Spanish language in USA (again)

Travis   Sun Jul 22, 2007 12:41 am GMT
>>Would it be that bad if Spanish became in fact America's second language? I mean after all it sounds nice, it's easy and then we would have two languages which is better then just one, just like Canada.<<

Look up the phrase "mandatory Swedish", in the context of the forced teaching of Swedish in Finland... (Do you think that "mandatory Spanish" would be any better on a US-wide basis?)

Of course, though, I have no problems with officializing Spanish in locales where Spanish is locally a major language and is not just an immigrant language lost within a few generations of immigration. My problem is only with making Spanish an official language *nationally*.
Skippy   Sun Jul 22, 2007 5:05 am GMT
I honestly hope we don't adopt any official language... If Spanish becomes the predominant language in one state, they should have the option of making that official (if they feel the need to have an official language)...
Babel   Sun Jul 22, 2007 8:35 am GMT
Yes.

Perhaps, the better way to solve the problem is not officializing Spanish, but making Spanish "important language" with some rights.

For instance, to have the right to write forms in Spanish to the Federal Government and bilingual schools (with half of the subjects in Spanish and half of the subjects in English) or something like that. Always, a middle way is better.
Adolfo   Sun Jul 22, 2007 11:22 am GMT
"I don't think we're more "multilingual friendly", we just have two official languages. Chinese is the biggest non-official language, but even here in Ottawa with a large Chinatown, there are only minimal government services in Chinese. "

Since there are 2 official languages in Canada it makes Canada more multilingual friendly. If US was like Canada in that aspect, German would be an official language in US for sure , and probably Spanish as well. Despite there is a large Chinese community in Canada, they are not millions of people so they lack the strenght to make Chinese an official language. I was told that French is even an official language across ALL Canada, and not only that, but in Quebec, French is the only official language. In my opinion, Canada tolerate multilinguism to the point of sillyness.
Adolfo   Sun Jul 22, 2007 6:16 pm GMT
"The difference between having Spanish as an official language in the US and French in Canada is that French is one of the founding languages of the country.Canada was about 50/50 English/French at Confederation (1867), though there are now many more anglophones"

Anyway French was spoken only in Quebec while Spanish was the language of many US states that splited from Mexico and became US states. If French is official in Canada, it is more reasonable that Spanish become a recognized language in US.
Spanish is not a language imported by migrants, you can see how many Spanish names there are in California and other western states, just like Quebec has French names of cities and villages. I don't know the number of Spanish speakers of New Mexico around 1850, but I suspect it was the main language. Later migrations of English speakers to New Mexico and California (fever of gold) made English predominant.
Travis   Sun Jul 22, 2007 7:02 pm GMT
>>"The difference between having Spanish as an official language in the US and French in Canada is that French is one of the founding languages of the country.Canada was about 50/50 English/French at Confederation (1867), though there are now many more anglophones"

Anyway French was spoken only in Quebec while Spanish was the language of many US states that splited from Mexico and became US states. If French is official in Canada, it is more reasonable that Spanish become a recognized language in US.
Spanish is not a language imported by migrants, you can see how many Spanish names there are in California and other western states, just like Quebec has French names of cities and villages. I don't know the number of Spanish speakers of New Mexico around 1850, but I suspect it was the main language. Later migrations of English speakers to New Mexico and California (fever of gold) made English predominant.<<

Placenames mean very little. For instance, there are many placenames that are French in origin throughout the Midwest, but in reality there was little to no actual French settlement here. At most we had trappers and possibly trading posts here, and they disappeared with the beaver. Most people here did not speak French - they spoke a smattering of different Amerindian languages. It was English, in the end, which displaced said Amerindian languages, not French.

And of course Spanish was brought by immigrants to New Spain - it wasn't spoken there before 1492! However, though, just because Spaniards gave many places in western North American Spanish names does not necessarily means that the areas were primarily Spanish-speaking at the time. Yes, there was definite settlement by Spanish-speakers (which is why there are people like crypto-Jews in areas like New Mexico even today), but that does not necessarily mean that Spanish was *the* primary language of the entire region. Somehow I doubt that was the case, especially since it was the Americans who in the end marginalized and displaced the Amerindians there, not the Spaniards.
Adolfo   Sun Jul 22, 2007 7:13 pm GMT
Yes, I know that spanish names of places do not mean Spanish was the main language of south western states. There are not only one or two places anyway, California for example is full of Spanish names. I'll do some research about the number of spanish speakers of , let's say, New Mexico , in 1850. But if nowadays 43% of people in New Mexico speak Spanish I guess this percentage should be higher at the moment when it joined the Union. So , supposing my guess was true, what is the difference between Spanish in this US state and French in the Canadian province of Quebec? Both languages should have the same status.
Kess   Sun Jul 22, 2007 7:28 pm GMT
''There are not only one or two places anyway, California for example is full of Spanish names.''

but there are nonSpanish names too: lake Tahoe, Redding, Livermore, Pleasanton, Fremont, Dublin, Long Beach... just to name some of them
Adolfo   Sun Jul 22, 2007 7:31 pm GMT
Of course there are non spanish names . Did I say the contrary? But look at the names of the MAIN cities.
Kess   Sun Jul 22, 2007 7:35 pm GMT
<<;;Why would we like to be like Canada?>>



Because they would want to split.
no way, just be as nice as Ricky Martin, J LO and Christina Aguilera
and speak English.

in English please
mucha gracia!