Eh decepcionante que ainda tenha pessoas que nao se atentaram a um fato simples, é o povo que faz a lingua, e quando algo se cristaliza pode vir qualquer gramatiqueiro de plantao, que nao adianta nao sai da boca do povao...é pra isso que nós letrados devemos nos ater, o PP está fora de contesto a muito tempo, dessa forma as mumias da ABL deveriam procurar urgentemente a renovacao da gramatica "normativa", pois dak a pouco vao criar outro Brasil onde so eles e alguns gramatiqueiros de plantao irao se comunicar... VIVA A LINGUISTICA pq foi com a ajuda dela que podemos desmacarar coisa berrantes da gramatica normativa... devemos amadurecer essa ideia
Portuguese + Spanish the fastest growing western languages
Giovanne e Gheyse : vocês estão a fazer uma tempestade num copo de água. Ninguém em Portugal põe em causa as especificidades do Português falado no Brasil, e tanto assim é que existem duas normas da língua. A questão é se essas diferenças são suficientes para que se possa falar de línguas diferentes, só isso.
A resposta é evidente, basta ler os vossos textos : estão escritos em Português, não há dúvida possível. Tentem traduzir as vossas ideias para "Brasileiro" (não vale distorcer a ortografia).
Gheyse, só mais uma notinha : "está fora de contesto a muito tempo" deve ser "está fora de conteXto HÁ muito tempo". Verbo haver, certo?
A resposta é evidente, basta ler os vossos textos : estão escritos em Português, não há dúvida possível. Tentem traduzir as vossas ideias para "Brasileiro" (não vale distorcer a ortografia).
Gheyse, só mais uma notinha : "está fora de contesto a muito tempo" deve ser "está fora de conteXto HÁ muito tempo". Verbo haver, certo?
Guest Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:01 am GMT
###There is a theory I believe that the reason why South American countries are a bunch of whiners are due to the United States and it's historical masters the English.###
They use that theory to blame the Portuguese for their own failure. It is called a theory because no one could prove it was a fact.
###Unlike the careless Spanish and Portugese who robbed the colonies of it's resources taking shiploads back to the motherland. The English invested in it's colonies developing them and reaping in the benefits of a successful 'crop'###
Careless in what way???
It was impossible to have robed the colonies they belonged to the Portuguese. That way Brazilians, Americans and Canadians are all robbing the native indians.
Brazil is a leading producer of gold, diamonds, gemstones, can anyone remember that?
###There is a theory I believe that the reason why South American countries are a bunch of whiners are due to the United States and it's historical masters the English.###
They use that theory to blame the Portuguese for their own failure. It is called a theory because no one could prove it was a fact.
###Unlike the careless Spanish and Portugese who robbed the colonies of it's resources taking shiploads back to the motherland. The English invested in it's colonies developing them and reaping in the benefits of a successful 'crop'###
Careless in what way???
It was impossible to have robed the colonies they belonged to the Portuguese. That way Brazilians, Americans and Canadians are all robbing the native indians.
Brazil is a leading producer of gold, diamonds, gemstones, can anyone remember that?
Giovanne Sat Feb 25, 2006 11:57 am GMT
##Seguinte: Portugal fica em outro continente.##
Good you know that!
##Tem um oceano de distância entre nós. A renda per capita deles não se compara com a nossa. O Índice de Desenvolvimento Humano (IDH) idem. Mesmo assim, TEMOS de nos sujeitar ao português de Portugal.##
Send a letter complaining to your rulers. Really it is a big ocean for all. Brazilians in this forum seem to have been drinking salted water and do not realise YOUR LANGUAGE PROBLEMS IS IS NOT THE PROBLEM OF THE PORTUGUESE PEOPLE.
##O dia em que os imbecis da Academia Brasileira de Letras (ABL) e mais uns tantos filólogos babacas e uns gramáticos mercnários se derem conta que não é possível continuar macaqueando as regras lingüísticas dos portugueses, que temos de assumir a NOSSA língua, a brasileira, estudar NOSSA língua vai ser a coisa mais fácil, mais bico, mais baba do mundo.##
At least you are calling bad names to the right people! But you will be speaking another Creole of Portuguese, it is better to change to Tupi otherwise there will be always someone complaining that it is a coloniser language.
