Whats the difference between portuguese and brazilian portu.

One particular thing about European Portuguese is that it assimilated many different words from every Portuguese speaking country, words from their indigenous languages. Not only words, but sometimes expressions. Therefore, is a very flexible and rich language.

Saying "Brazilian" is a different language just because people tend to use one sort of sentences is really ridiculous for any European Portuguese; we use them all (just not all the time), they aren't "new", it's all part of Portuguese language.
Of course there are distinctions, like American English and British English. I never met someone who claimed "American" wasn't English though.
You also won't find any Portuguese that states "Brazilian" is a different language.

As I said before, I studied in Brazil and studied Portuguese there. Grammar rules and verb conjugations are the SAME, they are even taught the same way!


<<For instance Brazilian variant uses just 3 or 4 verbal forms for each tense:
eu canto
ele ela voce canta
nos cantamos
eles elas voces cantam
even nos cantamos is often replaced by a gente canta>>

So, what's the difference between Portuguese and "Brazilian"? Remember that some regions in Brazil use "tu" and "nós" a lot. It's not obsolete yet.


<<the inversion is not possible with direct transitive verbs: QUEM AMA VOCE^? means 1. Who loves you? in Brazilian Portuguese but 2. Whom do you love? in Continental Portuguese).>>

? It also means "who loves you" in E.Portuguese.
"Whom do you love" would be "(a) quem você ama"...


<<Brazilians are proud of their way of using the language. They weren't able to chose the language imposed, but at least they have the liberty of using it the way they want. Brazilians will never ''obey the Lisbon-dictated grammar rules''. Get over it. >>

First of all, most Brazilians descend from Portuguese, also from many other nations. The native indigenous were the only ones to whom the language was imposed.
Portuguese language is a Brazilian heritage, the same way it's a heritage for other Portuguese speaking countries, which seem to be happy with it, no complexes... Personally, I think Brazilian should also be proud of it, it's their language. But they can trow it away, for all I care.

Just don't try to sell that it's a "new" language, because it's not.

<<Whether you call it a different language has more to do with politics than linguistics.>>

I think so too.

Moreover, Portugal has lots of regionalisms as well, informal speech is not the same everywhere. I'm not sure they can be called dialects though.

''You also won't find any Portuguese that states "Brazilian" is a different language. ''

This is not true.
Portuguese people call Brazilian Portuguese (portugues brasileiro, the linguistic/technical term of Brazil's language) simply: Brazilian (brasileiro).
This usage is even found in Houaiss dictionary.

It's not about the name of the language.
It's about the Brazilian usage.

Portuguese people consider Brazilian usage substandard, so they label it ''brasileiro'' (brazilian language).

Brazilian people don't even care about the name of the language, because it's not the most important thing. Be it brazilian or portuguese, they want brazilian usage to considered correct, and not substandard as wanted by Portuguese.

Luckily new Brazilian grammars of Portuguese are made which reflect real Brazilian usage and don't use 500 years old Lisbon rules no one in Brazil uses anymore. One of them is published by Yale University Press:
http://yalepress.yale.edu/yupbooks/book.asp?isbn=9780300091557

Portuguese people are annoyed by Brazilian usage, they think only low class people stick to that, and high class people follow Portuguese rules.
This is not true at all, all people in Brazil, from sugar cane farmer to a professor, follows the Brazilian usage, so EU TE AMO (I love you) or
EU VI ELE (I saw him), EU CHEGO EM PARIS (I arrive in Paris) are considered perfectly fine.

It's Portuguese people that object Brazilian usage, and they call it bad grammar. Bad grammar according to whom? European Portuguese can be considered bad grammar too, according to ancient Latin, and even vulgar Latin. Just like Portuguese was a product of vulgar Latin (with Arab influences), Brazilian Portuguese is a product of Portuguese (with African and Amerindian influences), but a different one, a diverging one, a new one. Soon enough, we'll have a Brazilian language, which is a dream of many Brazilians since independence, and fought by Brazilian modernist writers like Mario de Andrade or Oswald de Andrade.

Brazilians are sick of Portuguese people calling their usage substandard.
A ''substandard'' Portuguese should be changed to ''standard'' Brazilian.
So, no offense to anyone.

A Portuguese forum that steals Brazilian subtitles of American movies and translates them into Portuguese since ''Brazilian portuguese is so annoying to read'':http://legendasdivx.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=900


An article on the problem of Brazilian language (Brazilian Spoken Here)
http://www.brazzil.com/p47sep98.htm

A lingua brasileira blog:
http://lingua-brasileira.blogspot.com/

A scholar article on Brazilian language problem:
http://cienciaecultura.bvs.br/scielo.php?pid=S0009-67252005000200016&script=sci_arttext

A scientist's view (teach Portuguese or study Brazilian?)
ENSINAR PORTUGUÊS OU ESTUDAR BRASILEIRO?
http://www.marcosbagno.com.br/art_ensinar_portugues.htm


To End, a problem on Brazil's language is not a new one.
For the time being, the language is called Brazilian Portuguese, but
it is more Brazilian than Portuguese, and in future, this Portuguese designation will be dropped.

