Spanish should be the second official language of USA

Well first of all, it should be said that the actors in the telenovelas use makeup, their true skincolor is not always portrayed.

And secondly, I do agree that most actors in telenovelas seem to be lighter skin mestizos to just plain whites, which isn't really representative of the reality. In the towns where I have relatives in (Torreón Coah, Chihuahua Chih, Durango Dgo, Zacatecas, Zac, Cd. Juarez, Chih), most people tend to be on the lighter side of the dividing line between White and Indian.

And as for the articles, I'd say they are both right. The races do live in harmony for the most part, there's no racism like in the USA, not outward racism anyway, because just about everyone is part something. But Indian people do seem to be looked down upon, but not because of their race, simply because they are seen as poor and uneducated since most live life separately from the Western society of Mexico. It's more of a clash of cultures matter, than anything racial.

And as to this:
<<And given the number of Indians and part-Indians I've met over the years, it's so far off the mark to say that the British eliminated the Indians and their cultures that it's just funny>>
Native Americans aren't even 1% of the population! It's still some 9% away from being funny if you ask me

« ... since most live life separately from the Western society of Mexico. It's more of a clash of cultures matter, than anything racial. »

Is that not what it's ultimately about almost EVERYWHERE though? I'm not American, but I cannot believe that many Americans today actually believe that certain 'races' are inherently superior/inferior to others.

PUREBRED Native Americans may only be 1% of the population, but a large number of Americans can (and do) claim part-Indian heritage. In fact, most who can are very proud of that Choctaw grandmother or their sixteenth of Blackfoot blood. And I should point out that to gain official tribal membership in an American Indian tribe, you only have to prove a percentage of Indian blood (the required percentage varies by tribe). A quarter, an eighth, or even a sixteenth are acceptable for most tribes.

I might point out, guest, that a LARGE percentage of Border Patrol agents are themselves hispanic -- especially on the southern border. Therefore racism is not their motivation....

There are racist people everywhere. No point in denying that. What the given people are racist about also changes from locale to locale. This whole topic came about when Sigma tried to imply that there was no racism in Mexico - that all groups live together in harmony - which I think is laughable at best and pretty pathetic at worst. The first step to eliminating racism is recognizing it.

"But Indian people do seem to be looked down upon, but not because of their race, simply because they are seen as poor and uneducated since most live life separately from the Western society of Mexico. It's more of a clash of cultures matter, than anything racial. "

That is exactly what I was trying to say. When Sigma tried to say Mexico today was a "grand variety of rich cultures like the Mayans and the Aztecs" - it set me off. Thank you for the truth. The conquered assimilates the conqueror's culture. The conquerors expect this. In this case, as in many, Western culture conquered the native culture. This too is the case for America.

I once had a half-Mexican, half-Sioux ... well, "boyfriend" is a strong term ;) ... and I think that all that prejudice against Indians must stem from a certain type of envy....

Let's just say that Freud would have been proud!

<<This whole topic came about when Sigma tried to imply that there was no racism in Mexico - that all groups live together
in harmony - which I think is laughable at best and pretty pathetic at worst.>>

Tiffany yes I agree there is racists everywhere but there are levels of racism too and you would never find in the history of Latin America the level of racism from a country like U.S. which was 40 or 50 years back almost like a South Africa. So I can't see the laughable or pathetic thing about it. I could be wrong but it seems it does bother you that people have suffered less racism outside your own country.

Mexicans come in different shapes, height, eye-color, skin-complexion and ethnic background etc. Hence, we Mexicans aren't a race.....we're a nationality.


Demographics of Mexico:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Mexico


----------------->>>


Links to various ethnic-groups in Mexico:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Ethnic_groups_in_Mexico

http://www.mexconnect.com/mex_/feature/ethnic/ethnicindex.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexico


---------------------------------->>>>>>>

Some ethnic-groups of Mexico worth noticing, with respect to the rest.

