Poland for exampel and in the Nordic countries also Sander can speak some German and I don´t think I have to regret my self about that many Dutch people has studied German.
European language?
<<We're not turning into Adam are we now Candy? >.
Well, hardly, as I live in Germany! Given that only 8% of pupils in the EU currently learn German and only 8% of non-native German speakers within the EU speak it, I just don't think it's as useful as you seem to think. It's hardly spoken at all in Southern Europe. And I taught English in Poland and German certainly wasn't compulsory, at least in the area where I lived.
http://europa.eu.int/comm/education/policies/lang/languages/index_en.html#2most%20useful
Well, hardly, as I live in Germany! Given that only 8% of pupils in the EU currently learn German and only 8% of non-native German speakers within the EU speak it, I just don't think it's as useful as you seem to think. It's hardly spoken at all in Southern Europe. And I taught English in Poland and German certainly wasn't compulsory, at least in the area where I lived.
http://europa.eu.int/comm/education/policies/lang/languages/index_en.html#2most%20useful
OK Swede, whatever. It's 89% for English and 32% for French, but if you want....
Sander, if you're still there: Düsseldorf is being invaded by the Dutch!!
Sander, if you're still there: Düsseldorf is being invaded by the Dutch!!
<<If we talk about verbs, is it linguistically correct call the different verb forms cases? The term ''case'' belongs only to nouns, as far as I know.>>
I don't know a lot of the formal terms when it comes to langauges either. Yes, perhaps "case" is not the best word.
I don't know a lot of the formal terms when it comes to langauges either. Yes, perhaps "case" is not the best word.
<<Greg posts in French all the time but no-one says anything to him. >>
I've said plenty to greg about posting in French. I've seen others do it too.
I've said plenty to greg about posting in French. I've seen others do it too.
"Case" refers to inflection in nouns (declension).
Inflection in verbs is "conjugation" and in Indo-European languages is generally based on person (first, second, third person).
Inflection in verbs is "conjugation" and in Indo-European languages is generally based on person (first, second, third person).
Many people *try* to learn German as a foreign language in Europe, but not many people do learn it. German has a difficult structure. So probably many people in Europe know *some* German, and if that qualifies as knowing the language for you, then fine.
=>Düsseldorf is being invaded by the Dutch!! <=
Finally, 'Operation Christmas Garden' has started! :-)
Finally, 'Operation Christmas Garden' has started! :-)
I am learning English, French and Latin, and I see that French and Latin are extremely difficult
Pronounciation is not a problem at all, but you have to use your brain like you are learning mathemathics (well, the cases etc)
Many people say that the Scandinavian languages are so difficult, but they are not when it comes to verb structure, cases, etc
Is it only the pronounciation people are thinking so much about?
Since English, Norwegian, Swedish and Danish are as simple as possible! (but maybe it´s simpler to pronounce Latin than Norwegian?)
Pronounciation is not a problem at all, but you have to use your brain like you are learning mathemathics (well, the cases etc)
Many people say that the Scandinavian languages are so difficult, but they are not when it comes to verb structure, cases, etc
Is it only the pronounciation people are thinking so much about?
Since English, Norwegian, Swedish and Danish are as simple as possible! (but maybe it´s simpler to pronounce Latin than Norwegian?)
<<Finally, 'Operation Christmas Garden' has started! :-) >
:-)
Seriously, the Dutch outnumber the Germans in the Altstadt these days! It's almost a shock when you hear someone speaking German! :) "Hey, what are YOU doing here??!" :)
:-)
Seriously, the Dutch outnumber the Germans in the Altstadt these days! It's almost a shock when you hear someone speaking German! :) "Hey, what are YOU doing here??!" :)
The Swede: >>If we shall have a European language ( which many don´t want to have, and I am also one of them) it should be German. It´s the biggest language in Europe and it´s no doubt about it. German has roughly 100 [million] speakers today and Germany is also the biggest economy in Europe. Thats the truth even if you dislike it. Spain or Spanish can´t match Germany today (maybe they can somwhere in the future but that is an other debate).<<
Candy: >>And how many people in Europe actually learn German as a foreign language?<<
The number of people learning German as a foreign language seems to be the highest in Eastern Europe, especially in countries which have had strong historical ties with Germany and/or Austria. Hungary and Slovenia are perfect examples, and maybe the Czech Republic as well, although the Czech-German relationships were typically strained during the 20th century (and so were those between historic Bohemia and Austria - the latter dominating the former - during the 19th century). In Western Europe, it is The Netherlands which has the highest number of German speakers. However, even in these countries, English is definitely becoming the first foreign language. Therefore, ironically, even if German has the most native speakers in the EU, I don't think it will ever become more than a regional lingua franca (used mainly between German speakers and those living in the neighbouring countries). German speakers themselves seem to be favouring English in communicating with foreigners.