<<the Brazilian usage, so EU TE AMO (I love you) or EU VI ELE (I saw him), EU CHEGO EM PARIS (I arrive in Paris) are considered perfectly fine>>

Again, Brazil is a country of many influences, nothing wrong with that, and that's why this is acceptable. Those are clearly Spanish influences, so yeah.


<<Brazilians are sick of Portuguese people calling their usage substandard. >>

That's funny. Many Brazilian upon knowing I was from Portugal, asked me which language is spoken there, and how come I spoke Portuguese so well... If they don't even know the origins of their own language, are clueless about it, never met a European Portuguese before, how can they be sick of anything??


<<Soon enough, we'll have a Brazilian language, which is a dream of many Brazilians>>

This is really the issue here, isn't it?
Well, it does sound terrific. Good luck with that.

No, they are not Spanish influences. In Spanish the subject is usually dropped, and the direct object , when it is a pronoun, precedes the verb. It seems that Brazilian Portuguese is evolving wildy fast and the reasons are not certainly some Spanish influences.

<<Soon enough, we'll have a Brazilian language, which is a dream of many Brazilians>>

See I toldd you, they are gonna keep telling you thet they speak "brazilian" just don't believe them.

I guess people in the USA are gonna start speaking american instead of english XD.

Brazilian people cannot understand a Portuguese soap opera.
Portuguese people can understand Brazilian soap opera but they consider the language used there (colloquial Brazilian Portuguese) ''substandard, poor Portuguese, bad grammar...''

So, if you don't like it, don't watch it.
They are many articles written by Portuguese and Angolans saying ''Brazilian soap operas are killing the Portuguese language''.

''I guess people in the USA are gonna start speaking american instead of english XD.''

the name of the language is not important. in English, the US usage is as valid as UK usage...It should be the same with Portuguese. Many Portuguese people label every Brazilian usage other than ceremonial, legalese, formal
as ''substandard, incorrect, bad grammar, lousy usage...'' Grow up!
The language used in our soap operas and our sitcoms reflects our usage. We won't follow Continental Portuguese rules because it's not our language.
The same is true of the language used in American soap operas, and sitcoms. Don't like it, don't watch it...But it's American usage. People could care about some rules written in London and Lisbon 200 years ago.

''I guess people in the USA are gonna start speaking american instead of english XD.''

the name of the language is not important. in English, the US usage is as valid as UK usage...It should be the same with Portuguese. Many Portuguese people label every Brazilian usage other than ceremonial, legalese, formal
as ''substandard, incorrect, bad grammar, lousy usage...'' Grow up!
The language used in our soap operas and our sitcoms reflects our usage. We won't follow the Continental Portuguese rules because it's not our language.
The same is true of the language used in American soap operas, and sitcoms. Don't like it, don't watch it...But it's the American usage. People could care less about some rules written in London/Oxford and Lisbon/Coimbra 200 years ago.
A gente ta nem ai!Sacou???

<<People could care less about some rules written in London/Oxford and Lisbon/Coimbra 200 years ago.
A gente ta nem ai!Sacou???>>

Written rules? 200 years ago?

You didn't get my point, Brazilians calling their language "Brazilian" is as absurd as Canadians calling their language "Canadian" or Colombians calling their language "Colombian".

Really, and SouthAfricans calling their language Afrikaans is absurd too?
Or should be called SouthernAmerican Dutch?

You cannot compare different things.
What are the striking differences between Canadian and British English syntax, or word order or pronouns usage? Hardly any difference. Unlike, Continental Portuguese vs Brazilian Portuguese or Swiss German vs High German or Afrikaans vs Dutch.

Afrikaans is more different from Dutch than Brazilian Portuguese form Portuguese, a lot more. But if it was Dutch , it should be Southern African Dutch, not Southern American Dutch.

Compare different things? That's exactly it, those are not different things.

As far as I know, Portuguese language supports all that differences in syntax and word's order. It's not like English, there's no "right way" of saying things, you have like two or three options.
And these differences exist between regions in Brazil as well.


How come you don't know that? You people are so absorbed in building your own little world, so biased, that you don't even realize that your ignorance is showing. Not to mention your bitterness.

--And these differences exist between regions in Brazil as well. --

this is not very true, Brazilian Portuguese (as well as US English) is pretty homogeneous/uniform compared to Continental Portuguese (and British English)...