In my French class, the teacher, who is French, pronounced the word "chat" ("cat" in English) with the same vowel that I would use for "cat" in English. Is this the way French is really pronounced? BTW, I am from California.
French "a"
"A" in french is pronounced the same way it is in all romance language (and probably like many germanic langauges too I don't know)
It is in English that "A" is a nightmare to pronounced because it can be pronounced like many other vowels, as if it hadn't it own sound in English...
I don't know how you pronounce the "a" in "cat" but in this case I would pronounce it the same way than the french "a".
It is in English that "A" is a nightmare to pronounced because it can be pronounced like many other vowels, as if it hadn't it own sound in English...
I don't know how you pronounce the "a" in "cat" but in this case I would pronounce it the same way than the french "a".
<<"A" in french is pronounced the same way it is in all romance language >>
Oh yeah?
Perhaps you're not familiar with the French word 'dans'
I have heard some French speakers use /{/ for 'a'. I wonder if it is dialectal. My French teacher was also from France and she would pronounce some words with this type of 'a' sound ("/{/").
Oh yeah?
Perhaps you're not familiar with the French word 'dans'
I have heard some French speakers use /{/ for 'a'. I wonder if it is dialectal. My French teacher was also from France and she would pronounce some words with this type of 'a' sound ("/{/").
" Oh yeah?
Perhaps you're not familiar with the French word 'dans' "
Leansman, once again you should avoid trying to give french lessons to a french speaker, you're always ridiculous doing that. i'm Sorry.
If you know so weel french than that you would know that when it is associated with some other letters, the new ensemble is making another vowel, completly different from the letters that formed it. It is a nuance that you seem not be aware of.
AN, AI, AU, AIN, (maybe I forget some) ARE NOT "A" !!
I'm sorry but the sound "A" (which the letter alone, not modified in anew combinaision) in french is always the same sound "A", which is the same than in Spanish or Italian, but defnitly very different from the way(s) this letter is pronounced in English...
Perhaps you're not familiar with the French word 'dans' "
Leansman, once again you should avoid trying to give french lessons to a french speaker, you're always ridiculous doing that. i'm Sorry.
If you know so weel french than that you would know that when it is associated with some other letters, the new ensemble is making another vowel, completly different from the letters that formed it. It is a nuance that you seem not be aware of.
AN, AI, AU, AIN, (maybe I forget some) ARE NOT "A" !!
I'm sorry but the sound "A" (which the letter alone, not modified in anew combinaision) in french is always the same sound "A", which is the same than in Spanish or Italian, but defnitly very different from the way(s) this letter is pronounced in English...
<< I'm sorry but the sound "A" (which the letter alone, not modified in anew combinaision) in french is always the same sound "A", which is the same than in Spanish or Italian >>
-- Non. Absolument faux. Le bref 'a' ouvert de 'mal' n'est pas le long 'a' fermé de 'mâle' (par ex.). Même dichotomie entre "patte" et "pâte".
Le problème est de typifier la distribution entre ces 2 'a'. Problème très complexe! A l'écoute de mes enfants (je m'intéresse beaucoup à l'apprentissage de la langue chez les moins de 10 ans) je me suis aperçu que spontanément ils prononçaient "chat" extrêmement court et ouvert, alors que la négation "pas" est prononcée longue et très fermée, presque comme "pôooo". Tous les enfants font ça. Et je ne sais pas pourquoi...
Ce sont des phénomènes auxquels il faut être attentif, ils conditionnent la future phonologie du français.
-- Non. Absolument faux. Le bref 'a' ouvert de 'mal' n'est pas le long 'a' fermé de 'mâle' (par ex.). Même dichotomie entre "patte" et "pâte".
Le problème est de typifier la distribution entre ces 2 'a'. Problème très complexe! A l'écoute de mes enfants (je m'intéresse beaucoup à l'apprentissage de la langue chez les moins de 10 ans) je me suis aperçu que spontanément ils prononçaient "chat" extrêmement court et ouvert, alors que la négation "pas" est prononcée longue et très fermée, presque comme "pôooo". Tous les enfants font ça. Et je ne sais pas pourquoi...
Ce sont des phénomènes auxquels il faut être attentif, ils conditionnent la future phonologie du français.
Again, I'd like to suggest borrowing "Pronounce it Perfectly in French" or the Nachtmann book on French phonics. You'll be able to understand about the different "a" sounds in French.
<<It is in English that "A" is a nightmare to pronounced because it can be pronounced like many other vowels, as if it hadn't it own sound in English...
>>
In English the sound of A can also be determined by combination with other letters too, in many cases.
When a stand alone, it is /ei/ when stressed and /@/ when not stressed.
For instance, when short and before l, r it's one sound
when short and between a w sound and r it's like an o (war, quarter, dwarf)
<<Leansman, once again you should avoid trying to give french lessons to a french speaker, you're always ridiculous doing that. i'm Sorry.
