Is it easy to learn Italian?

Sigma   Tuesday, June 07, 2005, 05:30 GMT
There are official 5 vowel (a, e, i, o, u) in Spanish plus 2 more not recognized as such but they act as vowels (y,ü,) that gives a total of 7 vowels too.
Alejandro   Tuesday, June 07, 2005, 06:22 GMT
Para Siga:
Hey...Soy Mexicano también, pero no creo que haya siete vocales, las vocalen en castellano son cinco, creo que a las que te refieres son a la semivoca "Y" como cuando dices "cayó" (castellano de méxico, en argentino no sería semivocal). Y la "ü", creo que te refieres a las palabras como vergüenza, pero esto sigue siendo el mismo sonido de la u, lleva dieresis porque la u se pronuncia...solo por eso...No son para nada otros sonidos.

Puede haber otros sonidos vocálicos, pero son alófonos, no son fonemas propios de la lengua... Por ejemplo en la palabra "cómo", la primera "o" es abierta y la última es cerrada. Pero repito son alófonos.
Kazoo   Tuesday, June 07, 2005, 06:32 GMT
<<The pronunciation is pretty tricky as well. Standard language (spoken in Tuscany and Rome) has 2 types of e (open and closed one) and 2 types of o (open and closed one), that is, 7 vowels (unlike 5 vowels in Spanish)>>

If it is an English speaker who started this thread, 7 vowels shouldn't be too hard. There are at least 12 in English, I think it's 12.
Sigma   Tuesday, June 07, 2005, 06:42 GMT
No es necesario que sean otros sonidos para ser consideradas como "vocales clandestinas" la Y es una consonate, pero su sonido es el mismo que la de la i, Sonya, Sonia, y la ü con la diéresis arriba hace presente el sonido "hue" en palabras como cigüena, pingüino, sin la ü el sonido sería el de "ge", pueden ser consideradas semivocales en el apartado escrito, ya que idiomas como sueco e italiano tienen mas vocales, pero la diferencia es en como la escriben, el sonido es el mismo en algunas. Por ejemplo en sueco la vocal o y la vocal å es el mismo (sonido o), pero la diferencia radica en que por leyes gramaticales lo divideron en 2 vocales a la hora de escribirlo, pero a la hora de pronunciarlo es exactamente el mismo sonido. Por eso las letra Ü e Y pueden ser consideradas vocales a la hora de la escritura y no lo digo yo, compañeros extranjeros me han dicho eso, que para ellos es mas fácil considerarlas vocales, que consonantes.

En cuanto a la Y de argentina, ellos la pronuncian como "SH" nosotros en español mexicano decimos yo (pronunciamos como "LL") por ende ellos dicen "sho" o la "shave" nostros decimos "llo" la "llave".
Y el vos que ellos usan tanto es el equivalente de tu.

Saludos
JGreco   Tuesday, June 07, 2005, 22:48 GMT
>>Sigma<<

In Panama that equivalent would sound like "Djo" la "Djave" for the "llo la "llave.
greg   Tuesday, June 07, 2005, 23:15 GMT
mjd : why are there ads above the titles of the threads ?
Adam   Wednesday, June 08, 2005, 18:24 GMT
Italian is easy, even for English-speakers.

It's simple to know the gender of a word. Most words that end in "o" are maculine, most words that end in "a" are feminine.

Masculine words have "i" on the end for the plural -
e.g. "letto" (bed) "letti" (beds)

and feminine words have "e" for the plural -
e.g. "porta" (door) "porte" (doors)

Simple.

The definite articles are -

il (masculine singular) "il letto" "The bed"
i (masculine plural) " i letti" "The beds"

la (feminine singular) "La porta" "The door"
le (feminine plural) "Le porte" "The doors"

lo (for masculine words that begin with "s+consonant" and a few others that I can't remember) - "Lo spaghetti" "Lo studente"

gli (the plural of "lo" and also for plural words that beging with a vowel) - "Gli studenti" "The students" "Gli italiani" "The Italians"


Also, it's very easy to match adjectives with their nouns.

red wine = il vino rosso
red pen - la penna rossa
yellow door - la porta gialla
yellow doors - le porte gialle
red wines - i vini rossi
Adam   Wednesday, June 08, 2005, 18:26 GMT
Actually, it should be "gli spaghetti" because it is plural.
Adam   Wednesday, June 08, 2005, 18:37 GMT
Italian is MUCH easier to learn to read than English. English is the most difficult European language to learn to read. Children from other European countries learn to speak their words probably about two to three years before children from English-speaking countries, and there is a much higher rate of dyslexia in English-speaking nations than in nations who speak other European languages.

Italian is a phonetic language, which means that every word is pronounced as it is spelt, whereas in English that is not the case.

There are a lot more sounds in English, too, compared with Italian.
Cro Magnon   Wednesday, June 08, 2005, 18:50 GMT
I'm not sure that English is that hard. Certainly it's not a phonetic language, and there's a lot of oddball exceptions. But Spanish verbs are much harder than English, and I ASSume Italian is the same way.
Tiffany   Wednesday, June 08, 2005, 19:34 GMT
I wil concur that the Italian verb system is as messy and difficult as the Spanish one. There are 14 verb "modes" to learn in Italian... and yes, you can imagine that every verb is replicated within these fourteen modes. Thankfully, not all are present in everyday use.

I do agree with Adam that children in Italy learn to read, recognize and spell words more easily and at somewhat of a younger age then English speaking children solely because their language is phonetic. They start SPEAKING however Adam, around the same time.
*   Wednesday, June 08, 2005, 19:38 GMT
17 verb modes in spanish
Sigma   Wednesday, June 08, 2005, 20:49 GMT
Well Spanish is my mother language and I think for what I seen that Italian it's so much easier than Spanish.
Tiffany   Wednesday, June 08, 2005, 21:43 GMT
Than* if you can spot the error.

Sigma, I think it's purely subjective how easy or not a language is to you.

*, one of the hardest things in Italian to memorize in Italian, besides the verb modes, is which auxillary verb (essere or stare) a certain verb takes in tenses like passato prossimo. It's like French in this respect (passe composse - I know I forgot the accents). Does Spanish have this?
*   Wednesday, June 08, 2005, 22:45 GMT
Yes, ser and estar and haber
To be = ser or estar

I am dead - estoy muerto "not" soy muerto
I am a computer expert - soy informatico not estoy informatico
I am writing - estoy escribiendo "not" soy escribiendo


Passé composé (french)
j´ai voulu
tu as voulu
il a voulu

Passato prossimo (italian)
io ho avuto
tu hai avuto
lei ha avuto

P. perfecto compuesto (spanish)
Yo he visto
Tu has visto
El ha visto

Presente indicativo pasivo (spanish)
Yo soy visto
Tu eres visto
el es visto