Corsican

Guest   Fri Sep 21, 2007 11:02 am GMT
Hi, I'm interested in Corsican language. How well is it preserved in Corsica? Is it really different from Italian considering Corsican is a variety of Toscan and Italian is based on the Toscan dialect?

Thanks in advance.
OïL   Fri Sep 21, 2007 12:47 pm GMT
Corsican is indeed based on Toscan, with various morphological and phonetical influences from Northern and Southern Italy (from Genoa to Sicilia). All in all i'ts probably the most Italian of all Italic dialects, much closer to standard modern Italian than Piedmontese, Venitian or Napolitan.

The majority of the islanders still use it on a daily basis but it is rapidly loosing ground. The main reason IMHO is that the university, the local professors, intellectuals and nationalist activists choose to promote their dialect instead of standard Italian. Most Corsicans are outraged when one dares to compare their Corsican "language" to Italian, they find it derogatory.

As a result, their language sounds more and more like some kind of bad Italian translated from the French. Even the 'R's are increasingly pronounced the French way.
Guest   Fri Sep 21, 2007 10:07 pm GMT
Most Corsicans are outraged when one dares to compare their Corsican "language" to Italian, they find it derogatory

Are you drunk?? I've NEVER listen to this from a COrsican, if anything it's the contrary. Besides Corsican doesn't resemble Italian at all
Guest   Fri Sep 21, 2007 10:43 pm GMT
<<Besides Corsican doesn't resemble Italian at all>>

Sure it does.

Corsican:
Nascinu tutti l'omi libari è pari di dignità è di diritti. Pussedinu a raghjoni è a cuscenza è li tocca ad agiscia trà elli di modu fraternu.

Italian:
Tutti gli esseri umani nascono liberi ed eguali in dignità e diritti. Essi sono dotati di ragione e di coscienza e devono agire gli uni verso gli altri in spirito di fratellanza.

Sicilian:
Tutti i cristiani nascinu libbiri cu a stissa dignità i diritti. Iddi hannu a raggiuni i cuscienza i hannu a travagghiari 'nzemmula cu spiritu di fratirnità.

Genoese:
Tytti i ommi nàscian libberi e yguâli in dignitæ e drîti. Sun dutæ de raxun e de cunscensa e dêvan agî i-yn versu i-âtri inte'n spirritu de fraternitæ.

Sardinian:
Totu sos èsseres umanos naschint lìberos e eguales in dinnidade e in deretos. Issos tenent sa resone e sa cussèntzia e depent operare s'unu cun s'àteru cun ispìritu de fraternidade.

Venetian:
Tuti łi eseri umani i xe nai łiberi e conpagni par dignità e diriti. I xe dotai de raxon e de cosiensa e i deve conportarse łi uni co łi altri co spirito de fradełansa.

Piedmontese:
Tuij j'esser uman a nasso liber e uguaj an dignità e dirit. A l'han ëd rasonament e 'd cossienssa e a l'han da comportesse j'un con j'aotri an spirit ëd fradlanssa.

Emilian-Romagnol/Sammarinese:
Tot j essèri umèn i nàs lébri e cumpagn in dignità e dirét. Lou i è dutid ad rasoun e ad cuscinza e i à da operè, ognun ti cunfrunt at ch'j ilt, sa sentimint ad fratelènza.
Guest   Sat Sep 22, 2007 12:07 am GMT
Sure it does.

Corsican:
Nascinu tutti l'omi libari è pari di dignità è di diritti. Pussedinu a raghjoni è a cuscenza è li tocca ad agiscia trà elli di modu fraternu.

Italian:
Tutti gli esseri umani nascono liberi ed eguali in dignità e diritti. Essi sono dotati di ragione e di coscienza e devono agire gli uni verso gli altri in spirito di fratellanza.



Wow.... it's REALLY THE SAME.. like it was Japanese!
Guest   Sat Sep 22, 2007 8:52 am GMT
The Corsican version sounds fishy.
It seems it deliberately uses synonyms and other expressions just to enhance the distance from Italian.

Using the same expressions in Italian makes a virtually identical sentence:

Corsican:
"Nascinu tutti l'omi libari è pari di dignità è di diritti. Pussedinu a raghjoni è a cuscenza è li tocca ad agiscia trà elli di modu fraternu"

Italian:
"Nascono tutti gli uomini liberi e pari di dignità è di diritti. Possedono la ragione e la coscienza e gli tocca di agire tra loro di modo fraterno"

---

Wow, in Sicilian "human beings" translates with "cristiani" = "christians". LOL
Guest   Sat Sep 22, 2007 11:28 am GMT
In sicilian muslims are not humans then.
Guest   Sat Sep 22, 2007 2:53 pm GMT
Corsican may argue their language is separate from (Tuscan) Italian,
but people from Livorno or Florence can understand 100 % of it.
the same people from Livorno or Florence cannot understand Venecian or Napolitan dialects.


Corsican is a dialect of the Italian language, but it's not a dialect of Italy
Venecian and Napolitan are not dialects of the Italian language, but are dialects of Italy
Loach   Sat Nov 17, 2007 12:12 am GMT
Recent genetic analysis of Corsican DNA indicates that Corsicans have the same genetic makeup as those Italians from Genoa. It should be no surprise considering its history and proximity to Italy, but there language, which is indeed closer to the standard Italian (the language of Dante), has been influenced by French mostly over the last 50 years. If I were Corsican, I would love to claim French and Italian, but they do not see themselves as French and the French do not see them as being French.
Manado   Sat Nov 17, 2007 12:20 am GMT
I guess the situation of Corsican is similar to other regional languages in France, eh?

What interests me is the question:
When Italians visit Corsica, do they have problems to communicate with the natives, who perhaps have a passive knowledge of Corsican but cannot really speak it, so that they have to switch to French or English?
Sarkozy   Sat Nov 17, 2007 12:25 am GMT
The Corsicans are lazy people who live thanks to the money from Paris.
Milton   Sat Nov 17, 2007 9:53 am GMT
-When Italians visit Corsica, do they have problems to communicate with the natives, who perhaps have a passive knowledge of Corsican but cannot really speak it, so that they have to switch to French or English?-


Nope, Corsican is easy for every speaker of Standard Italian to understand, just like Romanesco, a Rome's dialect.
Manado   Sat Nov 17, 2007 5:31 pm GMT
<< Nope, Corsican is easy for every speaker of Standard Italian to understand, just like Romanesco, a Rome's dialect. >>

But I suppose there are younger Corsicans who are not fluent in Corsican, aren't there?
Like the ones who only understand Corsican, but cannot really speak it?
Guest   Mon Nov 19, 2007 6:44 pm GMT
"and the French do not see them as being French. "

wrong. I'm French and I, of course, consider corsicans as much french a myself, or as a Auvergnat, Breton, Lyonnais, Toulousain or Provençal...


" When Italians visit Corsica, do they have problems to communicate with the natives "

I tend to think that they would have few problems with the Corsicans who speak Corsican. That is not the case of the whole population of the island.
Guest   Mon Nov 19, 2007 7:43 pm GMT
The Corsicans are lazy people who live thanks to the money from Paris.

You could stay home