Which language is difficult to learn?

edo,

I know that you wrote to Kef, but I'm curious: do you have a good working knowledge (let's say 5,000 words or so) in both Chinese and Japanese?

I was also interested in your comment about straightforward pronunciation. I noticed some time ago that Kef chose two languages with "easy" pronunciation and you seem to go for the same kind of "easy to pronounce" languages. Of course, the effort involved in reading and writing Japanese and mastering the subjunctive (for some people) in Spanish make these languages "difficult", so learning them well is still quite an accomplishment.

I noticed that you didn't think the tones were too bad in Mandarin, but you struggled with Russian and I guess Portuguese and French. So, would it be fair to say that for you, the challenge was the sounds, not the grammar?

For me, while grammar is not a "problem", I've never been excited about it, never read a grammar book for "fun", just as a reference. On the other hand, I've found the sounds of most languages discussed on antimoon (Dutch still scares me, lol) fairly easy and beautiful. I think Russian, Portuguese and French are just, wow!, beautiful.

<< I noticed some time ago that Kef chose two languages with "easy" pronunciation and you seem to go for the same kind of "easy to pronounce" languages. >>

In my case, that's pretty much just a coincidence. I'm learning Spanish because it's what I learned in high school, and I learned it in high school because it seemed to be the most useful and familiar language of the classes I could take. My interest in Japanese originally stemmed from things like video games, though by now I study Japanese mostly for its own sake, not for any particular incentive.

- Kef

Well, I wondered about your reason for choosing Japanese even though it wasn't any of my business... I learned it because I lived in Japan (not because of Anime or any other reason). I wonder if you've considered moving there for awhile after you finish with Heisig.

I think that pronunciation is a major difficulty in setting out to learn a language

great bullshit, what do you do of a perfect pronunciation if you are a dummy in grammar or you don't know syntax, ortography etc.????
Furthermore I have a simple question I always wonder.... how comes that everybody says Spanish is simple in pronunciation and then foreigners speak it in a horrifying way (epecially the English ones)?
Misteries...

I think pronunciation is one of the most weighted factors people use when judging someone's language ability, because even if you have wonderful grammar and a large vocabulary, if you can't pronounce words clearly, people aren't going to think you're very good. On the other hand, you have to have enough knowledge of the language's grammar and vocabulary in order to effectively communicate regardless of how good your pronunciation is.

I think pronunciation is one of the most weighted factors people use when judging someone's language ability, because even if you have wonderful grammar and a large vocabulary, if you can't pronounce words clearly, people aren't going to think you're very good.


I think the contrary, grammar is the most important factor. It's not necessary to have a perfect pronunciation but a correct one.
Once people can understand you without problems nobody cares if you pronounce the sounds perfectly, but if you don't have all the other aspects of the language, pronunciation is useless.
I can have a good pronunciation, but if I don't have the grammar and the proper vocabulary to comunicate concepts, how can I speak?
So ALL the language aspects are important, pronunciation is important like the other ones, not more, and it is not the hardest aspect of a language. I find grammar much more harder.
I can have a perfect pronunciation with all my beautiful vowels but what's the use I speak in an incomprehensible way?

I can have a good pronunciation, but if I don't have the grammar ... -------> Yes, but I wonder why I never find these cases but many which are the contrary, they have good grammar and bad pronunciation

Well, for one thing, people will never think you're a native speaker if you have bad pronunciation, but they might ignore some minor grammatical mistakes if you have perfect pronunciation.

The previous two posters are not me. Josh as you suggested in the other thread please make a request to the admins to ban this guy's IP.

Stop using my nickname. I'm the real JLK. As I said earlier , I won't use JLK anymore but slight variations.

Shut up JLK. Your kind isn't welcome around here.

It isn't possible to know which is the "real" JLK. This is a language forum, guys. How many people here are interested in discussing languages?

It's better if everyone posts as Guest, then it's not the ego contest. Nothing worse than 'online personalities'.