long o

Tavorian   Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:09 pm GMT
In my dialect of english, long <o> is always diphthongized to /7U/ unless it is before l, or r. Is this any different for other dialects of english?
Lazar   Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:23 pm GMT
I also pronounce it that way - my normal realization of /o/ is [7U]. When it's followed by /l/ in the same syllable, it becomes [oU], and "or" words for me use [O@`].

Just a little piece of advice: slashes are used for phonemes (distinctive sounds of speech), whereas brackets are used for phones (the actual sounds that are produced).

<<Is this any different for other dialects of english?>>

I think this realization of /o/ is quite common in many North American dialects. For example, two Americans on this website ( http://wiki.firespeaker.org/Proto_English_Vowels ) transcribed their /o/ as [7U]. This seems to be the most common realization of /o/ here in Massachusetts; and for what it's worth - of course my perception could be biased - I think I've heard a lot of people on TV use [7U].
Lazar   Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:32 pm GMT
I mean, "phonemes (distinctive units of speech)".
Travis   Sun Apr 15, 2007 8:16 pm GMT
Around here, /o/ is generally just [o], aside from its breaking after coronals as [8o], it's becoming [oU] as /ol/ due to l-vocalization, and its being pronounced as [7] when very unstressed in certain words such as "okay". However, some idiolects here do involve the pronunciation of /o/ as [8}] or even occasionally [9Y], which are quite diphthongal in nature in addition to being centralized or even fronted, but are never unrounded; I myself on occasion will use such pronunciations, but I tend to use more conservative rounded back monophthong realizations most of the time (unlike some people, such as my sister, who use such realizations relatively often).
Josh Lalonde   Sun Apr 15, 2007 8:26 pm GMT
My /o/ seems to be [o] in closed syllables, and [oU] in open ones. I use a different form, something like [uo] occasionally, but I haven't figured out all the rules around it yet.
Tavorian   Sun Apr 15, 2007 10:52 pm GMT
/6/ becomes /o/ before [L\] so for instance "dull" is [doL\]. "hull" and "hole" sound identical when I pronounce them.
Lazar   Sun Apr 15, 2007 10:55 pm GMT
I pronounce "dull" and "hull" with [V5] (compare "hole", which uses [oU5]). My /V/ phoneme undergoes no noticeable allophony there.
Tavorian   Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:12 pm GMT
Note that "holy" and "slowly" don't rhyme for me. "holy" being [hoL\i] while "slowly" is [sl7Uli].
Lazar   Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:20 pm GMT
The same applies for me. I pronounce "holy" as ["hoU5.i], but "slowly" as ["sl7U.li].

This also happens with [i] - compare "really" ["r\i5.i] and "freely" ["fr\i.li].
Josh Lalonde   Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:28 pm GMT
It's interesting how much allophonic variation /l/ produces in English. I have a whole group of low and/or back vowels that are merged or near-merged before /l/. These are more formal or citation forms:

code [kod]
cold [koUd]
called [kQUd]
culled [kOUd]

I tend to produce the last three as [OU] in less formal speech. 'Code' and 'cold' tend to be pretty close in higher registers, but I don't think they ever merge, except maybe in open syllables.
Does anyone else pronounce 'really' with [I]? For me, it's ["r\I.li].
Tavorian   Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:33 pm GMT
<<This also happens with [i] - compare "really" ["r\i5.i] and "freely" ["fr\i.li].>>

I pronounce those as [r\IL\.i] and [fr\i.li]. /i/ and /I/ merge before /l/ for me so I don't have /i/ before /l/ outside of morpheme boundries.
Travis   Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:35 pm GMT
I pronounce "dull" as ["dV:M] and "hull" as ["hV:M], while I pronounce "hole" as ["ho:U]. But at the same time, I pronounce "gulf" as ["gQUf], "bulb" ["bQ:Ub], and "multiply" as ["mQUt_hIpL\a:I]. However, I have not found a general pattern except that historical /V/ has often shifted to [Q] before /l/ followed by an obstruent, which is most commonly fortis but many be lenis, as in the word "bomb".

My "holy" ["ho:L\i:] or ["ho:Ui:] and "slowly" ["sL\o:L\i] or ["sL\o:Ui:] rhyme as well, but I do have variation between "really " ["RI:Mi:] or ["Ri:Mi:] and "freely" ["fr\i:L\i:] or sometimes ["fri:Mi:] in that I am far more likely to preserve [L\] in "freely" than in "really", where I practically always have [M] present instead.
Travis   Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:41 pm GMT
>>It's interesting how much allophonic variation /l/ produces in English. I have a whole group of low and/or back vowels that are merged or near-merged before /l/. These are more formal or citation forms:

code [kod]
cold [koUd]
called [kQUd]
culled [kOUd]

I tend to produce the last three as [OU] in less formal speech. 'Code' and 'cold' tend to be pretty close in higher registers, but I don't think they ever merge, except maybe in open syllables.<<

I myself have:

code [k_ho:d]
cold [k_ho:Ud]
called [k_hQ:Ud]
culled [k_hV:Md]

However, I do not have any merger of the last three cases at all. Rather, what I have is "code" and "cold" being very close in informal speech even though they never properly merge, as [o] does not contrast well with [oU] here.

>>Does anyone else pronounce 'really' with [I]? For me, it's ["r\I.li].<<

I often do so in everyday speech, except when I stress "really", where they I will still use [i].