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>>No, this isn't normal. Usually your accent is pretty much settled by 12 or so. People who move to an area with a different accent often accommodate somewhat to the new accent, but they don't usually acquire it completely.
This sort of interesting phenomena about linguistic potential is more than phenomenal. That might have much more to do with social reasons, for example. I've seen quite a few local showbiz people and my own relatives who never completely lose their "foreign"/village accents. The showbiz people... who knows, they might not be motivated to remove their accents, or their accents are symbolic. For example, retaining a Taiwanese (Mandarin) accent would mean an elderly actor could still play a role as a Taiwanese wealthy old man in various drama programs. And my relatives? More often are those who say they "can't" learn a native accent/lose a village accent. When people accept their accents and don't care any more, then they won't do anything and let the accents as they are.
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Thanks for the replies, y'all. Very enlightening. I guess this phenomenon is pretty unusual because I can only think of a handful of famous people (mentioned in my first post) who've done this.
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I guess I want to see facts as well as guesses and anecdoctal posts. If I know of several people who have "new" accents, I do not think that it is an unusual phenomenon. There are so many questions that one must ask about the subject in question. How involved in the new culture was the subject?
Some people feel comfortable and stay with their own groups and may gravitate to people who "sound" like they do. If the new accent is desirable, I think it's more likely that the person will pick it up.
What about code-switching?
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<< How involved in the new culture was the subject? >>
In the examples I cited the subjects have been in the new environment for 20+ years.
<< What about code-switching? >>
That's possible, and no doubt happens, but I'm talking about those who've permanently changed their accent non deliberately due to a change of environment.
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One thing I want to know more about is is it possible for someone to move to a foreign country and acquire the new country's accent, even when speaking their native tongue, e.g. a 25 year old moves to Spain, and after many years acquires a Spanish accent which permeates into his English.
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Once in TV there were two old Spanish ladies who migrated to UK dued to the Civil War when they were 12 years old , but they still spoke perfect Spanish, only with a slight British accent.
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Is your accent fully developed at 12?
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How would you project the changing of a Canadian accent when a university student (18) moves to Scotland for university. I like the accent, if that is of any help to you, and I'll be there for at least 5 years or more. How early would you say I'll pick it up? I understand its different for everyone, but just projections please :)
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<<<my maternal grandmother natively spoke and was literate in Polish, and actively used it in school until the age of 16 or so - today she speaks no Polish whatsoever, and cannot read or write it>>>
what about hers English? Does she speak with a Polish accent or with the local accent?
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Of course there are adults who change their accent. The writer Paul Theroux grew up and went to college in Massachussetts. He lived in England (among other places) as an adult, and now speaks with a British accent.
There are many people whose accent changes to some extent when they move (for example, my aunt, who is from Nottingham, sounds as much a U.S. Southerner as she does a Brit, having lived in the South for decades.)
To COMPLETELY change one's accent probably takes the motivation to do so (and the effort.) U.S. TV broadcasters from non-General American-speaking areas do it all the time, as well as many actors (e.g., Sidney Poitier).
As a side note: I knew a girl in high school who spoke with a British accent. Almost everyone assumed she was from the UK. Someone who went to her elementary school later told me that she was from the neighborhood, and had deliberately "acquired" a British accent--I guess she thought it sounded posh. She spoke like that all the time (except when she got excited, and then her Chicagoan started creeping in).
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Then there's Britney Spears and her newly-acquired British accent. Sh apparently acquire it through sexual intercourse. Come to think of it, that's how she's acquired quite a bit. Pardon the digression. :) I'm from the American South originally, but I've lived in other places in the USA, and I've found that it helps socially to mirror the local accent. When I lived in Manhattan, I mimicked that accent to keep people from attempting to short-change me constantly... :D
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<< How early would you say I'll pick it up? I understand its different for everyone, but just projections please :) >>
Of course I'm no expert, but with deep immersion in the target culture/dialect, it will happen sooner. In all the examples I've heard of, it usually takes several years, although if you "fake" or force the accent long enough it may become natural. Since you're young it will probably be easier for you to change.
<< (for example, my aunt, who is from Nottingham, sounds as much a U.S. Southerner as she does a Brit, having lived in the South for decades.) >>
Are you saying that she still retains some Britishness to her accent? It sounds like you're saying that her accent is a mixture of the two..
