Boise speakers retain a portion of the Rocky Mountain Dialect, while Seattle speakers are free from that influence.
My Accent
I've heard some Canadians pronouncing sorry, tomorrow, dollar all with /A/ instead of General Canadian /Q/. The world is not black and white, ya know, there are shades of gray.
>> Boise speakers retain a portion of the Rocky Mountain Dialect, while Seattle speakers are free from that influence. <<
How does the Rocky Mountain dialect differ from that of Seattle? Phonologically (according to the Linguistic Atlas of North American English), there are no such subdivisions in the large dialect area labelled "The West". Some older studies show some such divisions but they are lexically based rather than phonologically based (of mostly obsolete terms). Since this was a stock passage "Comma Gets a Cure", it would be impossible to determine any sort of lexically based items. Which phonological features did you listen for to come to that conclusion? Also where approximately is the isogloss line that divides the two dialects?
How does the Rocky Mountain dialect differ from that of Seattle? Phonologically (according to the Linguistic Atlas of North American English), there are no such subdivisions in the large dialect area labelled "The West". Some older studies show some such divisions but they are lexically based rather than phonologically based (of mostly obsolete terms). Since this was a stock passage "Comma Gets a Cure", it would be impossible to determine any sort of lexically based items. Which phonological features did you listen for to come to that conclusion? Also where approximately is the isogloss line that divides the two dialects?
<<How does the Rocky Mountain dialect differ from that of Seattle?>>
Being a student, and not a word maestro like Travis, I don't have the linguistic vocabulary to adequately express the differences, Guest. I can only assert that I can immediately detect the accent when I hear it.
To speak in vague terms, the dialect sounds like a countrified version of GAE; very probably, some Southern influences crept into the speech at one juncture. One prominent speaker of this dialect is Representative Enid Holtzclaw from Utah. If you can't get the chance to hear her speak, you can catch it in the 1950 movie Annie Get Your Gun.
Noted in another thread is the fact that it was featured prominently in a dialect map I saw in a 1949 book, but has disappeared completely in dialect maps I see today. For this reason, I believe it's possible that the dialect might be disappearing. (All the people I've met who still speak the dialect seem to be older than 35 or so.)
If Francis is a young-enough speaker, it's possible that he might be from Boise, ID, after all, but somehow I doubt it.
Being a student, and not a word maestro like Travis, I don't have the linguistic vocabulary to adequately express the differences, Guest. I can only assert that I can immediately detect the accent when I hear it.
To speak in vague terms, the dialect sounds like a countrified version of GAE; very probably, some Southern influences crept into the speech at one juncture. One prominent speaker of this dialect is Representative Enid Holtzclaw from Utah. If you can't get the chance to hear her speak, you can catch it in the 1950 movie Annie Get Your Gun.
Noted in another thread is the fact that it was featured prominently in a dialect map I saw in a 1949 book, but has disappeared completely in dialect maps I see today. For this reason, I believe it's possible that the dialect might be disappearing. (All the people I've met who still speak the dialect seem to be older than 35 or so.)
If Francis is a young-enough speaker, it's possible that he might be from Boise, ID, after all, but somehow I doubt it.
<<If you can't get the chance to hear her speak, you can catch it in the 1950 movie Annie Get Your Gun. >>
P.S. Or almost any movie featuring Marjorie Main.
P.S. Or almost any movie featuring Marjorie Main.
>>
If Francis is a young-enough speaker, it's possible that he might be from Boise, ID, after all, but somehow I doubt it. <<
How old would you guess Francis is? I'd guess about 40.
If Francis is a young-enough speaker, it's possible that he might be from Boise, ID, after all, but somehow I doubt it. <<
How old would you guess Francis is? I'd guess about 40.
All the guesses posited so far have been that Francis is an older speaker. I'm going to break this mold in a completely subjective, non-scientific way.
Based on gut feeling--and something about his cadence--I'd guess that he's in his 20s.
Based on gut feeling--and something about his cadence--I'd guess that he's in his 20s.
>> It's Vancouver or Valley Girl accent. Strong CVS but no Canadian raising. <<
Well, now we know it's neither of those, but can we determine if Francis has the California vowel shift vs. the Canadian vowel shift, since supposedly the merged cot-caught vowel is somewhat different: see http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~robh/files/CEGC%20handout.pdf
So which shift do you think it is?
