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Why people fail in learning a foreign language
<<furrykef Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:23 pm GMT
<< What I am saying here is based on my own success . I speak five
languages fluently . >>
Here's how to fail at learning a foreign langauge: ignoring advice. You just broke two rules I explained in my reply to you: don't break a line for no reason, and don't put a space before a period. >>
The line break is most likely due to that Ahsan is used to normal text editors. As I started with posts in the internet, I had similar problems. Even today I make such line breaks unconciously. To my mind, internet software should ignore one single line break, at least by option. If there're two, one after the other, than clearly, a new paragraph is intented to start.
If you start using a typewriter or a computer keyboard, you are very likely to insert a blank (a space) after each word, even if it is followed by a period, comma, etc. I also did that as I started using a typewriter. This is -- to my mind -- due to the learning process. You start with three or four letter sequences separated by a blank.
@Ahsan, Xie: Wenn ihr in den letzten Jahren mit Material vom Goethe-Institut Deutsch gelernt habt, dann seit ihr zu bedauern. Dort wird die Schriftsprache nach der sog. Rechtschreibreform gelehrt, die das Verständnis zumindest komplexerer Sätze erheblich erschweren kann.
Siehe dazu auch www.sprachforschung.org.
Another guest: Thanks for your advice, but I have to use my e-dictionary for almost every second word.
... it's also a shame that I can't read the website at the moment.
No, I've never been in a class of the Institut. I'm going to learn on my own, supplement it with university courses (despite its slow progress, I at least have more chances to practice while being very busy with my studies), and, when I feel confident enough, seek more help from teachers and native speakers... and then try to join DAF courses at that institut.
another guest - it may be true that the typing errors have nothing to do with language learning. Nevertheless, it remains that ignoring advice is not a good way to learn a language. There was no indication that the poster had even read my post.
- Kef
You call yourself a nutbar or a nutcase, why does he bother to waste his time on reading something that is written by an oddball. Ponder it over...
Exuse me, go to your website: furrykef.com as a reference.
Whether or not I'm an oddball has nothing to do with whether or not I'm worth listening to. Some of the greatest people in history were oddballs. Of course, some of the worst people in history were too. Point is, oddball-ness has nothing to do with it.
Moreover, the value of an opinion is completely independent of who voices that opinion. Look up "ad hominem fallacy" sometime.
- Kef
<<furrykef Sat Oct 13, 2007 9:33 pm GMT
another guest - it may be true that the typing errors have nothing to do with language learning. Nevertheless, it remains that ignoring advice is not a good way to learn a language. There was no indication that the poster had even read my post.>>
Yes, ignoring good advice does not help in learning a language in many cases. And yes, it seems that there is no indication that the poster even read your post. On the other way round, getting rid of automitically working patterns of behaviour or movement as in typewriting is also not easy to do.
Sticking to their typing conventions is maybe the first step to learn a new language. This also holds for orthographical conventions.
@Ahsan, Xie: Wenn ihr in den letzten Jahren mit Material vom Goethe-Institut Deutsch gelernt habt, dann seit ihr zu bedauern. Dort wird die Schriftsprache nach der sog. Rechtschreibreform gelehrt, die das Verständnis zumindest komplexerer Sätze erheblich erschweren kann.
Siehe dazu auch www.sprachforschung.org.
Iff you started out learning German with material form the Goethe-Institute, then, I feel regret for you. They teach German according to the ''Rechtschreibreform'', which leads to increasing difficulty in understandig complex sentences.
Classical German orthography developed over hundereds of years and is quite easy, easy to read and quite logical as far an orthography can be logical at all. The ''Rechtschreibreform'' is an inconsitent, artifical invention by some third class linguists, which underwent several updates upto now. And will untergo further updates because of its many, many errors. You'll never be able to learn real German with that ''Rechtschreibreform''.
I won't, indeed, because ... let me say something about what I did. At first, I joined university course A, and the methodology was actually similar to the Goethe Institut, but not even as much comprehensive in terms of study aids , materials, speaking practices... there were two teachers, and the one who had had the most contact hours with us learnt German decades ago, and thus wrote in the "old" spelling. So far, I can recognize both forms. Well, it's easier than traditional vs simplified Chinese.
But I must admit that most of my materials in hand use the "new" spelling.
furrykef,
"
Here's how to fail at learning a foreign langauge: ignoring advice. You just broke two rules I explained in my reply to you: don't break a line for no reason, and don't put a space before a period. "
Come on, sheesh. This a little harsh, and unnecessary. I find this sort of error to be different from grammatical or structural errors or using-the-wrong-word-in-the-wrong-context sort of error. So what if he presses enter after every sentence, lol?
Ahsan,
"I grew with two Punjabi and Urdu"
LOL, OMGWTFBBQ. I grew in Minneapolis, my parents planted potted plants and me too, I was grew [sic]. Weirdo.
Wait, I need to correct this.
Here we are.
LOL, OMGWTFBBQ.
I grew in Minneapolis, my parents planted potted plants and me too, I was grew [sic].
Weirdo.
<< So what if he presses enter after every sentence, lol? >>
So it's hard to read, that's what. I still haven't read the initial post and that is one reason why. Not because I'm being a stubborn jerk, because I simply can't read it easily. That's a very real problem that happens when people type that way, so it's worth pointing out.
- Kef
It's a little hard to read, and I wonder what the topic really is, but it's not nearly as bad as a lot of the posts in the English section of Antimoon.
Topic is the question whether it is better to learn vocabulary, syntax and grammar and then start to speak it or to try to speak and use the language right from the start.
To my opinion, speaking helps a lot since it motivates. It is learning by doing - learning by reading manuals and books or listening to a teacher is useful, but not quite motivating. Children never use grammar books and learn their mother tongue effectively. Perhaps it depends on the age of the learner...
I agree with Herbist. And "physiologically", since you must be mentally aware enough when you speak, it also prevents you from falling asleep most of the time. You can certainly pace your reading room/living room or a small park while reading grammar, but speaking is still the most active part of using the language (even on day one). After all, language is first spoken, not written.
<<Topic is the question whether it is better to learn vocabulary, syntax and grammar and then start to speak it or to try to speak and use the language right from the start. >>
Wow, congratulations on having figured that out!
I would have never guessed.
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