<< I've found that it helps socially to mirror the local accent. >>
Good point. It could be psychological. Maybe thats also why some people forget their native language, under [subconscious] pressure by the new society to change.
<< The writer Paul Theroux grew up and went to college in Massachussetts. He lived in England (among other places) as an adult, and now speaks with a British accent. >>
Good example! I just watched a clip of him on YouTube and IMO his accent did sort of sound british, albeit with many American features.
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Hello,
I just felt the need to add a little to this conversation. For me the idea of accent acquisition is really interesting. I studied linguistics at University, and the common linguistic theory is that one's accent is set at puberty. At this time, the hard palate in your mouth becomes fully formed, and parts of your brain dealing with language tend to start solidifying. In many cases, this is the time when many people find it much more difficult to change their accents.
While this is a well accepted theory in the linguistics community, I have had a much different experience with my accents. I am originally from Wisconsin, and grew up with a very thick northern accent. I went to college in Minnesota, where they have an accent which to most other people is indistinguishable, but to people from the area is very different. After living there for a short time, I picked up the Minnesotan accent and intonation patterns for my every day life. However, when I would talk to someone from back home like my mom, I would always switch back to a think WI accent. I would always code-switch depending on who I was talking to or what I was talking about.
Moreover, I lived for a year in Japan when I was in High School. I learned to speak the language very well, and without actually trying I picked up what I am told to be a native accent from the area where I lived. When answering the phone, people said that they did not know that they were talking to me until I messed up some part of the grammar.
And finally, I am living at the moment in Hungary at the age of 23, and while my Hungarian is shotty at best, I am once again picking up a very native like accent.
In conclusion, I feel that acquiring a new accent doesn't have to do so much with age, but with how you identify yourself at that moment (if that makes sense). When I speak with my mom, I identify as a Wisconsinite, and speak with a WI accent. When I speak with my friends in Minnesota, I identify as a Minnesotan, and speak with a Minnesotan accent. When I lived in Japan, I always tried my hardest to fit in and find connections with Japanese people, so I acquired a Japanese accent. And finally, here in Hungary, I show my connection to other Hungarians, by speaking with a Hungarian accent. It is all about how I am trying to identify myself at the time.
Does that make sense to anyone else?
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>>what about hers English? Does she speak with a Polish accent or with the local accent?<<
I cannot exactly pin my grandma's accent - it is definitely not a non-native Slavic accent (which I am familiar with with the many Russians that I interact with at work), it is not a northern-GA-with-NCVS one like my mother's (having NCVS and Canadian Raising but lacking many clear Upper Midwestern features), and it is not a conservative Upper Midwestern one like my father's or my girlfriend's mom's (which can be very GA-like but at the time has noticable Upper Midwestern-type features while often having only a very weak NCVS).
As my grandma grew up in a very Polish community in Chicago, and later moved to Kenosha (which was almost purely Italian at the time), it is not surprising that she does not seem to have many more stereotypically Upper Midwestern features, which are often Germanic in origin. On the other hand, I get the impression that my mother's accent is more typical of a modern Kenosha one than her's, as it has clear Inland North features but is otherwise rather GA-like and lacks many of the more Germanic features more typical of Milwaukee or Chicago English (for instance, her use of the word "ja" (or "yah") [ja:] is learned, as she had never even heard it before she moved to Milwaukee). All in all, the best I could guess is that my grandma probably speaks English similar to that in the Chicago area prior to the NCVS and the southward spread of Canadian Raising and without much German influence, while having some undefined degree of Polish influence (which I cannot really easily tell myself, as much of such would overlap with the effects of German influence).
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How "Polish" is your Grandmother? I'm sure that you've heard of Danzig. It used to be full of "German" people.
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Yes, Jake, so it has been rather bizarre for my linguistics tutor to say he can't learn a proper [native; any one of the many] English accent since he has long passed the critical period. He said he started learning English at the age of 12, approaching puberty, and in Beijing.... and I can tell that his accent is really thick, thick enough to make me confused.
The moral of the story is: you don't really have to speak the only official language of a university in order to teach there a subject that is supposed to be "barely" related to language. NO, while I, a beginner, don't really think theories have anything to do with a particular grammar / accent, I do believe the INPUT hypothesis might be of theoretical value. I can see the point of using _good_ input (like i+1).
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