Quiz

Lazar   Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:26 am GMT
How many syllables does each of these words have for you?

Carl
hurl
hurling

feel
feeling

roll
rolling

sail
sailing

pool
pooling

pile
piling
pileup

oil
oiling

chuckling
bustling
rattler
settler
hustler

Thanks for your responses.
american nic   Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:42 am GMT
Carl 2
hurl 2
hurling 3

feel 2
feeling 2

roll 1
rolling 2

sail 2
sailing 2

pool 2
pooling 2

pile 2
piling 2
pileup 3

oil 2
oiling 2

chuckling 2
bustling 2
rattler (2 for type of snake, 3 for baby's toy)
settler (2 for someone who settled in the wild west, 3 for everyone else)
hustler 2
Uriel   Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:58 am GMT
Wow. How do you get three syllables out of "hurling"?
Rattler and settler are variable for me as well, 2 or 3. The rest are similar to nic's. ('Cept hurling: just 2)
Frances   Mon Sep 26, 2005 4:27 am GMT
Hope I'm doing this right as I don't know what a syllable is defined as in this case:

Carl 1
hurl 1
hurling 2

feel 1
feeling 2

roll 1
rolling 2

sail 2
sailing 2

pool 1
pooling 2

pile 2
piling 2
pileup 3

oil 2
oiling 3

chuckling 3 but 2 if I say it fast
bustling 2
rattler 2
settler 2
hustler 2

Thanks for your responses.
Uriel   Mon Sep 26, 2005 4:49 am GMT
I would personally define things like Carl, feel, hurl, sail, as more like one and a half syllables than two -- FILL would just have one, but there's a little rise and dip to FEEL that makes it just a smidge longer.
Tiffany   Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:02 am GMT
Carl 1
hurl 1
hurling 2

feel 1
feeling 2

roll 1
rolling 2

sail 1
sailing 2

pool 1
pooling 2

pile 1
piling 2
pileup 2

oil 2
oiling 2

chuckling 2
bustling 2
rattler 3
settler 3
hustler 2
Travis   Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:08 am GMT
Carl: 1
hurl: 1
hurling: 2

feel: 1
feeling: 2

roll: 1
rolling: 2

sail: 1
sailing: 2

pool: 1
pooling: 2

pile: 1
piling: 2
pileup:2

oil: 2
oiling: 2

chuckling: 3
bustling: 3 or 2
rattler: 2
settler: 2
hustler: 2
Travis   Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:17 am GMT
That should actually be:

pile: 2
piling: 2
pileup: 2
Lazar   Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:24 am GMT
Here is my own response to the quiz:

Carl: 1
hurl: 1
hurling: 2

feel: 1
feeling: 2

roll: 1
rolling: 2

sail: 1
sailing: 2

pool: 1
pooling: 1

pile: 2
piling: 3
pileup: 3

oil: 2
oiling: 3

chuckling: 3
bustling: 3
rattler: 3
settler: 3
hustler: 3

It seems that there can be quite a lot of variation in how people syllabify those words.
Lazar   Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:30 am GMT
<<pile: 2
piling: 2
pileup: 2>>

So for you, does "pile" basically have an allophonic second syllable that is elided when a vowel sound follows? In other words,

pile - [paI@l]
piling - [paIlIN]
pileup - [paIlVp]?

And if in rapid speech you were saying "a pile of", would you say [a paI l@v], with just three syllables?
Lazar   Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:32 am GMT
The post above is directed to Travis.
Lazar   Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:33 am GMT
And [a paI l@v] should be [@ paI l@v] of course. *Smacks head*
Travis   Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:29 am GMT
The matter is that my dialect still maintains a phonemic distinction between /l/ and /l=/ following phonemic diphthongs, unlike many other NAE dialects. However, this phonemic distinction is often obscured in surface forms, as it is only visible when said /l/ or /l=/ is followed in turn by another vowel. as otherwise they are both neutralized as [5=] or [l=], depending on context. Therefore, there is no elision actually going on, but rather variation in the realization of /l/ based on its environment, and consequent variation in syllabification, based on whether /l/ is realized as syllabic or not. Note that morpheme boundaries and word boundaries are irrelevant here, so you are exactly right about "a pile of". Thusly, one gets:

"pile" : /paIl/ -> ["p_haI.5=]
"piling" : /"paIlIN/ -> ["p_haI.5I~N]
"pileup" : /"paIl@p/ -> ["p_haI.5@p]
"a pile of" : formally /@ paIl @v/ -> [?@."p_haI.5@v] or more commonly /@ "paIl@/ -> [?@."p_haI.5@]
arrr   Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:26 am GMT
fuck
fucking
american nic   Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:32 pm GMT
I seem to add syllables left and right, or something... (mainly directed toward Travis) How is it possible in a rhotic accent to pronounce Carl in only one syllable? As far as hurling, I say something like her-l-ing. However, the sport curling is two syllables for me.