>>I say "second" with a glottal stop at the end<<
T and glottal stop are not the same. in the recording, it was more like T.
T and glottal stop are not the same. in the recording, it was more like T.
My Accent
I work in China. I have encountered both Japanese and Malysian people here, not to say chinese, and they all have same difficulties at the same spots of the english language. Sorry, but it is as simple as that.
You are right; you have Chinese-English accent, Malaysian-English accent, Japanese-English accent, but the over all tone of the three accents is similar, and allow me to call it FarEastern-Englsih accent.
You are right; you have Chinese-English accent, Malaysian-English accent, Japanese-English accent, but the over all tone of the three accents is similar, and allow me to call it FarEastern-Englsih accent.
I must say that the observations made above are all rather interesting.
I am not quite what to say in response to the person who thought I was Chinese or Japanese. I am, in fact, a native English speaker. It is rather odd that someone would get that impression, but nevertheless, I found it oddly amusing.
Just to be fair, I have enclosed a much longer recording of myself. You can find it here: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=C3B009F72E2ED695
The passage I read during the recording was taken from International Dialects of English Archive, and it is under copyright by Douglas N. Honorof, Jill McCullough, and Barbara Somerville.
It reads: "Well, here's a story for you: Sarah Perry was a veterinary nurse who had been working daily at an old zoo in a deserted district of the territory, so she was very happy to start a new job at a superb private practice in north square near the Duke Street Tower. That area was much nearer for her and more to her liking. Even so, on her first morning, she felt stressed. She ate a bowl of porridge, checked herself in the mirror and washed her face in a hurry. Then she put on a plain yellow dress and a fleece jacket, picked up her kit and headed for work.
When she got there, there was a woman with a goose waiting for her. The woman gave Sarah an official letter from the vet. The letter implied that the animal could be suffering from a rare form of foot and mouth disease, which was surprising, because normally you would only expect to see it in a dog or a goat. Sarah was sentimental, so this made her feel sorry for the beautiful bird.
Before long, that itchy goose began to strut around the office like a lunatic, which made an unsanitary mess. The goose's owner, Mary Harrison, kept calling, "Comma, Comma," which Sarah thought was an odd choice for a name. Comma was strong and huge, so it would take some force to trap her, but Sarah had a different idea. First she tried gently stroking the goose's lower back with her palm, then singing a tune to her. Finally, she administered ether. Her efforts were not futile. In no time, the goose began to tire, so Sarah was able to hold onto Comma and give her a relaxing bath.
Once Sarah had managed to bathe the goose, she wiped her off with a cloth and laid her on her right side. Then Sarah confirmed the vet's diagnosis. Almost immediately, she remembered an effective treatment that required her to measure out a lot of medicine. Sarah warned that this course of treatment might be expensive-either five or six times the cost of penicillin. I can't imagine paying so much, but Mrs. Harrison-a millionaire lawyer-thought it was a fair price for a cure."
I am interested to see more responses. Thanks to everyone.
Oh, and yes, I realise that I slurred the word "territory" during the reading. I think I needed water at that point. ;-)
I am not quite what to say in response to the person who thought I was Chinese or Japanese. I am, in fact, a native English speaker. It is rather odd that someone would get that impression, but nevertheless, I found it oddly amusing.
Just to be fair, I have enclosed a much longer recording of myself. You can find it here: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=C3B009F72E2ED695
The passage I read during the recording was taken from International Dialects of English Archive, and it is under copyright by Douglas N. Honorof, Jill McCullough, and Barbara Somerville.
It reads: "Well, here's a story for you: Sarah Perry was a veterinary nurse who had been working daily at an old zoo in a deserted district of the territory, so she was very happy to start a new job at a superb private practice in north square near the Duke Street Tower. That area was much nearer for her and more to her liking. Even so, on her first morning, she felt stressed. She ate a bowl of porridge, checked herself in the mirror and washed her face in a hurry. Then she put on a plain yellow dress and a fleece jacket, picked up her kit and headed for work.
When she got there, there was a woman with a goose waiting for her. The woman gave Sarah an official letter from the vet. The letter implied that the animal could be suffering from a rare form of foot and mouth disease, which was surprising, because normally you would only expect to see it in a dog or a goat. Sarah was sentimental, so this made her feel sorry for the beautiful bird.
Before long, that itchy goose began to strut around the office like a lunatic, which made an unsanitary mess. The goose's owner, Mary Harrison, kept calling, "Comma, Comma," which Sarah thought was an odd choice for a name. Comma was strong and huge, so it would take some force to trap her, but Sarah had a different idea. First she tried gently stroking the goose's lower back with her palm, then singing a tune to her. Finally, she administered ether. Her efforts were not futile. In no time, the goose began to tire, so Sarah was able to hold onto Comma and give her a relaxing bath.