“a coisa mais fácil”? you are a dreamer, someone will make a mess of it just like all the rest.
###1. Uso de pronome direto como objeto direto. Calma! Calma, eu explico. Melhor: exemplifico.´
João saiu correndo. Peguem-no.
É assim em Portugal. No Brasil, mesmo entre as pessoas "cultas", o normal, o natural é dizer:
João saiu correndo. Peguem ele.
E aí, qual o problema de a gente usar ele nesse caso? Nenhum. Pra nós, nenhum. Mas como usam diferente em Portugal...###
Who cares, it is still Portuguese, but if it is not in the grammar adopted by Brazil it is wrong.
###Entende? Você e eu nascemos aqui, do outro lado do mundo, separados de Portugal geográfica, social, econômica e culturalmente de Portugal, mas - como na cabeça de alguns, bem poucos, mas que detêm o poder de decisão, os portugueses são os "donos" da língua - temos de usar as regras deles.###
Blame them not the Portuguese that do not decide a thing about Brazil.
###Por quê? Simples. Porque tem de traduzir, senão a gente não entende picas nenhuma. É outra língua. E não só aquelas palavras diferentes (bicha=fila etc), mas a pronúncia, a sintaxe, tudo.###
An advise if you think that way don’t leave your town in the south of Brazil they also say "bicha" instead of "fila" and have many more strange words.
###Todos vocês se deram conta do óbvio: é mesmo odioso ter de estudar, da maneira como tentar ensinar, essa bizarrice que chamam de "língua portuguesa".###
You are dreaming, by the way why you keep writing in Portuguese to say such “bizarrice”?
##Seguinte: Portugal fica em outro continente.##
Good you know that!
##Tem um oceano de distância entre nós. A renda per capita deles não se compara com a nossa. O Índice de Desenvolvimento Humano (IDH) idem. Mesmo assim, TEMOS de nos sujeitar ao português de Portugal.##
Send a letter complaining to your rulers. Really it is a big ocean for all. Brazilians in this forum seem to have been drinking salted water and do not realise YOUR LANGUAGE PROBLEMS IS IS NOT THE PROBLEM OF THE PORTUGUESE PEOPLE.
##O dia em que os imbecis da Academia Brasileira de Letras (ABL) e mais uns tantos filólogos babacas e uns gramáticos mercnários se derem conta que não é possível continuar macaqueando as regras lingüísticas dos portugueses, que temos de assumir a NOSSA língua, a brasileira, estudar NOSSA língua vai ser a coisa mais fácil, mais bico, mais baba do mundo.##
At least you are calling bad names to the right people! But you will be speaking another Creole of Portuguese, it is better to change to Tupi otherwise there will be always someone complaining that it is a coloniser language.
“a coisa mais fácil”? you are a dreamer, someone will make a mess of it just like all the rest.
###1. Uso de pronome direto como objeto direto. Calma! Calma, eu explico. Melhor: exemplifico.´
João saiu correndo. Peguem-no.
É assim em Portugal. No Brasil, mesmo entre as pessoas "cultas", o normal, o natural é dizer:
João saiu correndo. Peguem ele.
E aí, qual o problema de a gente usar ele nesse caso? Nenhum. Pra nós, nenhum. Mas como usam diferente em Portugal...###
Who cares, it is still Portuguese, but if it is not in the grammar adopted by Brazil it is wrong.
###Entende? Você e eu nascemos aqui, do outro lado do mundo, separados de Portugal geográfica, social, econômica e culturalmente de Portugal, mas - como na cabeça de alguns, bem poucos, mas que detêm o poder de decisão, os portugueses são os "donos" da língua - temos de usar as regras deles.###
Blame them not the Portuguese that do not decide a thing about Brazil.
###Por quê? Simples. Porque tem de traduzir, senão a gente não entende picas nenhuma. É outra língua. E não só aquelas palavras diferentes (bicha=fila etc), mas a pronúncia, a sintaxe, tudo.###
An advise if you think that way don’t leave your town in the south of Brazil they also say "bicha" instead of "fila" and have many more strange words.
###Todos vocês se deram conta do óbvio: é mesmo odioso ter de estudar, da maneira como tentar ensinar, essa bizarrice que chamam de "língua portuguesa".###
You are dreaming, by the way why you keep writing in Portuguese to say such “bizarrice”?
