have you started to learn chinese?

U3   Tuesday, February 01, 2005, 08:31 GMT
good job Steve!

To David Winter:obviously,your family haven't teach you how to commucate with other people politely,and you'll receive my middle finger!if you have the opportunity to come to Beijing,just let me know ,I'm sure you would go back in cold casket!By the way,I'm in Beijing,China.And FUCK YOUR MOTHER LIKE PEOPLE USING BUSES!
everybody,I'm sorry I said some dirty words but I just let some people like David Winter know that we chinese'll never silent again,now we are more and more powerful,if it's necessary,we can launch a war,whatever,war will let the world know the power of China,no matter the opponent is japan or usa or some countries.I don't want to talk about politics but if somebody refer politic,then that's my politics.I know someone will not like this post,but I still want to say:David Winter,YOU KISS MY YELLOW ASS!
Recruit   Tuesday, February 01, 2005, 09:17 GMT
U3
That's right. David Winter is definitely not a welcome person. But I don't think you are a real chinese man, because as I know , they are friendly and modest, they like peace.
Oro   Tuesday, February 01, 2005, 13:37 GMT
Thanks, Steve.

Well, now it sounds more reasonable.
Ori   Tuesday, February 01, 2005, 13:39 GMT
Sorry, it was me. Bloody Enter.
Jim   Wednesday, February 02, 2005, 03:58 GMT
Steve K,

I hate to sound arrogant or to be making out as if I know better but it's not your view on whether Japanese has tones or not that I'm talking about. I'm only concerned about the reality.

I'm completely aware of the fact that they are "not so crucial to making yourself understood" as I've stated. I never worry about them and I'm understood: context is unsually sufficient. I even met a Japanese kid once who was surprised to hear that they exist.*

They do, however, exist but why take it from me? Ask a Japanese person. My guess, though, would be that they'll tell you what so many of them have told me. Tones exist in Japanese.

* It wasn't me who told him, by the way, but a Japanese woman.
Steve K   Wednesday, February 02, 2005, 06:40 GMT

Jim
I am always happy to be corrected and to learn something. I will make
some enquiries and report back.
Jim   Wednesday, February 02, 2005, 07:25 GMT
Steve K,

Me too. I look forward to your report.
Steve K   Wednesday, February 02, 2005, 14:41 GMT
I have not yet surveyed any Japanese people but found information on on Wikipedia which I have pasted below.

It seems to me that this pitch or accent is quite different from tones in Chinese which are, in the case of Mandarin
High flat
Low rising
Low falling and rising
High falling

All of these tones exist in English, by the way, but for emphasis in a sentence not to distinguish the meaning of words.

From Wikipedia
Accent is sometimes taught to non-Japanese learners of Japanese, but it is never taught to the Japanese themselves in grade school, so most of them are not explicitly aware of its existence. Most Japanese people who are not linguists will deny that there is any variation in pitch between Japanese syllables, since Japanese is not a tonal language like Chinese. Unfortunately, this does not necessarily mean they'll understand you if you say KA-ki ("oyster") when you should say ka-KI ("persimmon"). They realize that they do pronounce these two words differently, but curiously enough, attribute this to a difference not of pitch but of kanji.

[edit]
Examples of words which differ only in pitch
These examples are in standard (Kantō) Japanese.

Accent on first syllable Accent elsewhere, or accentless
I-ma 今 now i-MA 居間 (Western style) living room
SA-ke 鮭 salmon sa-ke 酒 alcohol, sake
NI-ho-n 二本 (counter for two long thin objects) ni-HO-n 日本 Japan
HA-shi 箸 chopsticks ha-SHI 橋 bridge
KA-ki 牡蠣 oyster ka-ki 柿 persimmon