One Language, but two cultures...

Wondering...   Sun May 02, 2010 7:54 pm GMT
Dutch is spoken in both the Netherlands and in Belgium. I know that there is a difference in the accent between Dutch and Flemish, but

a. Do Flemish people have their own translations of foreign books?
b. Do Dutch people use Dutch or English in Belgium (French?).
c. What are the real (if any) cultural differences between Dutch speakers and Flemish speakers?

Thank-you for your opinion(s).
Baldewin   Sun May 02, 2010 8:13 pm GMT
a. No! We share each other's literature.
b. They speak Dutch. We speak the same language.
c. The Netherlands and Flanders are no homogeneous entities. Flemish is not a separate and some people don't like it when you call their language as if it were.
Wondering...   Sun May 02, 2010 8:37 pm GMT
Baldewin,
Recently I read about a Belgian (Dutch speaker) guy who claims there is such a difference. I posted this because I don't know what differences he means.
Howard Whittaker   Sun May 02, 2010 8:44 pm GMT
The only Flemish to have a different culture from the Netherlanders are a good following of those Belgium Francophones, who are actually in fact Frenchified self-hating Flems. If Belgium was divided by Flemish descent v Walloon descent, then Belgium is actually something like 80% Flemish and only 20% Walloon!! Even Switzerland which is way way way more majority German then French has its self-hating Frenchified German Swiss and towns and whole imperialist Frenchified cantons like Fribourg and Wallis.
Mekanik   Sun May 02, 2010 11:56 pm GMT
Here's my opinion about the subject:

Linguistically, I would venture to say that Dutch and Flemish are one language. Yes, Flemish has some grammatical and colloquial differences from Dutch, but those differences do not constitute enough of a barrier between the two and do not justify classifying Flemish as a seperate language.

Culturally, however, is where there is a notable difference between the Flemings and the Hollanders. I say Hollanders to simplify the comparison, let's just go with them for now.

I know this is going to sound cliche, but to me, the Flemings has that Burgundian approach to life.
As opposed to the no-frills and northern-European psyche of Hollanders who place more importance on frugality, practicality, and Protestant work ethic, the Flemings tend to have a more latinate psyche that places more importance on joie-de-vivre and "la dolce vita", with more elaborate and French-influenced cuisine as well as a general non-chalance and relaxed attitude that is reminiscent of Catholic societies.

In other words:

1-Religion, being Protestant among Hollanders and Catholic among Flemings
2-Previous Spanish conquest, which endured longer in Belgium than in the Netherlands
3-French Influence, which was more prominent and pronounced in Belgium than in the Netherlands

This combination of factors imparted a more latinate/Burgundian vibe in Belgium, but left the Netherlands with a more Germanic vibe that feels closer to Germany and Scandinavia.

Now, obviously, both Hollanders and Flemings are ethnically Germanic, but I'm talking about the culture and lifestyle.
Original Poster   Mon May 03, 2010 12:47 am GMT
That makes sense. Thank-you.
PARISIENS   Mon May 03, 2010 10:51 am GMT
The language used by the media and taught at school is absolutely the same standard Dutch in the Netherlands and Flanders. There are a number of differences in accent, pronunciation, idioms, colloquial expressions, that's just like the relationship Am./Br. English or Eur./Québec French, but people of both nations understand each other perfectly when they need to.

Contrary to a popular assumption, there is a Catholic majority in the Netherlands. It used to be otherwise two hundred years ago, when the Protestants were both the richest and poorest classes. The wealthy families made less children, the poorest emigrated, and the Catholic middle class prevailed in the end.

Note that in the overwhelmingly Catholic Dutch provinces South of the Rhine (except Zealand), people often say they better get along with their Flemish cousins than with their countrymen of Holland. A unified Netherland would more probably be an enlarged Flanders than a bigger Holland !
Leslie   Mon May 03, 2010 12:03 pm GMT
Brazil and Portugal, US and UK
two different cultures altogether
Loyola   Mon May 03, 2010 12:05 pm GMT
Dutch people subtitle Flemish speakers (when there is a footage about Belgium on Dutch tv), which is similar to what Germans do to Swiss people or Brazilians to Portuguese people.
Kendra   Mon May 03, 2010 12:08 pm GMT
At least Flemish are not ashamed of speaking Flemish, in Holland people switch to English when speaking to a foreigner which makes Dutch language learning in Holland next to impossible.
rep   Mon May 03, 2010 1:03 pm GMT
<<Culturally, however, is where there is a notable difference between the Flemings and the Hollanders>>
Also:
Between Northern and Southern Germans.
Between Northern and Southern Italians.
Between Northern and Southern French people.
And so on.
encore   Mon May 03, 2010 1:21 pm GMT
<<Dutch people subtitle Flemish speakers (when there is a footage about Belgium on Dutch tv), which is similar to what Germans do to Swiss people or Brazilians to Portuguese people>>
Brazilians understand Spanish without subtitling.
Franco   Mon May 03, 2010 1:24 pm GMT
Brazilian people say they understand Spanish better than Portuguese from Portugal.