What vowel is this?

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I've posted a sample of my accent here: http://media.putfile.com/TRAP-and-LOT
Could you tell me how you would transcribe each of these words? This is what I'm saying, for the record: Trap: bag, bang, ban, bad, bat; Lot: top, Todd, rot, rod, cot, cod. A few specific things to listen for: 1) am I using [a] or [{] for trap, bad, bat 2) is there any difference in vowel quality between bad and bat 3) am I using [Q] or [A] for lot, top, etc.
I suppose this would be especially helpful from Northern English speakers. Are my TRAP and LOT the same as yours?

In "trap, bad, bat" it sounds like you use [a]. One thing about [a], though, which they mention at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_front_unrounded_vowel , is that most of the time when [a] occurs in languages it's actually a central vowel, like in Spanish or Worcester-Boston English. Your vowel here seems more like the "true" front value of [a] - not quite like Worcester-Boston "bard", for example, but more like just a lowered version of [{].

In "bag" and "ban" it sounds like [E@] or [e@], and in "bang" it sounds like [e].

In my own speech the difference between [A] and [Q] isn't really that great, and sometimes I have trouble perceiving this difference in the speech of other North Americans. I guess my impression is that your "lot, top, Todd, rot, rod" sound a bit more like [A], although your "cot" sounded a bit more like [Q].

Thanks, thats helpful. I've been transcribing these as [{] and [A], but I think I'll use [a] from now on. I'll stick with [A] though, unless some father-bother distinguishing speakers tell me that I definitely sound more like their [Q]. I think this confusion could be because most Americans pronounce /A/ as a central or near-back vowel, and /O/ as a back vowel [Q] . So when they hear a fully-back /A/, they would tend to perceive it as [Q] or [O]. It's likely that I have partial rounding here too, though not as much as in RP.

I'd be interested to know how I should transcribe my vowels as well. Here's my sample: http://www.ax6.org/~keith/vowels2.wav

Cool. Your "trap" sounded to me more like front [a], although I think your "ban, bad, bat" sounded more like [{]. Your "bag" sounded like [E@], and your "bang" sounded like [e].

The words in the "lot" class seem to have a closer vowel than mine; I think I'd transcribe those with [O].

>>I've posted a sample of my accent here: http://media.putfile.com/TRAP-and-LOT
Could you tell me how you would transcribe each of these words? This is what I'm saying, for the record: Trap: bag, bang, ban, bad, bat; Lot: top, Todd, rot, rod, cot, cod. A few specific things to listen for: 1) am I using [a] or [{] for trap, bad, bat 2) is there any difference in vowel quality between bad and bat 3) am I using [Q] or [A] for lot, top, etc.
I suppose this would be especially helpful from Northern English speakers. Are my TRAP and LOT the same as yours? <<

I hear...

Trap [{]
bag [E@]
bang [E@]
ban [E:]
bad [{@]
bat [{]

Lot [A]
top [A]
Todd [A]
rot [A]
rod [A]
cot [A]
cod [A]

Lazar, I have to say that I got about the same perception of the speech sample myself except that I perceived a lower [{] as being in use rather than [a] per se, and also I perceived the vowel in "bag" as being more like [e{] and the vowel in "ban" as being more more like [E{] (actually, as being very close to my own usual vowel corresponding to GA /{/). Of course, though, what I normally transcribe as [a] is often a bit centralized in nature, even though it is definitely not uually *central* in nature either.

So the consensus is:

trap [a_+] or [{_o]
bang [beN]
bag [e@]
ban [bE{]

Is there a difference between 'bad' and 'bat?

Lot, top, etc. [Q] or [O]

Trap vowel sounds nothing like the Spanish padre or French dame [a] recorded on wikipedia: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/65/Open_front_unrounded_vowel.ogg

It's much more like the [{] there: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c9/Near-open_front_unrounded_vowel.ogg

>>Is there a difference between 'bad' and 'bat?<<

Hardly.

>>Lot, top, etc. [Q] or [O] <<

Must closer to [A] there:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e5/Open_back_unrounded_vowel.ogg

"Trap vowel sounds ":
I mean "your trap vowel..."

Sarcastic Northwesterner, I took a listen and your realisations sound a lot like mine. Your LOT set sounds rounded to me, more so than mine

Trap [{]
bag [e]
bang [E~]
ban [{@~] (this is more open than mine)
bad, bat [{] though I think 'bad' might have been a little closer than 'bat'

I've posted my comma passage too, if you want to hear me "in action".

I forgot to post the link. It's here:
http://media.putfile.com/Comma-Passage

Sarcastic Northwesterner's [A] sounds like the Californian/Canadian shifted merged vowel /Q/. I call it a Valley Girl ''aw'' (mawm, nawt, hawt dawg ;) )

I should also note, Sarcastic Northwesterner, that your TRAP is lower than most Americans': it sounds 'normal' to me, whereas most Americans sound closer.

>>
Sarcastic Northwesterner's [A] sounds like the Californian/Canadian shifted merged vowel /Q/. I call it a Valley Girl ''aw'' (mawm, nawt, hawt dawg ;) )
<<

That kind of accent is, like, totally annoying. Don't tell me Northwesterners speak like that too.

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