English, German, & Dutch
Hallo Saturn!
Warst du schon Saturn, bevor ich Jupitar war? lol
Also, ich kann aus eigener Erfahrung bestätigen, dass die Deutschen sich im Allgemeinen darüber freuen, wenn Nichtmuttersprachler versuchen, ihre Sprache zu lernern, und wollen sie ermutigen, und nicht kritisieren!
@ Saturn
Ich bin bereits nach Deutschland gewesen, ich wuchs dort in Baden auf. Ich habe nichts gegen die Deutschen, nur die wahnsinnigen deutschen Dummköpfe, die dieses Forum abpatrouillieren.
Übrigens, Saturn, müssen Sie gültige Kritik akzeptieren, sowie Sie es verteilen. Sie sind ebenso schlecht!
(well...not really : )
"It's just a "root for the underdog" notion in my opinion. We always root for the underdog right? Had the Celts been the majority influence we would hate them and no one would be interested in hearing about any theories postulated about them. But I'm game--I'd love to at least hear what it's all about... "
Have you ever heard of the work of German linguist Theo Vennemann? Here's one of his excerpts.
http://www.rotary-munich.de/2005-2006/theo-vennemann.pdf
Particularly interesting is how Old English mirrored German in many aspects that are now lost in English, such as for example the sympathetic dative construction.
That's interesting. However it is not entirely true that English never uses the external possessor construction that he refers to. Phrases such as:
'He hit him in the face' or 'It burnt him on the arm' show English does still retain this kind of feature in certain instances.
Those aren't external possessor constructions. If you said, 'it burnt his arm' you're using the genitive adjective (his) to show possession, but you can't say 'it burnt the arm to him' which you would be able to do if English had retained the construction.
Dutch language derived from Low German dialects (Low Frankish) in Middle ages. It mixed with Frisian language dialects,Low Saxon dialects. Middle Dutch (Middle Low Frankish)and Middle Low Saxon are two mutually intelligible varieties of the same Middle Low German language.Today, descendants of Middle Low German language.Low German dialects (spoken in North Germany and North East Netherlands(called Low Saxon) are mutually intelligible with Standart Dutch.
Example of Low German of North Germany:
"Wi sölen in all Streken de Utboo van Steden vörandrieven, de för de Stön van
Hoogbegaavten tosamenwarken, un dat Angebood van Stipendien för
Hoogbegaavten breder maken."
You can see,that closest language(or dialect) to Dutch is Low German.
No. Low German today is just High German with an accent. Real Low German is dead.
Angebood = Angebot (aanbot in Dutch)
Stipendien = Stipendium (studiebeurs in Dutch)
Dutch starts right after the Franks, not the Middle Ages.
<<No. Low German today is just High German with an accent. Real Low German is dead.
>>
um, I don't think so...
Plattdüütsch is not HochDeutsch with a PD accent--it's still very much a distinct language (albeit with strong HD overtones); and is alive and kickin'...
Plattdüütsch (Neddersassisch) höört to de westgermaanschen Spraken. Se hett den tweten germaanschen Luudwannel nich mitmaakt un is dormit ene nedderdüütsche Spraak. De Utdrück Nedderdüütsch un Neddersassisch (Nedersaksisch) warrt denn ok ganz faken jüst so bruukt as Plattdüütsch.
De offizielle Sprakenkood na ISO 639-2 is nds. Plattdüütsch is in dat Königriek vun de Nedderlannen un in de Bundsrepublik Düütschland in de Europääsche Charta vun de Regional- oder Minnerheitenspraken opnahmen.
Is that Plattdeutsch? If so, it can't be seen as the same language as German. As a German speaker I can barely understand it. I assume it's not Dutch either, as Dutch normally seems more easily comprehensible. I mean it is familiar and you can get some of it, but still, it's not German!
<<Is that Plattdeutsch?>>
Yes, it is : )
Here is where I took the above passage from:
http://nds.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plattd%C3%BC%C3%BCtsch
In many ways, it has similarities with English:
to = to
as = as
naams = names
oold = old
is = is
good = good
jüstso/justso = just so
Being from the province of Groningen (Netherlands), the Plattdütsch example is very easy. If you're a Dutch person it just should be very easy to understand imho.
Plattdüütsch (Neddersassisch) höört to de westgermaanschen Spraken. Se hett den tweten germaanschen Luudwannel nich mitmaakt un is dormit ene nedderdüütsche Spraak. De Utdrück Nedderdüütsch un Neddersassisch (Nedersaksisch) warrt denn ok ganz faken jüst so bruukt as Plattdüütsch.
Platduits (Nedersaksisch) behoort tot de West-Germaanse talen. Zij heeft de tweede Duitse klankverschuiving niet meegemaakt en is daarmee een Nederduitse taal. De uitdrukking Nederduits en Nedersaksisch wordt dan ook erg vaak gebruikt als Plattdüütsch.
How it would be in my dialect:
Platduuts (Neddersaksisch) behört tot de westduutse toal'n. Sie het de twijde Duutse Luudverkuving nait metmoakt en is doarmit aine nedderduutse toal. De uutdrukking Nedderduuts en Neddersaksisch wurdt dan ok voak bruukt as platduuts.
(it's difficult to write in a dialect) ;(
@Leasnam
Also in my dialect there's the 'old' also. Ain old huus. (An old house).
(Btw I live close near the Fryslân border, so I'll have some Frisian sound as well ).
Low German is dead. It died after the fall of the Hanseatic League and mass education in German. Only a few old people speak it.
There exist 2 varieties today. High German with a Low German accent and Dutch with a Low German accent.
A good example of how divided 'Low German' is today. Wikipedia started with a single 'Low German' project. It proved unworkable; and now there are two. One in Dutch Low Saxon, and one in German Low Saxon. That's the reality.
http://nds.wikipedia.org/
http://nds-nl.wikipedia.org/
<<A good example of how divided 'Low German' is today. Wikipedia started with a single 'Low German' project. It proved unworkable; and now there are two. One in Dutch Low Saxon, and one in German Low Saxon. That's the reality.>>
And do Nedersaksisch and Plattdüütsch really look like 'German' to you?--German with an accent?
You'd better get your facts straight.