He Learned A Language In A Week

AL   Tue Feb 03, 2009 2:44 am GMT
The autistic savant, Daniel Paul Tammet, learned a new language, Icelandic, in one week. He was tested on Icelandic television and easily passed the tests. He is suppose to speak 11 languages.

Do you have any comments or related data.
impossible   Tue Feb 03, 2009 8:00 am GMT
Do you have any comments or related data.

No comment
tryst   Tue Feb 03, 2009 8:05 am GMT
He didn't learn the language in a week. Maybe he got down the fundamentals and could carry out a decent conversation, but he didn't become fluent in it (at least according to my definition of LEARNING a language).
jella   Tue Feb 03, 2009 9:47 am GMT
a decent conversation,

I'd say he could carry out a very basic conversation in a week
hai07hn@gmail.com   Tue Feb 03, 2009 10:33 am GMT
oh, He had learned that language faster than PC. In the truth, his IQ is very hight
Achab   Tue Feb 03, 2009 11:40 am GMT
I haven't so far seen this Daniel Tammet guy able to produce any terrific feat, the kind of feat that only high-funtioning autistic savants are supposed to be capable of performing.

He claims he can learn a new language in a few days. So what? This is something that more or less anyone writing in this message board can do. Not up to a level of native-like proficiency, of course. But once again, so what? I don't really think that's the level up to which he learned Icelandic in just a week.

His pretended ability to learn languages that fast has led anyway to the creation of a series of language courses sold by himself.

I once watched an episode of the show hosted by David Letterman where Tammet was a guest. He was basically pitching the woo at the people who didn't know anything about mnemonics.

His "routine" was about calculating the day of the week you are born on based on your birthdate. He took him about five seconds to do that.

Wow, isn't this feat way beyond the mental grasp of people with an average intelligence?

Well, no, gimme a break, that's not the case. Let's get a grip here, shall we? It's simply an old mnemonic gimmick that we non-autistic savant people can learn in about an afternoon by reading a book describing the technique. There are many. For example, Bruno Furst's classic "Stop Forgetting" may have a chapter on it, but I could be mistaken.

By the way, most autistic savants are extremely shy and won't travel the world to show off their special abilities, unless they do it under the tutelage of their parents.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that the parents of autistic savants are shrewd business people taking advantage of their children. What I'm saying is that they make good use of autism's brightside in order to raise money to better deal with the medical expenses of autism's downside.

To me, Daniel Tammet looks like a travelling one-man carnival rather than an extremely shy boy being pushed onto the stage by other people for his own good.

After all, he has gone on to say, "My life used to be very simple and regimented but since then I have travelled constantly and given lots of lectures and it just changed me, this whole process".

It sounds like the variety of autism that affected him was rather mild, huh?

Leaving aside whether this guy is a real autistic savant or another Piano Man, if there's anything about him that can be singled out and studied in order to improve our skills in language acquisition, well, it still has to come up.

With happy February wishes,

Achab
Pete   Wed Feb 04, 2009 1:58 am GMT
It irks me whenever I hear that someone "speaks n>=4 languages *fluently*" Most likely they only speak 2 or 3 "fluently" the rest proably quite *badly* if at all. Some people will cheat and say things like they know 5 languages fluently: English, Dutch, Flemish, Norwegian, and Swedish. Where Dutch/Flemish and Norwegia/Swedish realistically should only be counted as 2 languages rather than 4.
razto   Wed Feb 04, 2009 2:05 am GMT
He should've said he "learned Icelandic FOR a week" and not "learned Icelandic IN a week". There's a big difference!
AL   Wed Feb 04, 2009 3:38 am GMT
From Wikipedia:

"Tammet holds the European record for reciting pi from memory to 22,514 digits in five hours and nine minutes."

If he can do this, then perhaps it can be believed that he can learn a language in a week.
AL   Wed Feb 04, 2009 3:43 am GMT
Pete said:

"Some people will cheat and say things like they know 5 languages fluently:"

Instead of saying "cheat", I would have said "stretch the truth".
AL   Wed Feb 04, 2009 4:16 am GMT
<< impossible >>

<< He didn't learn the language in a week. >>

etc etc

Your entrenched views of this world, is what holds you back.
Achab   Wed Feb 04, 2009 11:05 am GMT
From Wikipedia:

"Tammet holds the European record for reciting pi from memory to 22,514 digits in five hours and nine minutes."

