you for the link.

I noticed it's about the protection of the rights of psychiatric patients -this is exactly my motivation, also to help people not suffer the horror of this illnesses.

I think psyciatric hospitals are absoltuely incorrcet when they put people obligatory and mixed illnesses. I know when you're psychotic, you haven't a possibility to help you, really i *know* this, but there must exist better solutions that those hospitals.Also, there's ignorance and judging by society so this crazy people are so mad, they don't know notign so just lock them in a hospital. My treatment was not this way, i am very lucky, but I know that if you have a psychiatric disorder, society will NOT believe, repsect, trust, like, want you. I have some friends, i'm very lucky, but it's because i'm pretty (physical apperance) and i have good psychiatrist etc... and family.for the most of schizophren people, it's isoltaion, fear, and intolerance by everyone. also i'm lucky for me i get better with the treatment, i think only 20% have this fortune.

I have a wish to help those people and i absolutely never would disresepct or abuse human rights. It's true i can immediatley beleive what's wrote on the websiet. so, it make it to be *more* imperative to have compassionate psychiatry.

Brennus,

i'm sorry for the fact that my preceding message is about another subject. It was a reply to Guest, so i would be grateful if you will not moderate it (remove) until Guest will reply.

Thanks

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Hallo Fredrik,

Thanks fo rhte Old Norse text. Old norse was spoken exactly where - in modern Norawy, also Sweden and Iceland ? How it compares with modern icelandic ?

I have heared that the Icelandic sagas are important litterature, but I haven't read one.

<<Are the private schools better that the public ones ? I think ther aren't private schools here. the differneces depend of you, for exemple if your talent is academic, or technical etc... then there are special schools for people who have disabilities motoric or learning. There are differnet schools for religions also, the most of them are catholic. >>

I think we reverse the words in our respective countries. Here, "public" means "funded by the government, taxpayers, open to every citizen for free", while "private", means "run by a private organization, tuition required, expensive, often better than public school". Also, in the U.S., we have sports at school, whereas, I believe you guys only have them on private club teams. Here, each school has a variety of sport teams, like a Basketball team, Football team, Football team (EU), baseball team, swim team, track team, wrestling team, etc.

<<what disease have you ? it seems it's something to see with movement ? i hope it will not worsen more. Have other people at your school a disease ? At my school there isn't another person, but they are very kind to me and sometimes i receive extra help. >>

There's always some people at one of my schools who have a disease of some kind. But, I don't know of anyone who has mine. I have "Complex Regional Pain Syndrome". It's a neurological disorder, where my body sends false pain signals, so that some of my joints, feel like they are arthritic, when in reality, they have no inflammation. And a lot of muscles on the left side of my body are really tight, while some only feel like they are tight. There's a lot of other symptoms too, beside muslce and joint pain, like dizzyness, intestinal problems, blotchiness. Sometimes my nervious sysetm goes out of whack, and my whole body feels like a giant bruse. I was only recently correctly diagnosed. You should research it if you like medicine. Before all of this happened, I was an all-star basketball player. Then I had to give up running and jumping, so I took up swimming. I was a swimmer for a couple of years, despite my condition along with asthma. But, this year, I had to stop, due to some problems developing in my shoulder. The doctors finally figured out what I have wrong with me, so hopefully they'll be able to treat it better. It's just that so many doctors are not up to date on the latest advances in medicine on chronic pain. It's sad, but most doctors just label patients like me with "fibromyalgia", or assume that it is all in the patient's head. Because I look completely healthy, strong, and normal in appearance, so some people, including my own family members, thought I was making it all up. If you become a doctor, always be willing to think outside of the box.

<<when I'm feeling well, I can learn very quickly and well, but I think i not make things with a high level of exactness. >>

Well, your English is not perfect, but it is surely fluent in my opinion. I have no problem communicating with you.

THanks for the Lords prayer in Norse, Fredrik.
I have written below the dutch text how it was a couple of decades ago.
Modernization destroyed the old way of using the subjective in the prayer.
like : your kingdom come
uw rijk kome
became: let your kingdom come / laat uw rijk komen

Neverthe less Dutch seems in between Old Norse and English
INterestesting to see the sva sva in old English back as sva in Norse.

Faþer vár es ert í himenríki,
Vader die zijt in de hemel( rijk )
verði nafn þitt hæilagt
uw naam worde geheiligd
Til kome ríke þitt,
uw rijk kome
værði vili þin
uw wil geschiede
sva a iarðu sem í himnum.
op aarde zoals in de hemel
Gef oss í dag brauð vort dagligt
geef ons heden ons dagelijks brood
Ok fyr gefþu oss synþer órar,
en vergeeg ons onze schuld
sem vér fyr gefom þeim er viþ oss hafa misgert
zoals wij die ook aan anderen vergeven
Leiðd oss eigi í freistni,
en leid ons niet in bekoring
heldr leys þv oss frá öllu illu.
maar verlos ons van het kwade

Fredrik you said that the Vikings spoke old Norse. But as from when did they, the Vikings, start praying the Lord's prayer?
Like old English, from when to when was it spoken , more or less?