As to the actual topic of this thread, I have formerly expressed my opinion (in another thread) that you can't pick a single language and claim that it is THE European language. English definitely comes in handy in most countries, and German and French are spoken in more than one country, but even the latter two are rather regional lingua francas (although French is definitely a major world language, but not predominant in the whole of Europe). As I imagine, the most likely thing to expect is that English is going to be the lingua franca over the whole of Europe, and people will still be speaking one of the major languages of Europe besides English. Thus, maybe English and French in South Europe and Romania, English and Spanish in Portugal, English and German in Central East Europe, or even English and Russian (!) in some Slavic and the Baltic countries.
To me, Luxembourg is the ideal model in this respect, where most of the population speaks as many as three languages (and as the graph posted by Candy shows, this country has by far the largest number of foreign language speakers). The trick is that this can be explained by the fact that it is at the intersaction of three cultural regions: French, German and Dutch/Flemish, and that the native dialect there is mainly reserved for spoken communication.
Candy: >>And how many people in Europe actually learn German as a foreign language?<<
The number of people learning German as a foreign language seems to be the highest in Eastern Europe, especially in countries which have had strong historical ties with Germany and/or Austria. Hungary and Slovenia are perfect examples, and maybe the Czech Republic as well, although the Czech-German relationships were typically strained during the 20th century (and so were those between historic Bohemia and Austria - the latter dominating the former - during the 19th century). In Western Europe, it is The Netherlands which has the highest number of German speakers. However, even in these countries, English is definitely becoming the first foreign language. Therefore, ironically, even if German has the most native speakers in the EU, I don't think it will ever become more than a regional lingua franca (used mainly between German speakers and those living in the neighbouring countries). German speakers themselves seem to be favouring English in communicating with foreigners.
As to the actual topic of this thread, I have formerly expressed my opinion (in another thread) that you can't pick a single language and claim that it is THE European language. English definitely comes in handy in most countries, and German and French are spoken in more than one country, but even the latter two are rather regional lingua francas (although French is definitely a major world language, but not predominant in the whole of Europe). As I imagine, the most likely thing to expect is that English is going to be the lingua franca over the whole of Europe, and people will still be speaking one of the major languages of Europe besides English. Thus, maybe English and French in South Europe and Romania, English and Spanish in Portugal, English and German in Central East Europe, or even English and Russian (!) in some Slavic and the Baltic countries.
To me, Luxembourg is the ideal model in this respect, where most of the population speaks as many as three languages (and as the graph posted by Candy shows, this country has by far the largest number of foreign language speakers). The trick is that this can be explained by the fact that it is at the intersaction of three cultural regions: French, German and Dutch/Flemish, and that the native dialect there is mainly reserved for spoken communication.
Candy: >>Düsseldorf is being invaded by the Dutch!!<<
I have heard that many Dutch people are afraid that the sea level will rise in the near future so much as to cause severe floods in many parts of the country. Therefore, they are seeking out locations in Continental Europe as places to move in case there is an emergency. Is that really true?! Or is the reason more prosaic, for example, the lower costs of living and the fact that The Netherlands is already much overpopulated? At any rate, real estate in Hungary is also being bought in the largest numbers by the Dutch, of all foreigners.
I have heard that many Dutch people are afraid that the sea level will rise in the near future so much as to cause severe floods in many parts of the country. Therefore, they are seeking out locations in Continental Europe as places to move in case there is an emergency. Is that really true?! Or is the reason more prosaic, for example, the lower costs of living and the fact that The Netherlands is already much overpopulated? At any rate, real estate in Hungary is also being bought in the largest numbers by the Dutch, of all foreigners.
Some hints concerning my question above can be found here:
http://www.newhouse.com/archive/mcquaid112105a.html
http://www.newhouse.com/archive/mcquaid112105a.html