How do you pronounce ''shone''?

Travis, you have [O] in "shone?" Was that a typo or for real? I have /Son/ --> [So_cn]

Is it true that the pronunciation /So(U)n/ was a spelling pronunciation and that /SQn/ is the older pronunciation? I read something somewhere that suggested that.

<<Is it true that the pronunciation /So(U)n/ was a spelling pronunciation and that /SQn/ is the older pronunciation? I read something somewhere that suggested that.>>

/So(U)n/ having the vowel in ''tone''.

vs.

/SQn/ having the vowel in ''on''

Kirk, whoops, that is a typo. I meant to write [So~:n] there.

<<I have /Son/ --> [So_cn]>>

Wouldn't that be [so_c~:n]? Or are you only using a broad phonetic transcription?

>>Wouldn't that be [so_c~:n]? Or are you only using a broad phonetic transcription?<<

I assume you meant to write [So_c~:n] there.

<<I assume you meant to write [So_c~:n] there.>>

Yes, I meant to write [So_c~:n]. [so_c~:n] was a typo.

<<Kirk, whoops, that is a typo. I meant to write [So~:n] there.>>

Oh, ok, thanks for clarifying :)

<<Wouldn't that be [So_c~:n]? Or are you only using a broad phonetic transcription?>>

Well it's in between broad and narrow. Obviously a vowel before a nasal consonant has some nasal qualities but unless there's more nasality than would be expected I don't mark it. As for the vowel length, I'm not entirely sure I have a long vowel there, so I didn't put anything. However, I did more explicitly mark the quality of my /o/.

>>Well it's in between broad and narrow. Obviously a vowel before a nasal consonant has some nasal qualities but unless there's more nasality than would be expected I don't mark it. As for the vowel length, I'm not entirely sure I have a long vowel there, so I didn't put anything. However, I did more explicitly mark the quality of my /o/.<<

Part of the reason that I generally try to consistently mark vowel length in phonetic transcriptions is that in at least my dialect, vowel length differences linked to differences in consonant voicing seem *quite* noticable, when one bothers to pay attention to them (which one normally does not do, due to them not being phonemic); this is as opposed to supposed differences in vowel length linked to vowel tenseness, which are practically nonexistant in such. What is interesting, though, is that with respect to such differences, long vowels in stressed syllables do not seem any longer than usual, but rather short vowels in stressed syllables seem particularly short, as if they have been sharply cut off. But anyways, this is why I transcribe "shone" as /Son/ -> [So~:n], whereas I transcribe "shoot" as /Sut/ -> [Su?]; for me, the two have significantly different vowel lengths, which are in no fashion negligable, unlike what some say about vowel length differences in NAE dialects.

As an addendum to my previous post, it must be noted that my dialect has a reputation for having very loooong vowels compared to most other North American English dialects, which might be responsible for why I perceive vowel length differences in at least the English I am used to much more strongly than many other NAE-speakers do in their dialects.

<<As an addendum to my previous post, it must be noted that my dialect has a reputation for having very loooong vowels compared to most other North American English dialects, which might be responsible for why I perceive vowel length differences in at least the English I am used to much more strongly than many other NAE-speakers do in their dialects.>>

Even with a few years of linguistics classes, including a phonetics and phonology class, I still am not that great at hearing vowel length differences in my speech. The obvious long vowels are those before many voiced sounds (especially when those voiced sounds have unvoiced counterparts I can compare them with), but otherwise I'm not sure. My vowel in "shone" certainly doesn't sound long enough to me to merit a [:]. In normal speech it appears to have the same length as my vowel in "hope," which is not a long vowel. It may vary in between a short and long vowel, but I don't mark it as long because I don't perceive it that way and I don't think I produce it long (or at least always).

That's the thing: I can clearly perceive the difference in vowel length between vowels with consonants of differing voicing, even if they differ in ways other than voicing, and some of them don't have unvoiced counterparts. For instance, for me at least, I can definitely perceive the difference in length between "hope" (/hop/ -> [hop]) and "hone" (/hon/ -> [ho~:n]), even though they don't form a pair that is differentiated solely by voicing. Also, the length differences that I perceive seem to be more systematic for me than what you described; vowels in stressed syllables followed by sonorants which are not in turn followed by unvoiced consonants are consistently long for me, and do not waver between being long and being short; the only time when a stressed vowel may be short when followed by any sort of voiced consonant for me is when the voiced consonant is a sonorant directly followed by an unvoiced consonant, which in turn is consistent from case to case. Overall, my guess is not that somehow I am better at perceiving such than you are in and of itself, but rather that voicing or lack thereof triggers significantly stronger and more consistent differences in vowel length in my dialect than many other North American English dialects.

<<Overall, my guess is not that somehow I am better at perceiving such than you are in and of itself, but rather that voicing or lack thereof triggers significantly stronger and more consistent differences in vowel length in my dialect than many other North American English dialects.>>

Or I might just asctually suck at hearing it ;) But, seriously, yeah, I think you're right--from what you've described before it appears vowel-length is different in some areas between our respective dialects, and I know we certainly differ in some other interesting areas so I wouldn't be surprised if vowel length was also one of them in some environments.