Latin America: Portuguese or Spanish?
Convidado,
You do your generalizations, so it's only fair I do mine: these Brazilians that get "pissed off" when they're mixed with their Latino kinsmen are upper-class/middle-class, mostly white (or Brazilian "white") that don't want to get confused with the dirty masses of brown-skinned immigrants from Latin America in America.
Fact is, most Brazilian immigrants to the US are cut from the same mixed-race cloth as their Mexican, Central American brethren. Fact number two is, the vast majority of Brazilians stem from the Iberian peninsula (forget about national boundaries that weren't clear until the 16th century), plus a mix of the native dwellers of the continent and the involuntary "immigrants" from Africa. So forget also the mumbo-jumbo about Quebeckers and Haitians also being "Latin". That is so much horse manure. To deny the common heritage of Brazilians and Mexicans, Argentinians etc is to deny the common heritage of Galicians, Portuguese, Castillians, Leonese etc.
Franco,
What I'm against is the dissolution of France's national identity into a monstrous European union. Now, what d'you think about that?
I think that it's the same stupidity as that about Brazil's identity being diluted by a Latin American union. Plus, if some identity was to be in danger is that of smaller countries in Latin America like Chile. Brazil is the biggest country in LatAm in all aspects so every decission would necessarily to be aproved by Brazil. Furthermore, the Latin American union is intrinsically easier to put into practice because there is a clear leading nation like Brazil. This contrasts to Europe where there are at least two big players , Germany and France with similar power and which have often dissimilar points of view with respect to how to run the European Union. I'm really surprised that there are Brazilians who can't see the benefits of a Latin union and even treat with disdain the "latino" label as if it was a dirty word . Their Portuguese cousins have this very same mentality towards an Iberian union, they also think that their identity would be diluted, but I thought that Brazil was more mature and self-confident . I hope that the politicians in Brazil are more intelligent than the Brazilians on this forum and continue working for the Latin American union.
I don't know about Brazilian immigrants in "America". I was talking about Brazilian Brazilians in Brazil. But I see where you are coming from, I know the people who call the US "America". You just confirm what I've said: it's only the semi-cultured middle class who believe in this latino tales, mas o bom negro e o bom branco da Nação Brasileira dizem todos os dias: deixa disso camarada. I wonder how many latinos could identify the cultural reference I've just made? (googling doesn't count)
Now please tell me, what is this common heritage of Brazilians, Argentinians and Mexicans? For starters, we were colonized by different European countries. We speak different languages. We have different ethnic compositions. Our countries are all very different in terms of geography. Our countries have very different historical paths. Also different economies. We don't read the same books. We don't eat the same food. We don't listen to the same music. We don't have the same national myths. And don't know what you're talking about when you say the borders weren't clear, Portugal has a more or less stable border since the XIII century. In fact it is one of the oldest large European modern states. The only time where national borders have not been clear was during the 60 years of Iberian Union. Needless to say that Brazilians and Portuguese were not very fond of it.
"[...] contarey huma historia, que aconteceo em hum Tribunal de tres, que tem o Santo Officio neste Reyno. Prenderaõ hum bruxo, por ter trato com o diabo, e consultalo em muitas duvidas: reprehenderaõ-no os Inquisidores, porque sendo Christaõ bautisado dava credito ao diabo, sendo obrigado a ter, e crer que he pay da mentira. Pay da mentira he, respondeo o bruxo, e por tal o conheco : mas com tudo isso, ainda que muitas vezes me mentia, nao deixava algumas vezes de me fallar verdade, e eu pelo uso alcançava logo tudo; porque me fallava em duas linguas, que eraõ a Portugueza, e Castelhana: e todas as vezes que me fallava em Portuguez, era certo que dizia verdade; e só quando me fallava em Castelhano, era certissimo que mentia. Naõ sey, se me declaro ? Quero dizer, que a lingoa Castelhana he estremada, e unica para pintar mentiras, como escolhida por quem he pay, e mestre dellas : e a Portugueza para fallar verdades [...]"
Most Europeans and Americans think Brazilians speak Spanish.
Brazil should invest more in the promotion of their country.
Or maybe Brazilians just don't like (or need) tourists, see the movie TURISTAS.
<<If you wanna piss a Brazilian off, call him latino and insist on speaking Spanish with him>>
Indeed...and they generally pretend not to understand the spanish.
Other way to piss off brazilians:
Ask him/her if they've been the Amazon rainforest.
Most Americans when they come upon Cajuns think they are speaking Spanish. A lot of British people mistake Spanish and French speakers.
<< Other way to piss off brazilians:
>>
Suggest most Brazilians are not as lilly white as they imagine themselves to be.
<< Suggest most Brazilians are not as lilly white as they imagine themselves to be. >>
We're talking about culture and you keep insisting on this racist nonsense.
Also I suggest you go watch American sitcoms with your latino hermanos, while we "racist" Brazilians read Cruz e Sousa, listen to Cartola, play capoeira, send offerings to Iemanjá, drool over Thalma de Freitas, study Milton Santos and eat some feijoada.
Spanish music is popular in Brazil: Shakira, Thalia and so on.
Spanish soap operas makes success in Brazil, not on Globo but on RedeTv and STB. There was a craze a few years ago when Gabriela Spanic (of Venezuela) visited Brazil. Also, both Argentinian and Mexican Rebelde were huge with teenage kids who had enough of that Malhação shit Globo make.
Why are there no black people or even mestizos on Latin American TV? Is it the most racist continent in the world? Even Paraguayan telenovelas are chock full of pristine white folk! There probably aren't enough white folk in Paraguay at all, so they have to import them to fill the roles, rather than use a meztiso.
<<Why are there no black people or even mestizos on Latin American TV?>>
Why are there no midgets on Latin American tV?
Reason is the same: they are less attractive. Audience demands tall and white people. Are TV channels racist? No, at any case it's the audience that is racist.