Well, now we know it's neither of those, but can we determine if Francis has the California vowel shift vs. the Canadian vowel shift, since supposedly the merged cot-caught vowel is somewhat different: see http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~robh/files/CEGC%20handout.pdf
So which shift do you think it is?
>> Noted in another thread is the fact that it was featured prominently in a dialect map I saw in a 1949 book, but has disappeared completely in dialect maps I see today. For this reason, I believe it's possible that the dialect might be disappearing. (All the people I've met who still speak the dialect seem to be older than 35 or so.)
<<
But all of the old maps were based on *lexicon* whereas all of the new maps are based on *phonology*. Most of the old books are completely useless today, because most of the farming terminology and/or covered wagon terminology is completely obsolete and unknown to most people today. Also, were the people that you met that spoke that dialect natives of the area, or were they transplants?
<<
But all of the old maps were based on *lexicon* whereas all of the new maps are based on *phonology*. Most of the old books are completely useless today, because most of the farming terminology and/or covered wagon terminology is completely obsolete and unknown to most people today. Also, were the people that you met that spoke that dialect natives of the area, or were they transplants?
Guest, I respect your opinion, but I don't think that it is based on fact--the Rocky Mountain Dialect is immediately recognizable to a student who knows what to listen for; it's as distinct a dialect as Southern American English. (To answer your question, the people whom I met who spoke that dialect were natives.)
Besides this, I believe that the notion that old maps were based on lexicon is erroneous, too--many of the isoglosses are the exactly the same, while almost all of the remainder are similar. I find it reasonable to suppose that this verisimilitude cannot be based on lexicon alone.
It might be fair to say, however, that the dialect might be disappearing; after all, (to use an analogy), the California Vowel Shift is only twenty-five years old. Perhaps a resident of those regions might be able to shed some light on this issue?
Besides this, I believe that the notion that old maps were based on lexicon is erroneous, too--many of the isoglosses are the exactly the same, while almost all of the remainder are similar. I find it reasonable to suppose that this verisimilitude cannot be based on lexicon alone.
It might be fair to say, however, that the dialect might be disappearing; after all, (to use an analogy), the California Vowel Shift is only twenty-five years old. Perhaps a resident of those regions might be able to shed some light on this issue?
Guest, after further thought on this issue, I think you might be most convinced if you could hear the dialect for yourself.
To further this aim, I am going to look for a clip of Enid Holtzclaw on the web; she's got a Rocky Mountain Dialect that could knock you down. Allow me some time--I'll get back to you.
To further this aim, I am going to look for a clip of Enid Holtzclaw on the web; she's got a Rocky Mountain Dialect that could knock you down. Allow me some time--I'll get back to you.
I need to make a correction. The Utah Representative's correct name was Enid Waldholtz, not Enid Holtzclaw. This can be attributed to a slip of the memory.
Since her divorce from Joel Waldholtz, she has changed her name to Enid Greene. She was actually born in San Rafael, CA, so I assume she picked up her Rocky Mountain accent through osmosis.
I cannot find any clip of Ms. Greene speaking anywhere on the Web; suffice it to say that her Rocky Mountain Dialect is especially thick.
Since her divorce from Joel Waldholtz, she has changed her name to Enid Greene. She was actually born in San Rafael, CA, so I assume she picked up her Rocky Mountain accent through osmosis.
I cannot find any clip of Ms. Greene speaking anywhere on the Web; suffice it to say that her Rocky Mountain Dialect is especially thick.
>> Easy! You're from Hartford, Connecticut! :) <<
What makes you say that? What features does a Hartford accent have?
What makes you say that? What features does a Hartford accent have?
There's something in the way Francis pronounces the "oo" in "zoo" and a few other words with that vowel sound that seemed "different" to me. Think of the sound when the average American says, "too" and then think of how a person speaking Spanish says, "tu" (the pronoun). Francis's pronunciation of that vowel appeared, to my ear, closer to the Spanish pronunciation of the "U" sound... It sounded almost how a guy from an old Hollywood film would pronouce that vowel. Did anyone else hear that?
For the record, I thought Francis sounded youngish.. perhaps in his early to mid-twenties.
For the record, I thought Francis sounded youngish.. perhaps in his early to mid-twenties.