Get the picture?
Because Brazilians have corruped the Portuguese language to a point where they don't understand each other any longuer, the Spanish language will take over in Brazil and Brazil will become a Spanish speaking country in the near future.
That will be easily accomplished because Brazilians claim that they understand Spanish better than they understand they own language.
Free from Portuguese, Spanish will become the dominant language in South America. Brazilians will study the Spanish grammar and wil become a true hispanic lating American country. That will solve all their problems, linguistic and identity problems, and also their hatred for Portugal and everything Portuguese.
On the other hand Portugal will be able to claim back the Portuguese language free from the corrupted Brazilan variety.
What would be left of the Portuguese language in Sotuth America will be a variety of Portuguese creoles similar to the Capeverdean creoles.
The diff is that in Cape Verde Portuguese is still the lingua franca. In Brazil the lingua franca will be Spanish There is no way to avoid it. It is hapenning already.
Because Brazilians have corruped the Portuguese language to a point where they don't understand each other any longuer, the Spanish language will take over in Brazil and Brazil will become a Spanish speaking country in the near future.
That will be easily accomplished because Brazilians claim that they understand Spanish better than they understand they own language.
Free from Portuguese, Spanish will become the dominant language in South America. Brazilians will study the Spanish grammar and wil become a true hispanic lating American country. That will solve all their problems, linguistic and identity problems, and also their hatred for Portugal and everything Portuguese.
On the other hand Portugal will be able to claim back the Portuguese language free from the corrupted Brazilan variety.
What would be left of the Portuguese language in Sotuth America will be a variety of Portuguese creoles similar to the Capeverdean creoles.
The diff is that in Cape Verde Portuguese is still the lingua franca. In Brazil the lingua franca will be Spanish There is no way to avoid it. It is hapenning already.
"the Spanish language will take over in Brazil and Brazil will become a Spanish speaking country in the near future."
You really do not know Brazilians. LOL LOL
"Brazilians will study the Spanish grammar and wil become a true hispanic lating American country."
Study? Only a small minority learns languages. They will start to hate the Spaniards and their grammar. LOL LOL
"It is hapenning already."
Where?
Long live Tupi!
You really do not know Brazilians. LOL LOL
"Brazilians will study the Spanish grammar and wil become a true hispanic lating American country."
Study? Only a small minority learns languages. They will start to hate the Spaniards and their grammar. LOL LOL
"It is hapenning already."
Where?
Long live Tupi!
Hoje estive com uma puta Brazileira e ela entendeu tudinho. Tudo ate ao fim. Sao melhores que as espanholas. Venham mais brazileiras. Viba as putas brazileiras!
Si eso se ignifiqua lo que creo, solo tengo una pregunta.
Como?
Los dos paises estan mas de 6,000 kilometros separados.
O, y tambien...You should be ashamed of yourself, these forums are not for that.
Como?
Los dos paises estan mas de 6,000 kilometros separados.
O, y tambien...You should be ashamed of yourself, these forums are not for that.
''Hoje estive com uma puta Brazileira e ela entendeu tudinho. Tudo ate ao fim. Sao melhores que as espanholas. Venham mais brazileiras. Viba as putas brazileiras! ''
tu é um baita babaca. vai se tratar!
tu é um baita babaca. vai se tratar!
Tupi language second lesson
Verbo falar (nhe’eng), no modo indicativo - presente ou pretérito:
ixé a-nhe’eng - eu falo; eu falei
endé ere-nhe’eng - tu falas; tu falaste
a’e o-nhe’eng - ele fala
oré oro-nhe’eng - nós falamos (exclusivo)
îandé îa-nhe’eng - nós falamos (inclusivo)
pee) pe-nhe’eng - vós falais; vós falastes
a’e o-nhe’eng - eles falam
Verbo falar (nhe’eng), no modo indicativo - presente ou pretérito:
ixé a-nhe’eng - eu falo; eu falei
endé ere-nhe’eng - tu falas; tu falaste
a’e o-nhe’eng - ele fala
oré oro-nhe’eng - nós falamos (exclusivo)
îandé îa-nhe’eng - nós falamos (inclusivo)
pee) pe-nhe’eng - vós falais; vós falastes
a’e o-nhe’eng - eles falam
What's with me and Tupi? I am fed up of seeing some low-life Brazilians making a fool of themselves. The Brazilian European language is Portuguese, the Brazilian native language is Tupi, let us speak it then, let us speak both and stop the nonsense. If they really cared about Brazil they would be doing something useful like promoting Brazilian native culture and not step on others to look bigger.
