villages of France

just a comment   Thu May 28, 2009 3:10 am GMT
"To soemone who knows nothing about the "real" France, these all look quintessentially French: "


I think that thinking quintessential "France" as being soly the part of it that is north of Paris in such regions as Normandy and Picardy (where the ambiance is somehow closer to Belgium or England than to most of the country, Paris included) has something to see with the fact that many foreign people (at least here) tend to focus "Frenchness" with its northernmost parts, it is the same concerning the language or some claims we saw on this forum. France is seen as much more "northern" than it is the same way the language is thought to be less romance than it is (or thinking some things like that french people descend mainly of germanic Franks). I think many tend to think France as being germanic or somehow mixed latin-germanic because it their mind the image of the country is linked with those tipical images of the northern fringe of France that evoques generally more Germanic nations than latin ones. The reason why Normandy or Picardy are seen as quintessencial france is probably due to a question of proximity: these regions are those that "border" germanic Europe.

Also I saw many people that thought that France was geographically more or less aligned to Germany or England in latitudes. Those people seemed somehow surprised when I pointed out that Paris, (which has about 90% of french territory south of it) is as southern than Germany's most southern cities such as Munich or Austrian capital Vienna. And than actually most other big french cities are aligned more with northern Italian cities such as Turin, Milan or Venice (Lyon, Bordeaux, Grenoble), while the southern big cities are aligned with central Italy (Marseille, Toulouse, Nice, Toulon).


To come back to the thema of towns that were "in-between" the two main roof constructive traditions in France, the central region of Poitou-Charentes give us some interesting exemples "north-western" kind of french architectures spread within cities with dominant "mediterranean" roofings:

http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/11201008.jpg
http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/11173167.jpg
http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/9289282.jpg
European   Thu May 28, 2009 4:28 am GMT
"Also I saw many people that thought that France was geographically more or less aligned to Germany or England in latitudes. Those people seemed somehow surprised when I pointed out that Paris, (which has about 90% of french territory south of it) is as southern than Germany's most southern cities such as Munich or Austrian capital Vienna. And than actually most other big french cities are aligned more with northern Italian cities such as Turin, Milan or Venice (Lyon, Bordeaux, Grenoble), while the southern big cities are aligned with central Italy (Marseille, Toulouse, Nice, Toulon). "

Don“t you think that the Loire river is a cultural barrier dividing Northern "Germanic" France from Southern "Latin" France? The roofs, the climate, agriculture and soil, and language are also divided by this river, no matter the four points of the compass.
west pondian   Thu May 28, 2009 5:14 am GMT
<<Those people seemed somehow surprised when I pointed out that Paris, (which has about 90% of french territory south of it) is as southern than Germany's most southern cities such as Munich or Austrian capital Vienna.>>


Paris is still way up north, compared to places on this side of the pond. I live in the far northern US not all that far from the Canadian border, and the latitude here (41.92N) is about the same as the Vatican (41.91N). In fact, Paris is over 100 miles farther north than Quebec City (which, BTW, is where we get our idea of what France looks like -- this was pointed out by someone earlier in this thread).

In addition, since Paris is only about 17.8 degrees below the arctic circle, it never gets "officially" dark at the time of the summer solstice (Sun needs to be 18 degrees below the horizon for astronomical twilight to end).
just a message   Thu May 28, 2009 9:27 am GMT
" Paris is still way up north, compared to places on this side of the pond. I live in the far northern US not all that far from the Canadian border, and the latitude here (41.92N) is about the same as the Vatican (41.91N). In fact, Paris is over 100 miles farther north than Quebec City (which, BTW, is where we get our idea of what France looks like -- this was pointed out by someone earlier in this thread). "

Yes, in absolute terms all of Europe is very north, especially when compared to areas in north America. Even southern Europe is very northern (the very southern Naples in southern Italy is in-line with New York city, in northern USA... but definitly different climates)

I was of course speaking at European scale, Paris (which relatively yti the rest of france is very north) in in-line with the most southern German cities, or with Austria... which are yet not really northern European areas.
saying 90% of France is south of Munich is a surpise for some, including Germans themselves who tend to think France just west to them.



" Don“t you think that the Loire river is a cultural barrier dividing Northern "Germanic" France from Southern "Latin" France? The roofs, the climate, agriculture and soil, and language are also divided by this river, no matter the four points of the compass. "


Loire is often said to be a limit between northern and southern France (even if it concerns mainly the western part).
Said that it is of course not a barrier, or a limit between germanic and latin cultures since both sides are part of a same latin culture.
That is not a linguistic either barrier, since both sides speak the same oil romance language, while oil/oc limit is much southern, near Bordeaux/Valence line (+massif central). Concerning climate, actually the limit is not there either; in south-western France the climate is an oceanic like in north-western, just a bit warmer, the transition is progressive. The mediterranean climate is in south east, starting from Valence.
guest guest   Thu May 28, 2009 9:02 pm GMT
The Loire-limit is quite abstract, even concerning the roofs toppings, they don't really follow this limt. Berry, big parts of Auvergne and Limousin, northern Poitou, are south of Loire, but show more northern architectural features. Some southern features can be found in Lorraine... And concerning the east of France the Loire limit doesn't exist. Southern Burgondy make the transition to Lyonnais.

