the nicest Italian dialect

Melchiorre   Fri Nov 13, 2009 9:36 pm GMT
Toscano solo conosce le vocali aperte: ventitrè, perchè, bèlla stèlla, amòre

I wonder why these stupid "teens" keen on writing about subjects they don't know a thing! They are so ridiculous and annoying....
Emanuele Filiberto di Sav   Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:07 am GMT
Il toscano è un ridicolo scimmiottamento dell'italiano standard parlato dai piemontesi.

Non si dice "La hasa": si dice "La casa"!
blanche   Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:26 am GMT
Emanuele e se imparassi un pochettino d'inglese?
true Italian   Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:34 am GMT
Every year many people come to Tuscany on vacation or to learn Italian. In Tuscany there are many language schools where it is possible to learn to speak Italian, and many holiday resorts organise language courses with private tutors for their guests.

It is widely believed that the variety of Italian spoken in Tuscany is "true Italian". Actually, there is no such thing as "true Italian", but rather many different regional varieties of Italian. The Italian language derives from the dialect of Tuscany and therefore, standard Italian grammar (i.e. TV Italian) is usually easier to pick up in Tuscany rather than in other regions where the local dialects have a stronger influence on the structure of the language.

Many words used in Tuscan dialects can be found in dictionaries of Italian as obsolete terms. This means that even most dialectal words which you could happen to learn in Tuscany are indeed acceptable as Italian words, even though some of them wouldn't probably be understood in other regions.
Generally, it is true that the Italian spoken in Tuscany in everyday conversation is understood everywhere in the peninsula, whereas this is not always true for other regional varieties.
Studying Italian in a language school is ideal if you are a sociable person who wants to meet other people and who is ready to follow a fixed schedule and to work hard in a lively environment.
Most people choose language schools in Florence because of the beautiful and lively environment the city offers. Other people choose Lucca or Pisa because they are lovely towns, close to the sea, and with an excellent University. Other people choose Siena, because the Italian spoken in the city is said to be the closest variety to standard Italian.
The truth is that Siena has excellent language schools and even a University for Foreign Students which, besides offering high-quality courses of Italian to foreign students coming from all over the world, trains and certifies scholars and teachers who will then teach in the best institutions. The University for Foreigners of Siena tests teachers to verify their professionalism with the certificate called DITALS (Didactics of Italian as a Foreign Language).
Siena could therefore be the perfect choice if you want to learn Italian in Tuscany and enjoy the beautiful Tuscan sun.
Emanuele Filiberto di Sav   Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:53 am GMT
L'italiano standard si parla in Piemonte e in Lombardia (fonte Istat).

"Per "gorgia toscana" s'intende quel singolare fenomeno di aspirazione che in Toscana colpisce le consonanti sorde "k" [e cioè la "c" di casa], "p", "t" in posizione intervocalica... per esempio: "amiha", "andatho". La stessa mutazione consonantica si verifica all'inizio della parola, quando per lo stretto rapporto sintattico la consonante viene a trovarsi fra le due vocali: "la hasa", "la therra". Non avviene aspirazione in posizione iniziale assoluta ("Carlo", "partiamo", "taci")" (G. ROHLFS, Studi e ricerche su lingua e dialetti d'Italia, Sansoni, Firenze, 1997, p. 161).
reality   Sat Nov 14, 2009 11:43 am GMT
sigarètta, béne, méglio, dzio, trè, rè from milanese are absolutely not standard, they really sound dialectal

Piedmontese and Sicilian possess a vowel system composed of only 5 vowels unlike Italian standard which has 7 vowels

The fact is that Northern Italians do not know what Italian standard means.
Guest   Sat Nov 14, 2009 11:50 am GMT
La stessa mutazione consonantica si verifica all'inizio della parola, quando per lo stretto rapporto sintattico la consonante viene a trovarsi fra le due vocali: "la hasa"

Interesting, similar phonetic evolution also happened in the Germanic languages. c became h in house (cognated to "casa" at IE level), horse, and many other words.
Meijse   Sat Nov 14, 2009 3:58 pm GMT
I think Perugia has better schools than Sièna, and the Perugian accent is very standard without h's [lahasa].

In Sièna LA CASA is [lahasa], in Perugia it's [lakaza].
blanche   Sat Nov 14, 2009 4:51 pm GMT
The proper pronunciation of this word should be "lakasa"
Consuelo   Sat Nov 14, 2009 5:43 pm GMT
Siena is my favoutite Italian Town. It's so gorgeous
Neca Odara   Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:40 pm GMT
The proper pronunciation of this word should be "lakasa", in Spanish yes, in Italian it's ''lakaza'' (everyone on RAI uses it)

lakasa is Tuscan dialectalism
Real Italian   Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:44 pm GMT
lakasa is Tuscan dialectalism

Not at all. It's lakasa but laroZa. You ought to study Dizione, dude.
PARISIEN   Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:53 am GMT
<< L'italiano standard si parla in Piemonte e in Lombardia >>

<< The fact is that Northern Italians do not know what Italian standard means. >>


-- Si je comprends bien, il y aurait conflit entre le standard officiel (Rome) et la norme de Milan ?

Vu le poids économique et démographique du Nord-Ouest, serait-il possible que la prononciation du Nord-Ouest finisse par prévaloir dans tout le pays ?
blanchette   Sun Nov 15, 2009 11:40 am GMT
Vu le poids économique et démographique du Nord-Ouest, serait-il possible que la prononciation du Nord-Ouest finisse par prévaloir dans tout le pays

Pas du tout. Tout d'abord il n'existe pas une prononciation uniforme dans le nord-Ouest, par exemple, l'accent milanais est bien différent de celui de Venise ou de Turin. Puis, j'aimerais rappeler que tous les bons dictionnaires de la langue italianne suivent la prononciation du florentin cultivé qui ressemble beaucoup à celui de Rome et des autres régions de l'Italie centrale. Lorsqu'on parle de l'italien standard on se réfère à cette variété linguistique. Bien que la plupart des gens sur ce forum soient centrés essentiellement sur des questions economiques, à mon avis il y a des valeurs culturelles, historiques et de tradition littéraire qui sont bien plus importantes que des raisons purement économiques.
para mim   Sun Nov 15, 2009 12:04 pm GMT
I have been stutying Portuguese fon many years I have been to Portugal three times and I can say that the two varieties of Portuguese are quite different, much more than British and American English or American and European Spanish. That's a fact. They often sound completely different phonetically, to say nothing about grammar and vocabulary. I've studied linguistics deeply and I know what I'm talking about.