Reciting a very long list of words or numbers is another mnemonics gimmick. Alas, it's probably the most classic memonics trick ever.

Since the guy has still to prove that his natural memory is orders of magnitude superior to that of the average person, and since mnemonics techniques, rather powerful to learn by heart a long list of random words or numbers, are exceedingly less effective when applied to learning a foreign language, I think it's reasonable to believe that he didn't really acquire Icelandic to an advanced level in just a week.

The problem with mnemonics gimmicks is that they're useful for... useless tasks. They're hardly any good if you're trying to gain a serious education in a field that requires more than rote memorization. Something they're pretty great for is close-up magic involving a deck of playing cards. Also, hire a magician to entertain you and your friends after a business dinner. He'll probably read your mind to discover which day of the week you're born on. "Think about your birthdate... Concentrate..."

Anyway, let's say that he studied the language for only seven days and that yes, he ended up with an impressive proficiency. Are you sure he was a total beginner? I mean, are you sure he hadn't studied Icelandic or a very similar language before, maybe for even a few months? It can't be ruled out. So much for the scientific importance of Tammet's showmanship.

I'm not an autistic savant and what I want are techniques that people like me can use to empower themselves in the task of learning a foreign language. If Tammet can really acquire his L2 of choice that fast, well, tell me about his methods and let me see if I can copy them.

I think such methods will never come up, because there just aren't there. In fact, the Daniel Tammel story that we're discussing can't fall but into one of the following three scenarios:

(A) He's not a real autistic savant and never actually did what some people pretend he did.

(B) He's an actual autistic savant but never pulled the terrific stunt in question since not even autistic savants are capable of that.

(C) He's an actual autistic savant and really made it, but it all stems from his condition, and his mental processes can't be emulated by those who are not affected by it.

With every good wish,

Achab
AL   Thu Feb 05, 2009 2:44 am GMT
Some notes adapted from the Extraordinary People website:

Daniel Paul Tammet claims to see colours and sparks, which he can somehow relate to words and numbers. So this is an indication that he uses techniques in addition to mnemonics.


Daniel claims that since the age of four, he has been able to do huge mathematical calculations in his head. In one test, he was asked to calculate 37 raised to the power of 4. He completed this in less than a minute, giving the correct answer of 1,874,161. While considering the question, it was observed that, he appeared to be drawing shapes on the table with his finger. When asked about this, he explained that he could see the numbers as shapes and colours in his mind. This is known as synethsesia. So again , an indication that he uses techniques in addition to mnemonics.

In another test he was asked to divide 13 by 97. This time the testers/researchers had the answer to 32 decimal places, Daniel gave the answer and continued beyond 32. He claims he can do the calculations to 100 decimal places.

He appears to be doing the mathematical calculations without actually thinking about it, which seems preposterous, but if true, blows away scientific theory.

Daniel's talents do not stop at numbers. He is very gifted with words and speaks nine languages and claims to be able to learn a new one in just seven days. To put this to the test, Daniel travelled with reseachers/testers to Iceland for a week. His Icelandic tutor described their language as immensely complex and considered it an impossibility for anyone to learn in only one week. Daniel Tammet was to appear on an Icelandic talk show at the end of his week to discuss his experience in their native tongue. Although he appeared to struggle to begin with, in the last few days his tutor said "He was like a sponge, absorbing all words and grammar at a phenomenal rate". He made his television appearance with great success.
Plato   Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:17 am GMT
Maybe he was a native speaker of those languages in past lives and for some reason he became aware of that knowledge that is somewhere inside our minds but most of us can't remember, only a few very talented people ...
typets   Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:34 am GMT
<<Maybe he was a native speaker of those languages in past lives and for some reason he became aware of that knowledge that is somewhere inside our minds but most of us can't remember, only a few very talented people ... >>

Maybe he's a phantom overlord from the galaxy core seeking revenge in the far reaches of known space...