"e" in "investment" same to "u"
<<Yes, this reminds me of something. I have heard someone saying "stummic" for "stomach".>>
Yes, that's how I pronounce it. If I spelled it according to English spelling rules it'd be "stummic(k)." That's ["stVmIk] in X-SAMPA. I would never pronounce it *["stVm@k] and actually find it difficult to say [@] in that position since it's unnatural for me.
I myself also pronounce "stomach" as /"stVmIk/ -> ["stV~:.mIk], and likewise find [@] in the second syllable of such to be quite weird, one way or another.
The second "e" is unstressed, so becomes a schwa [@] for me.
Like Kirk, I say "stummic" for stomach. How would you pronounce it, eito?
Guest Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:38 am GMT
The second "e" is unstressed, so becomes a schwa [@] for me.
so that's a schwa, is it just like Travis said "the "a"s in "above", "about", and "facility", as well as the "o" in "love" are all the same, all being /@/ (realized as [@] when unstressed, as [V] when stressed".
so that's a same sound to " u" in " shut", I mean the second "e" in " investment", but it still sound strange to me, can someone record this word and put it online, and I can listen to it, that will help a lot.
>>so that's a same sound to " u" in " shut", I mean the second "e" in " investment", but it still sound strange to me, can someone record this word and put it online, and I can listen to it, that will help a lot.<<
The thing is that in many if not most North American English dialects, the second "e" in "investment" *does not* have [V] or [@], but rather has [I] or [1], despite what your dictionary may happen to say. Even if they are *phonemically* the same, which varies depending on one's interpretation of phonological phenomena in NAE, they are most certainly not *pronounced* the same.
>>Like Kirk, I say "stummic" for stomach. How would you pronounce it, eito? <<
I would try to pronounce it acording to IPA shown in my dictionarys. Personally, I would like to avoid "stummic", if possible.
Thanx, Kirk, when you say "about" "about" "facility", the "a" sounds like the "er" sound without "r",and "o" in "love"" stomach" like [V], and the second "e" in investment just like the first "e" in investment.I don't know if that's right. let me know, please!
<<Thanx, Kirk, when you say "about" "about" "facility", the "a" sounds like the "er" sound without "r",and "o" in "love"" stomach" like [V], and the second "e" in investment just like the first "e" in investment.I don't know if that's right. let me know, please!>>
My second "e" in "investment" is [I] (as in "hit") and my first one is [E] (as in "desk"). I hope my recording was helpful--if you want me to clarify on anything else just ask :)
so when you say "about" "about" "facility", the "a" sounds like the "er" sound without "r",and "o" in "love"" stomach" like [V], and the second "e" in investment just like the "I".
If what I think is right, I will get it.
<<so when you say "about" "about" "facility", the "a" sounds like the "er" sound without "r",and "o" in "love"" stomach" like [V], and the second "e" in investment just like the "I".
If what I think is right, I will get it.>>
Yes, you're right on all those--that's how I pronounce those :) Keep in mind that some English speakers have a schwa (the "er" sound without the "r") for the second "e" in "investment" but many North Americans like me don't--instead we have [I] there.
<< Keep in mind that some English speakers have a schwa (the "er" sound without the "r") for the second "e" in "investment" >>
I am in western massachusett now, my tutor told me there is not such sound in English, just like Travis said
http://www.antimoon.com/forum/t919.htm, but when I ask my teacher in California, he told me the "a" sound in "about" is different to "u" in "shut", so which way I should do, pronunce all that just like Traivs' way, or like Kirk's(a schwa (the "er" sound without the "r" for the about and the similar word)?
Thanx!
<<I am in western massachusett now, my tutor told me there is not such sound in English, just like Travis said
http://www.antimoon.com/forum/t919.htm, but when I ask my teacher in California, he told me the "a" sound in "about" is different to "u" in "shut",>>
Yes, one is stressed and the other isn't. Otherwise they are articulatorily very similar or identical.
<<so which way I should do, pronunce all that just like Traivs' way, or like Kirk's(a schwa (the "er" sound without the "r" for the about and the similar word)?
Thanx!>>
I think you may be slightly confused--Travis and I have the same pronunciations for "shut" and "about." We both have /@/ --> [V] for the vowel in "shut" and /@/ ---> [@] for the first vowel in "about."
In North American English, [V] and [@] are essentially the same vowel said in the same part of the mouth, but [V] is in stressed position in [@] is in unstressed position. This is not true of British English, where [V] is articulatorily noticeably different from [@], with [V] being noticeably lower in the vowel space in the mouth.
Anyway, they are not phonemically distinctive, since they occur in complementary distribution (their sound environments don't overlap).
Here's me saying the following words. Notice the vowels in the two are largely similar but one is in stressed position and the other isn't for each pair:
http://uploadhut.com/view.php/395631.wav
"shun"
"chenille"
"utter"
"atone"
"mush"
"machine"
eito(jpn) Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:39 am GMT
>>Like Kirk, I say "stummic" for stomach. How would you pronounce it, eito? <<
I would try to pronounce it acording to IPA shown in my dictionarys. Personally, I would like to avoid "stummic", if possible.
Why? That's pretty much how everyone says it. I don't know of any other pronunciations.