Once Sarah had managed to bathe the goose, she wiped her off with a cloth and laid her on her right side. Then Sarah confirmed the vet's diagnosis. Almost immediately, she remembered an effective treatment that required her to measure out a lot of medicine. Sarah warned that this course of treatment might be expensive-either five or six times the cost of penicillin. I can't imagine paying so much, but Mrs. Harrison-a millionaire lawyer-thought it was a fair price for a cure."
I am interested to see more responses. Thanks to everyone.
Oh, and yes, I realise that I slurred the word "territory" during the reading. I think I needed water at that point. ;-)
I need to correct myself. I meant to say that I slurred the word "deserted" not "territory".
Oh, also, I said, "I am not quite what to say in response to the person who thought I was Chinese or Japanese." I meant to say that I am not quite SURE what to say in response to the person who thought I was Chinese or Japanese. I suppose it always reads differently when you leave a word or two out. :-)
Oh, also, I said, "I am not quite what to say in response to the person who thought I was Chinese or Japanese." I meant to say that I am not quite SURE what to say in response to the person who thought I was Chinese or Japanese. I suppose it always reads differently when you leave a word or two out. :-)
Well, you have Canadian raising of your diphthongs for one thing, which is only found in certain areas like: most of Western and Central Canada, Minnesota, upper Michigan, and Midwestern states, as well as the traditional accent of Martha's Vineyard. The only other places that have even a little bit would be the Pacific Northwest, New England, and Philadelphia. You don't sound like you're from the East Coast, though, but I'm not that familiar with back-east accents. It's sort of hard to narrow it down more finely than that. I could ask you to pronounce "pasta", and that would at least determine if you're from the US or Canada. Western and Central Canada have rather the same accent throughout. I'd say probably you're not from Vancouver or Toronto, because of your extremely rounded u and o vowels, and your extreme Canadian raising, but some people with more conservative accents have those features in those places too. Your r's also do sound different--sort of like the people on the movie Fargo. I can tell you where you're not from though. You're certainly not from the Southwest--you said tomorrow as "tomohrrow" (Southwesterners say "tomahrrow"); you said bag differently (Southwesterners rhyme it with "bad"). You're not from the Northwest either-- although they say tomorrow, and bag the same as you do, they say "sorry" and "sorrow" as "sari" and "sahrow". So: you're not from the (far) West; you're not from the Midlands, and you're not from the South. And you're definitely not from anywhere outside of North America.
You can compare yourself to:
Minnesota
http://web.ku.edu/idea/northamerica/usa/minnesota/minnesota.htm
and:
Saskatchewan
http://web.ku.edu/idea/northamerica/canada/canada.htm
----
For my narrow guess: I'd say probably Canada or the North, but not the Inland North ("Inland North" as defined in (the areas enclosed by all 3 lines) Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift.svg
for my broad guess I'd say: somewhere north of Southern Illinois, and (in the US) further East than Montana.
That is unless you say pasta like a Canadian, and then:
narrow guess: the prairies
broad guess: Canada
Minnesota
http://web.ku.edu/idea/northamerica/usa/minnesota/minnesota.htm
and:
Saskatchewan
http://web.ku.edu/idea/northamerica/canada/canada.htm
----
For my narrow guess: I'd say probably Canada or the North, but not the Inland North ("Inland North" as defined in (the areas enclosed by all 3 lines) Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift.svg
for my broad guess I'd say: somewhere north of Southern Illinois, and (in the US) further East than Montana.
That is unless you say pasta like a Canadian, and then:
narrow guess: the prairies
broad guess: Canada
«Sorry, but it is as simple as that.»
Um, no. It is NOT "as simple as that". I'm assuming that you can't tell the differences between these "FarEastern-English" accents if you encounter them individually. I bet that you cannot discern a Japanese person from a Chinese person SOLEY from their accent.
I will make note that being fluent in Japanese, Korean and English all to the same extent, I can hear the diffrences in most East Asian accents of English. I will make a point in mentioning that I find these accents so unique from each other that I cannot lump them together as one "kind" of accent.
Also, FYI, "Far East" is a terribly outdated term.
Um, no. It is NOT "as simple as that". I'm assuming that you can't tell the differences between these "FarEastern-English" accents if you encounter them individually. I bet that you cannot discern a Japanese person from a Chinese person SOLEY from their accent.
I will make note that being fluent in Japanese, Korean and English all to the same extent, I can hear the diffrences in most East Asian accents of English. I will make a point in mentioning that I find these accents so unique from each other that I cannot lump them together as one "kind" of accent.
Also, FYI, "Far East" is a terribly outdated term.
You can usually tell a Chinese accent from a Japanese accent by the intonation. A Japanese accent is a lot flatter when it comes to pitch than a Chinese accent. A Cantonese accent is more sing-songy than a Mandarin accent.
These samples sounded pretty much like just some Upper Midwestern dialect (probably from Wisconsin or Minnesota), not all that different from my own. As for those here who think that such is a non-native English accent, that is because they are simply completely unfamiliar with Upper Midwestern dialects.