<< Also, in the U.S., we have sports at school, whereas, I believe you guys only have them on private club teams. Here, each school has a variety of sport teams, like a Basketball team, Football team, Football team (EU), baseball team, swim team, track team, wrestling team, etc. >>

we have sports at school also. I like veyr much gymnastic, swimming etc.. but we haven't so mnay possibilities like your list. for hobbies not at school, i have dance lessons and yoga. There are private club teams ; this are mostly organised by the town council, for exemple football.

I did hear of fibromyalgia, but i haven't met someone who has it. I have read that there can be evidence of it in the form of scar tissue, and this can block the nerve route and cause many problems. I'm very sad to read you have those nasty symptoms.

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<< Because I look completely healthy, strong, and normal in appearance, so some people, including my own family members, thought I was making it all up. If you become a doctor, always be willing to think outside of the box. >>

People like to *see* the disease ; they want to see a broken leg in some plaster. then they wish to know exactly how long until it will be well. You and i, we dont get completly well, but we must live with sometimes lesser sometimes more severer symtpoms. this, the people can't imagine - if you're better, then it's cured and they not expect relapse.In this times you will discover your true friends. My problems are sometimes includeing i will hear and see what not exist -this is different that make it up, but for some people they can't accept that to make up, it's a delibertae deceit, something else.

Doctrors are mostly the same, i agree with you. they like the x-rays, the pet, mri, etc......and they want disocover abnormailties then to make a nice diagnosis, write the prescription and abracadabra !!! the patient is well. But there are some kind, good doctors also. I know a wonderful neurologist and he is like a friend.I think very mcuh it's to see with if they will beleiev you and this is a basic requirement to feel it's a good doctor who you cna trust.

I wish you good luck :-)

Don't forget folks that you can always go to http://langcafe2.myfreeforum.org/ if you want to have more off-topic conversations with people interested in languages, as it's encouraged there (unlike here, where topics are supposed to be kept to languages only). You'll recognise quite a few people there.

As for Old English, very roughly, it was spoken from about 400 AD to about 1100 AD. Although it changed during this time, 400 roughly coincides with the migration period of the Anglo-Saxons to the island of Britain, whilst 1100 is soon after the Norman Conquest, which brought about a fairly significant change in the language (at least amongst educated people).

Hans,

are you Dutch /flemish ?

What you think abotu the spelling reforms of the dutch language ? For exemple, I know that soem words were ending - sche and now they have only -se. I've noticed that sometimes words are spelled with 'c' and 'k'. Of course oftne this sounds are interchangable for the pronunciation, but it seems the favourite hobby of Holland is modernisation, although it's weird to make an official spelling reform i think. In french this is not occuring.

<< Don't forget folks that you can always go to http://langcafe2.myfreeforum.org/ if you want to have more off-topic conversations with people interested in languages, as it's encouraged there (unlike here, where topics are supposed to be kept to languages only). You'll recognise quite a few people there. >>

hello Benjamin,

Thanks -you're absolutely corrcet. I'm sorry ; i didn't planned to chnag ethe subject, it happened unintentionnelly.

LAA,
i think we've discussed proably all we wnated to ask / tell, but if you want we can have a converstaion on the other website. :-)

I am Dutch.
The spelling reforms are modernisations for the sake of modernisations, I feel. Funny thing is the Flemish are / were always winning the spelling competitions between Holland and Belgium. ( I haven't seen it for a couple of years)
I also just saw that the modern 'Our Father who art in heaven' in Dutch gained a whole new extra sentence due to modernisation.
I can just imagine the older generation in church praying aloud
already having finished and the new generation coming 3 seconds later.

Or Pauline, do you have a myspace?

Benjamin, is the "benjamin" on that other site the same person as you?

Don't forget folks that you can always go to http://langcafe2.myfreeforum.org/ if you want to have more off-topic conversations with people interested in languages, as it's encouraged there (unlike here, where topics are supposed to be kept to languages only). You'll recognise quite a few people there. >>

Yes that's true. I did see someone I know. I wasn't aware of it. Can we meet again at the thread 'that stupid belgian'?

« Benjamin, is the "benjamin" on that other site the same person as you? »

Yes, it's me. Pauline has an account there as well, but she hasn't posted much. Essentially all the other people you'll recognise are the same as well.

Well, I'm on there as Porthos right now. I might change my name.