>>
What's more ridiculous is that this french speaker speaks neither French nor English well. LOL
BTW Just me, I love how you have a defense for every mistake you make. Classic Douche-bag ;)
>>
In English the sound of A can also be determined by combination with other letters too, in many cases.
When a stand alone, it is /ei/ when stressed and /@/ when not stressed.
For instance, when short and before l, r it's one sound
when short and between a w sound and r it's like an o (war, quarter, dwarf)
<<Leansman, once again you should avoid trying to give french lessons to a french speaker, you're always ridiculous doing that. i'm Sorry.
>>
What's more ridiculous is that this french speaker speaks neither French nor English well. LOL
BTW Just me, I love how you have a defense for every mistake you make. Classic Douche-bag ;)
" What's more ridiculous is that this french speaker speaks neither French nor English well. LOL "
I'm sorry, but English is not everyone's native language. I had not the luck to learn it when I was a kid.
En ce qui concerne le français, le parles-tu toi? Si oui, tu pourrais probablement m'apprendre bien des choses alors...
To come back to the subject, how is pronounced the sound "A" in french, since it is quite hard to speak about sounds just by writing, you can hear these exemples:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQx3zYUNuPY
As you can notice the differences between the two "A" sounds that "PARISIEN' was speaking about is not really noticeable (I think he is not "Parisien" since in Parisian accent, as well as in many other accents there are usually not a differenciation of the two). There can be many regional differenciations in that aspect, mainly in Quebec (where A almost becomes O, and aslo in Nord/Picardy/Normandy in a lesser extend)
I'm sorry, but English is not everyone's native language. I had not the luck to learn it when I was a kid.
En ce qui concerne le français, le parles-tu toi? Si oui, tu pourrais probablement m'apprendre bien des choses alors...
To come back to the subject, how is pronounced the sound "A" in french, since it is quite hard to speak about sounds just by writing, you can hear these exemples:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQx3zYUNuPY
As you can notice the differences between the two "A" sounds that "PARISIEN' was speaking about is not really noticeable (I think he is not "Parisien" since in Parisian accent, as well as in many other accents there are usually not a differenciation of the two). There can be many regional differenciations in that aspect, mainly in Quebec (where A almost becomes O, and aslo in Nord/Picardy/Normandy in a lesser extend)
A, À, Â /a/ like the English U in "cut" (short) or the English A in "father" (long)
http://www.unilang.org/wiki/index.php/French_pronunciation
so, according to unilang it can be either [@] (as in cut, current, love)
or [A] (as in father, bother, lost, doll)
http://www.unilang.org/wiki/index.php/French_pronunciation
so, according to unilang it can be either [@] (as in cut, current, love)
or [A] (as in father, bother, lost, doll)
The contrast between front /a/ vs. back /ɑ/ is only partially maintained in standard French, leading some researchers to reject the idea of two distinct phonemes.[8] While speakers do show significant variation in this area, a number of general tendencies can be observed. First of all, the distinction is best preserved in word-final stressed syllables, e.g. in the minimal pairs tache [taʃ] ('stain') vs. tâche [tɑːʃ] ('task') and rat [ʁa] ('rat') vs. ras [ʁɑ] ('short'). Certain phonological contexts favor back [ɑ], for example a preceding [ʁw] (trois [tʁwɑ] 'three') or a following [z] (gaz [ɡɑːz] 'gas').[9] The difference in quality is often reinforced by a difference in length. The exact distribution of the two vowels varies greatly from speaker to speaker.[10]
Back /ɑ/ is much rarer in unstressed syllables. It can still be encountered in some common words like château [ʃɑto] ('castle'). Morphologically complex words derived from words containing stressed /ɑ/ may or may not retain this vowel: compare âgé [ɑʒe] ('aged', from âge [ɑːʒ]) and rarissime [ʁaʁisim] ('very rare', from rare [ʁɑːʁ]). Even in a final syllable, back /ɑ/ may become [a] if the word in question loses its stress within the extended context:[9]
J'ai été au bois [ʒeeteoˈbwɑ] ('I went to the woods')
J'ai été au bois de Vincennes [ʒeeteobwadvɛ̃ˈsɛn] ('I went to the Vincennes woods')
[wikipedia]
Back /ɑ/ is much rarer in unstressed syllables. It can still be encountered in some common words like château [ʃɑto] ('castle'). Morphologically complex words derived from words containing stressed /ɑ/ may or may not retain this vowel: compare âgé [ɑʒe] ('aged', from âge [ɑːʒ]) and rarissime [ʁaʁisim] ('very rare', from rare [ʁɑːʁ]). Even in a final syllable, back /ɑ/ may become [a] if the word in question loses its stress within the extended context:[9]
J'ai été au bois [ʒeeteoˈbwɑ] ('I went to the woods')
J'ai été au bois de Vincennes [ʒeeteobwadvɛ̃ˈsɛn] ('I went to the Vincennes woods')
[wikipedia]
Wikipédia anglophone : « The contrast between front /a/ vs. back /ɑ/ [...] ».