As for the [t] in "second", those are just because L. N.'s dialect apparently has word-final devoicing, and many are likely to be unfamiliar with such beyond your typical English word-final half-voicing.
As for the [t] in "second", those are just because L. N.'s dialect apparently has word-final devoicing, and many are likely to be unfamiliar with such beyond your typical English word-final half-voicing.
>> These samples sounded pretty much like just some Upper Midwestern dialect (probably from Wisconsin or Minnesota), not all that different from my own. <<
How does the Upper Midwestern dialect differ from the Canadian accent? They sound really similar.
How does the Upper Midwestern dialect differ from the Canadian accent? They sound really similar.
This is NOT a Canadian accent, I'm pretty sure...I am not any expert on this but I would have to guess perhaps a Western MA accent? Or, somewhere in Southern PA?
>>How does the Upper Midwestern dialect differ from the Canadian accent? They sound really similar.<<
One cannot speak of there being a single Upper Midwestern dialect, as they do definitely vary, but probably the single best features to separate them from Canadian dialects with is presence of the Northern Cities Vowel Shift and the lack of the Canadian Shift. Note, though, that not all Upper Midwesterns have the NCVS, especially on the northern and western extremities of the Upper Midwest. On the other hand, the Canadian Shift is absolutely absent in the Upper Midwest.
I cannot really be more specific, due to the sheer size of Canada, and due to dialects in Canada often being not too far from those on the other side of the border. However, there are features that are common in various parts of the Upper Midwest (I really mean North Dakota, Minnesota, Wisconsin, and the Upper Peninsula here) which are likely not present in dialects in Canada. Examples of such include interdental hardening (which varies from being just sporadically word-initial being general in some dialects), the use of rhotics other than things close to alveolar approximants, the raising of normative /A/ before canonical /r/ in some cases, word-final devoicing, highly rounded /o/ and /u/, and the use of the word [ja:] ("ja").
However, these are often highly locale-specific, such as in the case of the word "ja" in southeastern Wisconsin. For example, my immediate family uses it but my mom, who is from Kenosha rather than the Milwaukee area, did not use it originally before coming to Milwaukee and my girlfriend, who is from the south side of Milwaukee, uses it these days but only picked it off of me. At the same time, though, my girlfriend notes that she has a coworker native to Chicago at her job on the south side who uses it heavily. Similarly, the /o/ and /u/ are not quite as rounded or as backed here in Milwaukee as in some other parts of the Upper Midwest north or northwest of here even though they are still quite backed and rounded compared to their counterparts in, say, Californian English dialects.
One cannot speak of there being a single Upper Midwestern dialect, as they do definitely vary, but probably the single best features to separate them from Canadian dialects with is presence of the Northern Cities Vowel Shift and the lack of the Canadian Shift. Note, though, that not all Upper Midwesterns have the NCVS, especially on the northern and western extremities of the Upper Midwest. On the other hand, the Canadian Shift is absolutely absent in the Upper Midwest.
I cannot really be more specific, due to the sheer size of Canada, and due to dialects in Canada often being not too far from those on the other side of the border. However, there are features that are common in various parts of the Upper Midwest (I really mean North Dakota, Minnesota, Wisconsin, and the Upper Peninsula here) which are likely not present in dialects in Canada. Examples of such include interdental hardening (which varies from being just sporadically word-initial being general in some dialects), the use of rhotics other than things close to alveolar approximants, the raising of normative /A/ before canonical /r/ in some cases, word-final devoicing, highly rounded /o/ and /u/, and the use of the word [ja:] ("ja").
However, these are often highly locale-specific, such as in the case of the word "ja" in southeastern Wisconsin. For example, my immediate family uses it but my mom, who is from Kenosha rather than the Milwaukee area, did not use it originally before coming to Milwaukee and my girlfriend, who is from the south side of Milwaukee, uses it these days but only picked it off of me. At the same time, though, my girlfriend notes that she has a coworker native to Chicago at her job on the south side who uses it heavily. Similarly, the /o/ and /u/ are not quite as rounded or as backed here in Milwaukee as in some other parts of the Upper Midwest north or northwest of here even though they are still quite backed and rounded compared to their counterparts in, say, Californian English dialects.
Does L. N. have the Northern Cities vowel shift? I didn't really notice it, as it usually is a pretty distinctive feature of the Northern accent. But I didn't hear the Canadian shift either. As for the devoicing of the "d" in "second", isn't that fairly common for this particular word? I certainly do it. One thing I noticed when listening to it again is the pronunciation of the vowel in "Comma" vs. the vowel in odd. Another thing I noticed was the pronunciation of "been" as "bin". Isn't this a Shibboleth? So, yeah, you're probably right, he's probably not from Canada.
>> and the use of the word [ja:] ("ja"). <<
Does that mean that you say ja for yes, like in California English?
Does that mean that you say ja for yes, like in California English?