I just finished watching Link TV's World Music show and a Portuguses Fado song came on. I have a general knowledge of the language and I can understand it since a quarter of my family is Brazilian. The song was of course in European Portuguese so I sat and listened to song. The funny thing was that I hardly could understand any of what they were saying. It to me soumded like they were talking German or some non-Romance language. If anybody has any knowldge of this or also has noticed this please write.
Brazil and Portugal lie far appart from another.Its probable the same as English and US english,or far worse,Dutch and Afrikaans.Maybe Brazil is developing a new romance language?!But surely you could understand the song a bit,coulden't you?
Why do any accents of the same language sound different?
Many people make a mountain out of a molehill when it comes to the difference between Lusitanian and Brazilian Portuguese. The strong "sh" sound of Lusitanian Portuguese is what causes it to sound "Russian" at times (thus the non-Romance characteristic of which you speak) and the "dj" and "tch" sounds in the Brazilian accent are unmistakable. Listen to speakers from Rio de Janeiro. There too you'll hear the "sh" sound, a remnant of the Braganças' presence in the city when they were forced to flee Napolean's invading army.
As an American of Portuguese background who has studied the two dialects for some time, I find the differences fascinating.
JGreco,
Watch the RTP news and you'll pick up the Portuguese pronunciation fairly quickly.
http://programas.rtp.pt/EPG/tv/
Go down to "Vídeos Online" and click on any one of the "telejornais."
Unfortunately Globo used to give clips of the Brazilian news, although not the whole broadcast like the Portuguese RTP. If anyone knows of any news broadcasts from Brazil that are available to the public over the Internet, please do share.
Is it not just the same as British English and American English sounding different?
The main difference between Portuguese Pt and Portuguese Br is that the Brazilians stretch the vowels and the Portuguese swallow them.
That's why Brazilian Portuguese is easier to understand and Portuguese
PT takes a while longer.
Sr. Samedo (br) sounds like Sr.Smid in pt
All soap operas and movies from Portugal are dubbed (or subtitled) into Brazilian Portuguese when shown in Brazil since we don't understand spoken Continental Portuguese (especially the standard version of it, which is based on vowel-dropping Lisbon speech)
excelent:
written: EXCELENTE
is sounds like
1. eh-seh-lehn-tchee in Brazilian Portuguese (4 syllables)
2. shlent in Continental Portuguese (1 syllable)
boys:
written: MENINOS
is sounds like
1. meeNEEnoos in Brazilian Portuguese (3 syllables)
2. mninsh in normal Lisboan Portuguese (1 syllable)
Portuguese people do not pronounce unstressed vowels normally (they pronounce it as shwa's in slow speech, but again, they rarely speak slowly...) so this makes it very difficult for us Brazilians to understand it...
We have mantained the classical pronunciation of Portuguese language which is more vowel-friendy (reduction of vowels in Continental Portuguese started in 18 century...)... Furthermore, we normally avoid difficult to pronounce consonantal sequences by inserting an i (pronounced ee):
we write RITMO, but we pronounce it
HEE-tchee-mo (or HEE-tchee-moo)
we write ABSOLUTO, but we pronounce it
ah-bee-soh-LOO-too
we write ADVOGADO, but we pronounce it
ah-gee-voh-GAH-doo
Brazilian Portuguese is vowel-friendy (like Italian or Estonian)
and Continental Portuguese is consonant-friendly (like Russian, Polish or Arab) so they sound pretty different.
I've read in the Folha de São Paulo newspaper that a Brazilian can more easily get used to Argentinian Spanish than Continental Portuguese...It takes us 2 weeks for Argentinian Spanish and 4 weeks for Continental Portuguese.
«It takes us 2 weeks for Argentinian Spanish and 4 weeks for Continental Portuguese. »Jacyra
A maioria dos emigrantes brasileiros que vejo está se dando bem em menos de uma semana
While it's hard to compare, I think the differences between Brazilian Portuguese and the European variety are greater in scale than the differences between American and British English. It seems as though all European Portuguese films are either dubbed or subtitled into the Brazilian variety when shown in Brazil. This would never be the case with English. Additionally, most Brazilians barely understand their European counterparts, and find it easier to try and understand neighboring Spanish varieties. Unless the Brit has an extremely strong or not well-known accent, an American will comprehend everything.
Well, Brazilians do not consider Continental Portuguese ''posh'' or ''elegant'', (the things Americans many times say of ''the English accent'') but rather''muffled'' and ''harsh'' (along with ''hard to understand'').
It may be true Americans cannot understand some British dialects, but now we're talking about TVnewscasters accents. Portuguese tv stations use Lisboan Portuguese, which is along with Southern Portuguese and Island Portuguese accents, one of the most difficult to understand.
Rural Northern Portugal accents (cities of Braga and Bragança, for example), near to Spanish border are less difficult for Brazilians to understand, since they DO seem to pronounce all the vowels and there is no excessive syllable dropping...
There are two Portuguese stations in Brazil: RTP International and SIC. But Brazilians don't like it. Only portuguese immigrants in Brazil watch it, to make their homesickness go away...
There is a portuguese actor in an brazilian soap opera that is being aired in Brazil, but he was ''foreced'' to learn the Brazilian Portuguese. His accent is 95 % carioca. If he used Continental Portuguese (even the standard accent of it), he would not be understood, and no one would acompany this soap opera.
Two Portuguese soap operas were dubbed into Brazilian Portuguese prior to being aired on brazilian TV Band (the 2nd greatest tv station in Brazil) since in the test with 100 brazilians (who were shown the original soap opera with no dubbing/subtitles), 90 % of it had trouble understanding anything!!! So, the dubbing was not done because of ''Brazilian nationalism'' but because of the lack of understanding of the Continental Portuguese.
presently, Brazilians have virtually no ties with portugal, so the differences are likely to become greater and greater. Portuguese movies are not popular, and Portuguese music is heard once in a blue moon.
Sander,
There's not a big gap between British English and US English
And Afrikaans is perfectly understandable with a bit of effort ( I think it would only be a matter of weeks to learn the language )...
>>Well, Brazilians do not consider Continental Portuguese ''posh'' or ''elegant'', (the things Americans many times say of ''the English accent'') but rather''muffled'' and ''harsh'' (along with ''hard to understand''). <<
That's exactly how "Hispanohablantes" feel towards Peninsular Spanish, they perceive it as harsh and muffled nothing "posh" about it at all. Ain't that funny. Latin American Castilian accents tend to be more musical and softer sounding.
After all, there is no clear distinction where the variants of "the same" language ends and where "two separate languages" begins. Portugese and Brasilian is a good case in point. Or Dutch and Afrikaans. I could list many examples like that... It's more the matter of politics, nationalism or historical tradition. If two standard versions of "the same language" exist they can be considered as the beginning of this languages divergence into separate languages. After all, that's how languages like Spanish and Portugese appeared in the first place!
=>Sander,
There's not a big gap between British English and US English
And Afrikaans is perfectly understandable with a bit of effort ( I think it would only be a matter of weeks to learn the language )...<=
Nobody can learn a language in two weeks,but your right about the Us english thing...