Ces considérations ne s'appliquent, en France, qu'à certains sous-groupes de la phonologie septentrionale : l'Hémifrance qui relève du phonématisme méridional n'est pas concernée par [ɑ] — et encore moins par /ɑ/.
Wikipédia anglophone : « The velar nasal /ŋ/ is not a native phoneme of French, but occurs in loan words in final position such as "parking" or "camping". ».
/ŋ/ n'est pas un "phonème" du français : c'est un allophone de /n/ qui accompagne le phonème /g/ en le précédant. En France méridionale, le phone [ŋ] n'est pas du tout un emprunt puisqu'on le retrouve couramment dans le phénomène de nasalisation : <bombant> → /bɔ̃·bɑ̃/ → [bɔ̃ŋ·bɑ̃ŋ], <bambin> → /bɑ̃·bɛ̃/ → [bɑ̃ŋ·bɛ̃ŋ].
Le son des cloches est traditionnellement orthographié <ding ding dong> où le premier <ding> n'est pas prononcé comme le second : [diŋɡ·dɛ̃ɡ·dɔ̃ɡ] ← /dinɡ·dɛ̃ɡ·dɔ̃ɡ/ en septentrional, [diŋɡ·dɛ̃ŋɡ·dɔ̃ŋɡ] ← /dinɡ·dɛ̃ɡ·dɔ̃ɡ/ en méridional.
Ces considérations ne s'appliquent, en France, qu'à certains sous-groupes de la phonologie septentrionale : l'Hémifrance qui relève du phonématisme méridional n'est pas concernée par [ɑ] — et encore moins par /ɑ/.
Wikipédia anglophone : « The velar nasal /ŋ/ is not a native phoneme of French, but occurs in loan words in final position such as "parking" or "camping". ».
/ŋ/ n'est pas un "phonème" du français : c'est un allophone de /n/ qui accompagne le phonème /g/ en le précédant. En France méridionale, le phone [ŋ] n'est pas du tout un emprunt puisqu'on le retrouve couramment dans le phénomène de nasalisation : <bombant> → /bɔ̃·bɑ̃/ → [bɔ̃ŋ·bɑ̃ŋ], <bambin> → /bɑ̃·bɛ̃/ → [bɑ̃ŋ·bɛ̃ŋ].
Le son des cloches est traditionnellement orthographié <ding ding dong> où le premier <ding> n'est pas prononcé comme le second : [diŋɡ·dɛ̃ɡ·dɔ̃ɡ] ← /dinɡ·dɛ̃ɡ·dɔ̃ɡ/ en septentrional, [diŋɡ·dɛ̃ŋɡ·dɔ̃ŋɡ] ← /dinɡ·dɛ̃ɡ·dɔ̃ɡ/ en méridional.
<<AN, AI, AU, AIN, (maybe I forget some) ARE NOT "A" !! >>
Well, you need to point out that you are referencing the phoneme quality and not the spelling, because in actuality those others are the BOOKSTAVE "A" + something else.
You need to consider and keep in mind that it may be this way in French minds or hyper-anal-linguistic minds (really, you should try getting out more. try a good dating service :), but the world does not follow French or France. To the rest of humanity, those combinations contain 'A'.
Well, you need to point out that you are referencing the phoneme quality and not the spelling, because in actuality those others are the BOOKSTAVE "A" + something else.
You need to consider and keep in mind that it may be this way in French minds or hyper-anal-linguistic minds (really, you should try getting out more. try a good dating service :), but the world does not follow French or France. To the rest of humanity, those combinations contain 'A'.
<<maybe I forget some>>
And you are Old and Cranky and a bit of a snark!
'cantankerous' also comes to mind :\
And you are Old and Cranky and a bit of a snark!
'cantankerous' also comes to mind :\
just me : « AN, AI, AU, AIN, (maybe I forget some) ARE NOT "A" !! »
Leasnam : « To the rest of humanity, those combinations contain 'A'. »
Leasnam : tu feins de ne pas comprendre ? Les entités <an>, <ai>, <au>, <ain>, <aon>, <eau> etc sont des graphèmes dont aucun ne représente le phonème /a/ (ni le phonème /ɑ/ d'ailleurs). D'autre part, lesdits graphèmes contiennent le graphème <a> mais aucun ne "contient" les phonèmes /a/ ou /ɑ/. C'est pourtant assez simple à comprendre : une lettre est un signe graphique qui ne produit aucun son.
Leasnam : « To the rest of humanity, those combinations contain 'A'. »
Leasnam : tu feins de ne pas comprendre ? Les entités <an>, <ai>, <au>, <ain>, <aon>, <eau> etc sont des graphèmes dont aucun ne représente le phonème /a/ (ni le phonème /ɑ/ d'ailleurs). D'autre part, lesdits graphèmes contiennent le graphème <a> mais aucun ne "contient" les phonèmes /a/ ou /ɑ/. C'est pourtant assez simple à comprendre : une lettre est un signe graphique qui ne produit aucun son.