(Greeks) Sinaloa, culiacan

http://www1.greece.gr/GLOBAL_GREECE/SPOTLIGHT/thegreeksideofmexico.stm


(Germans) Chihuahua, cauthemoc

http://www.mcc.org/themes/mennonites/



(Italians) Michoacan, nueva Italia

http://veniceblog.typepad.com/veniceblog/2004/05/venetian_dialec.html


&

The Venetian dialect spoken in Puebla, chipilo:

http://orbilat.com/Languages/Venetan/Dialects/Chipilo.html

http://www.mexicodesconocido.com.mx/english/historia/siglo_xix/detalle.cfm?idsec=3&idsub=21&idpag=1817



(Coahuila de Zaragoza, Torreon) *different ethnicites for example: Germans, Arabs, Greeks & Spaniards to name a few.

http://www.weblaguna.com/fotos/categories.php?cat_id=10&page=3
http://www.holalaguna.com/
http://www.derollx.com/
(pictures)


(Jalisco, Los Altos de Jalisco) Spaniards, majority

http://tepaenlinea.net/portada.html
http://tepaenlinea.net/0608/summer.html
http://tepaenlinea.net/misc.html
(pictures)

http://www.ubilae.com.mx/fotos_126.html
(pictures)

http://www.terra.com.mx/Turismo/articulo/085028/
(site)

*La sociedad en Tepatitlán de Morelos es homogénea. La población en su mayoría son criollos descendientes de españoles y al igual que toda la región de Los Altos de Jalisco, la sociedad es conservadora y sus tradiciones son muy arraigadas.*

http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tepatitl%C3%A1n_de_Morelos

etc.


PERSONAL NOTE:
I'm Mexican (of Italian and Spanish descent.) My mom's family is from "Los altos de Jalisco, Jalisco" and my father's family is from Leon, Guanajuato. Anyhow, just thought I would share this information with all of you.

« Tiffany yes I agree there is racists everywhere but there are levels of racism too and you would never find in the history of Latin America the level of racism from a country like U.S. which was 40 or 50 years back almost like a South Africa. »

I don't think that Tiffany was talking about how things were 50 years ago. Rather, I think that she was talking about how things are now. Equally, I don't think it's fair to say that the *whole* of the US was like South Africa 50 years ago — I thought that it was only really the Southern States, but I could be wrong. And of course, when I say South Africa, I'm referring to South Africa from before 12 years ago, not today.

It appears that Spanish will overtake English in the U.S. in the not too distant future. Immigration from Spanish speaking countries into the United States has been overwhelming.

The US doesn't have an official language. English isn't the official language of the US so Spanish cannot be the second official language.

In the not too distant future, the U.S. will have an official language It will be Chinese. Don't laugh!

Chinese language, culture, and population will die out, because of forced population control and selective abortions and infanticide of baby girls.

(Tiffany yes I agree there is racists everywhere but there are levels of racism too and you would never find in the history of Latin America the level of racism from a country like U.S. which was 40 or 50 years back almost like a South Africa.)

The comparison you have made Aldves is incorrect you must compare the sitution of the Native Americans with that of the Africans in South Africa and the African Americans with that of the Indians in South Africa 12 years ago.

Don't forget the Africans weren't just Africans but rather Zulus, Xosas, Sothos...
This ment that if someone was African and came from Europe or America for instance he could live in the European areas.

I remeber a interview a African South African gave when he moved away from South African gave when he moved to the southern part of the US. He said that South Africa is not racest at least in comparison to there, this was in the 80's though. Even though South Africa has made a 180º
degree turn the Southern part of the US is moving much much slower.

This doesn't mean that Apartheid was right because it wasn't. I do think it should never have existed but it did and so we must look at it so that it never happens again.

<<The comparison you have made Aldvs is incorrect..>

Joey, racism is racism no matter who is the person discriminated, Latinos, Asians, Blacks or American natives. The point is U.S. has been and is today the main country in America that suffers of an important level of serious racism not Latin America. That's sad and I'm not saying that everybody is racist but some authorities show such illness.

Also see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ku_Klux_Klan

Aldvs,
I hope you got a chance to read my long post which expressed my opinion before it was deleted. How can you say racist discrimination does not exist in Latin America? I think you said you are a Criollo right? Maybe, you just haven't experienced it first hand, the way white Anglos in the U.S. don't experience much discrimination. The Anglo cultural view toward race is different from the Latin one, yes. For instance, Protestant English settlers did not marry among the natives, but with their own kind, while intermarriage, and a large mestizo population was common among Spanish settlers, or even the few French settlers in North America. But, although racism takes different forms depending on the localities, it can still be present. Mexico suffers from racism. White is good. Western culture and language is good. Native language and culture is bad. Indians are lower class. And there is discrimination against the Indians on behalf of the white ruling class. I have family in Guaudalajara, and Cabos San Lucas, and they are all Criollos. They will freely admit that class systems are orchestrated according to racial lines. And I have in-laws from D.F. who are political activists, against racial discrimination in Mexico. I think in certain regions, where the population is predominantly Indian, the official language taught in schools should be Native. That's just one among other things.