Tupi is the most well documented and preserved Language in Brazil it is still spoken in Amazons and Rio Negro.
The Jesuit priest José de Anchieta wrote in 1555 a Tupi grammar “Arte de Gramática da Língua Mais Usada na Costa do Brasil” that was published in Portugal in 1595.
Native endangered language are becoming a big source of interest for people around the world. In new Zealand a Tv channel is already in Maori and English. Why not Tupi?
"Oú tubixá katú
mamó suí nde reká,
nde pópe imeengatú.
Aroporaséi serú
xe abé, xe anametá."
Tradução:
Veio cacique valente
de longe a te procurar
e às tuas mãos se entregar.
Também trago meu parente
para comigo dançar
Poem of the Jesuit priest José de Anchieta writen in Tupi in the XVI century
http://portal.unesco.org/culture/en/ev.php-URL_ID=8270&URL_DO=DO_TOPIC&URL_SECTION=201.html
http://www.maoritelevision.com/
Tupi is the most well documented and preserved Language in Brazil it is still spoken in Amazons and Rio Negro.
The Jesuit priest José de Anchieta wrote in 1555 a Tupi grammar “Arte de Gramática da Língua Mais Usada na Costa do Brasil” that was published in Portugal in 1595.
Native endangered language are becoming a big source of interest for people around the world. In new Zealand a Tv channel is already in Maori and English. Why not Tupi?
"Oú tubixá katú
mamó suí nde reká,
nde pópe imeengatú.
Aroporaséi serú
xe abé, xe anametá."
Tradução:
Veio cacique valente
de longe a te procurar
e às tuas mãos se entregar.
Também trago meu parente
para comigo dançar
Poem of the Jesuit priest José de Anchieta writen in Tupi in the XVI century
http://portal.unesco.org/culture/en/ev.php-URL_ID=8270&URL_DO=DO_TOPIC&URL_SECTION=201.html
http://www.maoritelevision.com/
Is Brazil becoming a Spanish sepaking country?
Read all about Spanish taking over in Brazil
El español en Brasil
Francisco Moreno Fernández
http://spanish.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://cvc.cervantes.es/obref/anuario/anuario%5F00/moreno/
Read all about Spanish taking over in Brazil
El español en Brasil
Francisco Moreno Fernández
http://spanish.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://cvc.cervantes.es/obref/anuario/anuario%5F00/moreno/
««Is Brazil becoming a Spanish sepaking country?»»
Did Europe become an English speaking continent? English is taught in Brazil for a long time and look what happens:
"Although English is taught in secondary and in high schools, only a few people (former exchange students, foreign language students, people who have lived or worked abroad) can speak English well, but you will probably find them only in the big cities, hotels, multinational companies, airports, etc. and you will most probably not stay in these places during the whole of your visit to Brazil." http://www.sonia-portuguese.com/text/faqs.htm
You are making such a fuss because Brazil is just learning another language that you forget that all schools in Europe teach languages and no country was taken over no matter the size.
After one or two years, without anyone to talk in Spanish, most people will forget what they learned at school, only those who have frequent contact with Spanish speakers will be able to speak the language.
Did Europe become an English speaking continent? English is taught in Brazil for a long time and look what happens:
"Although English is taught in secondary and in high schools, only a few people (former exchange students, foreign language students, people who have lived or worked abroad) can speak English well, but you will probably find them only in the big cities, hotels, multinational companies, airports, etc. and you will most probably not stay in these places during the whole of your visit to Brazil." http://www.sonia-portuguese.com/text/faqs.htm
You are making such a fuss because Brazil is just learning another language that you forget that all schools in Europe teach languages and no country was taken over no matter the size.
After one or two years, without anyone to talk in Spanish, most people will forget what they learned at school, only those who have frequent contact with Spanish speakers will be able to speak the language.