Actuall I think there are different points of view concerning the north/south limits in Europe.



1. Natural point of view:

A. Rivers: two rivers: Loire in France, and Danube in central/eastern Europe divides Europe in two halfs:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/00/Europe-sud-fleuves.jpg

B. Climate: the mediterranean climate (orange), and other non-mediterranean climates (oceanic and continental) that have mediterranean influences:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c6/Europe-sud-climats.jpg



2. Cultural aspects

A. Language: Romance(blue), Greek+south slavic(green) / Germanic+Slavic
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/7f/SEUROPE2.jpg

B. Religions: Catholic / Protestant+Orthodox
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3e/Europe-sud-religion.jpg

C. Architecture: "Roman"-roofs / Others
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e7/Europe-sud-tuiles.jpg

D. Legal aspects: legal systems in europe
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/46/Europa_Rechtskreise.png



3. Cuisine (linked to natural aspects (climate) + to cultural/historic aspects )

A. Beverages: tradictionally Wine-producing (red: northern limit of vineyard growing) and wine-drinking areas.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0c/Europe-sud-vin.jpg

B. Oil consumption: traditionally olive-producing regions
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/60/Europe-sud-olive.jpg
Guest   Thu May 28, 2009 10:18 pm GMT
. Architecture: "Roman"-roofs / Others
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e7/Europe-sud-tuiles.jpg


En que categorķa cultural entran los que usan techos de uralita?
nico   Fri May 29, 2009 10:29 am GMT
To answer your quesition, all these villages are french so they are ll typical.
nico   Fri May 29, 2009 10:29 am GMT
To answer your quesition, all these villages are french so they are ll typical.
pour vous   Fri May 29, 2009 2:28 pm GMT
M Blanck   Fri May 29, 2009 2:51 pm GMT
<<To answer your quesition, all these villages are french so they are ll typical. >>

Is every village in France typical? Aren't there some unusual villages (high-altitude, extremely old, brand new, etc.)?
just a comment   Fri Jun 05, 2009 9:25 am GMT
" Is every village in France typical? Aren't there some unusual villages (high-altitude, extremely old, brand new, etc.)? "


Of course there are unusual villages. We were speaking here about "traditionnal" vernacular villages, villages that were existing since enought time to show some historical continuity until today.
Of course, in every village the construcion were different in different periods of times. Generally, the city centers are older and more representative to a specific ambiance than the preipherical areas made of highways, industrial modern houses and modern supermarkets. Said that, in each region there is generally a specific re-interpretation of the local traditional construction in building of more modern areas.


Of course there are been also some architectural expreiments, such as for some balnear stations in the 70's for exemple; la grande motte

http://www.guidesdumidi.com/diaporama/albums/guide_ete05/GRANDE_MOTTE1.jpg
http://www.web-provence.com/autour/grande-motte-6.jpg

We canno't really say that it is representative of France (even if in my opinion this kind of 70's architecture is quite specifically french)
Ouest   Fri Jun 05, 2009 12:27 pm GMT
just a comment Thu May 28, 2009 3:10 am GMT
"To soemone who knows nothing about the "real" France, these all look quintessentially French: "


I think that thinking quintessential "France" as being soly the part of it that is north of Paris in such regions as Normandy and Picardy (where the ambiance is somehow closer to Belgium or England than to most of the country, Paris included) has something to see with the fact that many foreign people (at least here) tend to focus "Frenchness" with its northernmost parts, it is the same concerning the language or some claims we saw on this forum. France is seen as much more "northern" than it is the same way the language is thought to be less romance than it is (or thinking some things like that french people descend mainly of germanic Franks). I think many tend to think France as being germanic or somehow mixed latin-germanic because it their mind the image of the country is linked with those tipical images of the northern fringe of France that evoques generally more Germanic nations than latin ones. The reason why Normandy or Picardy are seen as quintessencial france is probably due to a question of proximity: these regions are those that "border" germanic Europe.
______________________________________
So you think, too, that Northern France might be germanic or somehow mixed latin-germanic?
just a comment   Fri Jun 05, 2009 9:01 pm GMT
" So you think, too, that Northern France might be germanic or somehow mixed latin-germanic? "


If by "northern France" you mean the very northern regions of Picardy-Nord-pas-de-Calais (those north than Paris) (to which we could had Normandy thanks to Vikings), it is clear that they show visible germanic influences, and that concerning these regions we can speak of a sort of latin-germanic mixed culture, or even fully germanic some decades ago in french Flanders.

To me, who live in Paris, Pas-de-Calais region has often more to see with Belgium, Netherlands or even England than to my city in a lot of aspects (flemish/red-brick architectures, lots of germanic looking city names, beer-drinking culture, fries, flemish/Dutch cooking, etc) (Cf. see the movie "bienvenue chez les Ch'ti" to understand how this region is seen quite foreign for the rest of the country). Alsace and parts of Lorraine also can be considered to have a sort of latin-germanic culture (German-like, while Nord-pas-de-Calais is more Flemish/Dutch-like)
In a lesser extend Normandy, due to the viking influence could also.



But if by "northern France", you mean the whole northern half, or even the part north of Loire valley only, I clearly don't agree.
This question is a non se   Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:07 pm GMT
What does mean typical? where ever you are in France, you still are in France and everything you see is french.
bo Ridley   Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:42 pm GMT