That said, IMHO the notion of an "Anglosphere" is probably much more valid with respect to Australia and New Zealand and somewhat more valid with respect to Canada (moreso if one excludes Quebec) than with respect to the US, at a cultural level excluding any solely political notions of any kind of "special relationship" or like. However, it is still probably more applicable to the US than, say, South Africa, despite South Africa's being far more recently directly politically tied to the UK than the present-day US.
For the love of Kernow
>> That said, IMHO the notion of an "Anglosphere" is probably much more valid with respect to Australia and New Zealand and somewhat more valid with respect to Canada (moreso if one excludes Quebec) than with respect to the US, at a cultural level excluding any solely political notions of any kind of "special relationship" or like. <<
I seem to remember that being sort of implied on the Wikipedia article about the Anglosphere; from what I can recall, it suggested in more formal terms that the United States was in some way the odd one out. Which is understandable, considering that British settlers have had a far greater influence in Canada, Australia and New Zealand (at least as far as I know) than in America. I'd also say that, in general, most British people probably feel as though they have more in common with Canadians, Australians and New Zealanders than with Americans.
I seem to remember that being sort of implied on the Wikipedia article about the Anglosphere; from what I can recall, it suggested in more formal terms that the United States was in some way the odd one out. Which is understandable, considering that British settlers have had a far greater influence in Canada, Australia and New Zealand (at least as far as I know) than in America. I'd also say that, in general, most British people probably feel as though they have more in common with Canadians, Australians and New Zealanders than with Americans.
<<I'm speaking for myself, and what I have observed of other people, here in the Upper Midwest; hence "here in the US", not "in the US".>>
OK, I see: I understood it as the whole US, not just your part of it, and it sounded like a gross generalisation!
<<Which is, at least in my opinion, total nonsense. >>
That is total nonsense, agreed, but I doubt that everyone thinks like that. Lots of British people have family and other ties in other English-speaking countries, so you can't lump them all together as 'chauvinist'.
I know lots of Germans who feel they have stronger ties with Austrians and German-speaking Swiss than with any other Europeans (and lots who don't, of course), and people who want to visit Namibia simply because they think everyone there speaks German. Does that 'really annoy' you as well?
OK, I see: I understood it as the whole US, not just your part of it, and it sounded like a gross generalisation!
<<Which is, at least in my opinion, total nonsense. >>
That is total nonsense, agreed, but I doubt that everyone thinks like that. Lots of British people have family and other ties in other English-speaking countries, so you can't lump them all together as 'chauvinist'.
I know lots of Germans who feel they have stronger ties with Austrians and German-speaking Swiss than with any other Europeans (and lots who don't, of course), and people who want to visit Namibia simply because they think everyone there speaks German. Does that 'really annoy' you as well?
Candy, you seem to have misunderstood me. It's not the idea of British people feeling closer ties with other English-speaking countries and Spanish people feeling closer ties with other Spanish-speaking countries (etc. etc.) rather than with other Europeans that 'really annoys' me. It's the notion that British people are somehow not Europeans at all which really annoys me — I see no value in lumping everyone from the mainland together and then trying to claim that we are in some way unique or distinct from all the rest of them put together; we are not.
Yes, I accept that many British people have specific familial and other ties in Australia, New Zealand etc. etc., as I accept that many Spanish people have similar ties with Argentina and the others, but that really wasn't what I was getting at. I don't think that many Spanish people would claim that they are 'not Europeans' simply because of feeling closer ties with Argentina or wherever than with other European countries, but maybe I'm wrong.
Yes, I accept that many British people have specific familial and other ties in Australia, New Zealand etc. etc., as I accept that many Spanish people have similar ties with Argentina and the others, but that really wasn't what I was getting at. I don't think that many Spanish people would claim that they are 'not Europeans' simply because of feeling closer ties with Argentina or wherever than with other European countries, but maybe I'm wrong.
OK, I see what you mean. Personally, I feel very European. However, I feel that the notion that the British are somehow 'different' or not really European isn't limited to the British, though. I often read the 'Talk' site on the 'Guardian' website, where a lot of French, Dutch, and other 'continental Europeans' post, and it seems to be a widespread notion - among them, anyway - that the British are 'different' and continental Europeans are the 'same'. I'm explaining this very badly, but I so often see phrases there like 'it's a widely-held view here on the continent' or 'on the continent, we see the UK/China/gun control/the environment/whatever as X' that I'm convinced the British (or some of them) are not the only ones who think they're 'different'.
The CNLA is dead. A new splinter group calling itselt the CRA (Cornish Republican Army) has emerged from the shadows. Moves by MI5 to defeat it have failed. All five people of the Cornish population has joined and are threatening all out war. The people have risen.
