How to make pronunciation descriptions for learners.

Rudolph   Fri Mar 31, 2006 4:46 am GMT
"a" for 'eh-ah as in /cat, map, van.../
"a" for 'eh-ee as in /cake (k_k), pain (p_n), day (d_).../
"a" for ah as in /car, father, glass, dance, bath.../
"a" for aw as in /law (l_), caught (k_t), thought (th_t).../

"e" for eh as in /bed, bread (br_d), sweat (sw_t), health (h_lth).../
"e" for ee as in /bean (b_n), bee, piece (p_s), chief (ch_f), field (f_ld).../

"i" for 'ee-eh as in /bin, fin, win, busy (b_z_), building (b_ld_ng).../
"i" for 'ah-ee as in /wine (w_n), light (l_t), lie (l_), sky (sk_).../

Give us the rest of.

Begin your own explanation from a to u.
Kirk   Fri Mar 31, 2006 6:10 am GMT
The best thing would be to learn and use a standardized phonetic transcription, ideally the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA). It is universally recognized and doesn't leave for ambiguity in the way fauxnetic transcription systems do. On this forum we commonly use IPA but in a form accessible to people without the special fonts, called X-SAMPA.

--Here are some resources for you:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Phonetic_Alphabet_for_English

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-SAMPA

--I have also written a tutorial to help people thru learning IPA and/or X-SAMPA:

http://www.langcafe.net/viewtopic.php?t=278

Good luck!
Kirk   Fri Mar 31, 2006 6:12 am GMT
Above it should read: "use a standardized form of phonetic transcription"
Travis   Fri Mar 31, 2006 6:38 am GMT
Kirk got to it before me, so I must just say that I most wholly agree with what he has just said about the said subject.
Rudolph   Fri Mar 31, 2006 8:19 am GMT
The symbol of ei in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA) looks to be pronounced as i, not a. Most symbols of this system are misunderstood by those people whose languages use these diphthongs but with different sounds.

I don't think the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA) is the most appropriate method to know the English sounds. By the way, I also think IPA has audio system, so if you don't guess the sounds, hear them.

I know sound symbols are a bit tricky.


Thanks,
Rudolph
Rudolph   Fri Mar 31, 2006 8:22 am GMT
Even tricky for native speakers who want to know how we learn whose language they don't have to.
Kirk   Fri Mar 31, 2006 8:40 am GMT
<<The symbol of ei in the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA) looks to be pronounced as i, not a.>>

What? I don't know what you mean. It's vague unless you use an international standard phonetic transcription system that is commonly understood and agreed upon.

<<Most symbols of this system are misunderstood by those people whose languages use these diphthongs but with different sounds.>>

The point is that IPA isn't a spelling system. When transcribing phonetically or reading phonetic transcriptions you should forget about spelling, because IPA is for describing pronunciation in a commonly standardized way everyone can understand.
Rudolph   Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:29 pm GMT
Yes, it's all said false about IPA from you. You lie to us. IPA isn't recognized so long. I've never seen it away from this internet website page. It looks made in Poland. I don't speak Polish to understand uncommon descriptions or symbols. I immediately listen the sounds. In fact, I don't have to. I just try to create a basic spelling sound description without weird symbols of some maker.
Jim C, York   Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:54 am GMT
Great stuff, im gonna look into all that so i can understand all you intellectuals.
Kirk   Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:46 am GMT
<<Great stuff, im gonna look into all that>>

If you have any questions about it, feel free to ask :)
Damian in Edinburgh   Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:21 am GMT
These guys in the US are great in their quest to help learners of English.

Jim in York......YOU are an intellectual as well....so much so that your personal pronoun deserves capitalisation! I should know ...I've been to York several times (I was at Leeds uni).....cool people! ;-)
Herb   Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:59 am GMT
Great place York. Went there on a dig in '01 just down the road from the Minster and stayed at the uni.

Rudolph asked for simplicity, and he does have a point; may I suggest "aagh!" (as distinct from "ah") for the vowel used by the 300 million in the word "fast", and "air" (non-rhotically) for the one they use in "can't".

Could someone else do the other vowels please?
Thyme   Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:00 am GMT
Herb, here are a few more:
O for the vowel sound in the first syllable in wOmen
0 for the vowel sound in b0ugh
o for the vowel sound in the rough
Rudolph   Mon Apr 03, 2006 11:49 pm GMT
Thyme, you're making a nonsense description on purpose. Try to be more concerned with themes.

"a" for 'eh-ah as in /cat, map, van.../ not ah as in /cot, drop, gone.../
Jim C, York   Tue Apr 04, 2006 12:42 am GMT
<Jim in York......YOU are an intellectual as well....so much so that your personal pronoun deserves capitalisation!>

<Great place York. Went there on a dig in '01 >

I know, ***I'm*** a lazy typist. Yeah York is great, I recently moved down from the Dales to a few miles out side. But i spent many a weekend of my teens on the Roman wall smoking a cheeky "jazz" cigarette. The one thing I can't believe is the amount of bones in the city, they're forever digging poor old Romans or Norse men up. So herb which were you digging? Where abouts as well?