To speak a language?

When describing which language one speaks, what does it mean for you if someone "speaks a language". It's very ambiguous, but I think it implies the person's fluent. However, people not knowing it well, use this phrase sneakily. Often, people who definately know the language well, are often more assertive "I'm fluent in XXX", to apart themselves from those people who are charlatans. People who are modest and know they can't "speak" the language, say "some".

What point do you think it is legitimate to say you "speak" a language, rather than "speak alright/ok/some" without exaggerating your skills?

Also, does "I know a language" have connotation that is on a lower level than "I speak a language"? It seems, to me, that know implies it is familiar, but can't speak it.

What are your opinions on the matter?

When I say I speak a language that means that I can converse on a variety of topics in the language. It means that I think in the language, I guess.

If I followed Josh's joshing reply, I'd have to say that I don't understand English perfectly, because I don't understand British sitcoms all the time.

And I don't understand rap music in any language. ;)

Many songs in English are not clear.

fluffykef, who are you and why have you adopted a nick confusingly similar to my own?

I agree with you Franco. I'm learning Italian only to say I am fluent in one language because no matter how hard I study English, despite I know well (i think) the sintax, i find quite difficult its phonetics. When I hear a song in English I don't understand anything! How can a human mouth and throath make those ugly sounds?

I can understand sitcoms with relatively ease in my target language yet I am forced to repeat myself when I am esp talking with an American. In theroy, the best way to gauge this is that the language must come to your naturally. In other words, your mind should not concentrate hard on understanding native speakers of that language or reading texts more and more easily without the help of a dictionary. If you achieve this level of understanding, then I think, it is safe to say that you speak that language fluently. Uttering a couple of sentences does not mean that you speak the language well. In order to achieve this level, intensive study of the language for three years is a miminum requirement. Anyone who says he or she can speak the language in three months is bluffing.

But! Many people have good command of English, in every day use. But as soon as topic turns to some, less common theme, they are lost for words, and understanding. Is it fluent also?

It's common for imigrants, living in the country for about a year, maybe more. They are used to going to shops, asking questions, language classes, watching news, etc, but they speak about profound subjects only with compatriots.

What do you think?

<<But! Many people have good command of English, in every day use. But as soon as topic turns to some, less common theme, they are lost for words, and understanding. Is it fluent also? >>

Fluent but not fully. They can improve their fluency on not so common subjects as long as they improve their understanding of the subjects. It will take them less time to do that as compared to someone who is not a fluent speaker.

It is not more so with their understanding of the language but with their lack of knowledge on the subjects being discussed. Even I am speechless if I have nothing else in my mind to say on the subjects being discussed. Yet, I am considered a fluenct speaker in the language because i am a fully conversant in day to day topics. You are a fluent speaker as long as you can perform your tasks easily in your day to day work. That's the thing.

<<It's common for imigrants, living in the country for about a year, maybe more. They are used to going to shops, asking questions, language classes, watching news, etc, but they speak about profound subjects only with compatriots. >>

I have never lived abroad so I can not share my comments on this. It may be true. However, I notice that people whose native langauge is the same they are likely the people who don't speak English well because of using their first language among their compatriots. Living abroad is not a surefire way to learn the language fluently. Take my example. I can easily claim to have spent years in an English speaking country because of my language skills and no one will bat an eye.

"But! Many people have good command of English, in every day use. But as soon as topic turns to some, less common theme, they are lost for words, and understanding. Is it fluent also?"

This sounds like Berlitz School levels 3-5. Those are lower and middle intermediate levels. I like Berlitz because the levels are described well.

It's not reasonable to expect everyone to be able to discuss all topics, but you should be able to discuss your special interests, common interests of others, the news and work-related vocabulary.

<<Fluent but not fully. They can improve their fluency on not so common subjects as long as they improve their understanding of the subjects. It will take them less time to do that as compared to someone who is not a fluent speaker. >>

No! They're not retards! I don't mean VERY profound topics, but less common topics but what everyone can still talk about.

For example if you ask one to describe a movie plot in detail. It's not science, only describing a scene, but it's hard in foreign language.