Interesting, thank you. That's incidentally not the first time I've heard of French people saying 'Europe' when they perhaps really mean 'France'. But I also tend to think that when we in Britain talk about 'The Continent', we don't really mean the entire European mainland; perhaps not even the whole of mainland Western Europe either. For me, the term always seems to imply primarily France, and then possibly Germany and the Benelux region, but not really Portugal or Hungary or Poland etc.
Benjamin, have you ever seen (or heard of) that famous headline in one of the British papers: 'Fog in Channel - Europe cut off'??!! (It might be apocryphal - I've never seen it myself). Perfectly encapsulates the attitude of some people, don't you think?!
I totally agree with you about 'The Continent' - to me the name seems to imply the areas nearer to Britain, certainly not Central or Eastern Europe or Scandinavia, though Spain might be included in it too. Somehow, there's a kind of implication in my mind of 'those European countries where the British might go on holiday', if you know what I mean, and the rest of Europe is so remote it's half mythical anyway, or possibly reachable only by spaceship. :-)
I totally agree with you about 'The Continent' - to me the name seems to imply the areas nearer to Britain, certainly not Central or Eastern Europe or Scandinavia, though Spain might be included in it too. Somehow, there's a kind of implication in my mind of 'those European countries where the British might go on holiday', if you know what I mean, and the rest of Europe is so remote it's half mythical anyway, or possibly reachable only by spaceship. :-)
It is not at all unusual for people here in the UK to use the word "Europe" when referring to that place on the other side of the English Channel. eg I think we'll go to Europe on our holidays this year. They may also say things like "It's the same in Britain and Europe". It's a true island mentality again......the British Isles and the Continent of Europe are two entirely sparate entities...us and them sort of thing. The "foreigners begin at Calais" way of thinking is still built into the British psyche by and large. It's probably related in some way to those Americans who show either resentment or indignance when it's pointed out to them that they are very much 100% foreigners here in the UK, irrespective of the shared English Language and heritage issues.
There was a very interesting discussion on late night TalkSport radio recently about what may well happen worldwide in the 21st century, and the prophecies of Nostradamus were mentioned a lot. That guy has been amazingly accurate up until now, and some of the things mentioned in the program were quite scary - really, really scary, even global climate catastrophe would you believe, but as far as this topic is concerned, Nostradamus forecast this for "the island of Britannia" in the 21st century: "It will become more isolated and separated from mainland Europe". What that means is anyone's guess, but of course the most obvious scenario is withdrawal from the EU! Or rising sea levels making us even more of an island. That is NOT my own opinion....blame Michel de Notredame (1503-66).
There was a very interesting discussion on late night TalkSport radio recently about what may well happen worldwide in the 21st century, and the prophecies of Nostradamus were mentioned a lot. That guy has been amazingly accurate up until now, and some of the things mentioned in the program were quite scary - really, really scary, even global climate catastrophe would you believe, but as far as this topic is concerned, Nostradamus forecast this for "the island of Britannia" in the 21st century: "It will become more isolated and separated from mainland Europe". What that means is anyone's guess, but of course the most obvious scenario is withdrawal from the EU! Or rising sea levels making us even more of an island. That is NOT my own opinion....blame Michel de Notredame (1503-66).
Just wondering... is it even possible to 'withdraw' from the EU overnight, or would such a process take 10 or so years? Is it even possible to leave the EU at all?
"Interesting, thank you. That's incidentally not the first time I've heard of French people saying 'Europe' when they perhaps really mean 'France'."
No, this is a misunderstanding, a french won't never make a mistake like that, neither a german, italian... When they say that, it is because there are more similarities between the continental europeans and the british. The british have a politic totally different, their politic is never totally european, sometimes they are closer to USA. That is why they should leave the european community and why they are seen diffferent.
No, this is a misunderstanding, a french won't never make a mistake like that, neither a german, italian... When they say that, it is because there are more similarities between the continental europeans and the british. The british have a politic totally different, their politic is never totally european, sometimes they are closer to USA. That is why they should leave the european community and why they are seen diffferent.
Guest, tu as mal compris ce que j'ai dit. Je ne veux pas dire que les Français croient que la France et l'Europe sont le même chose car c'est pas vrai du tout. Au lieu, je décris une *sterotype* qui existe des politiciens français : quelquefois lorsqu'ils prétendent à parler de ce qui serait meilleur pour tout le monde en Europe, ils parlent vraiment de ce qui serait meilleur pour la France.
Également, bien que la politique anglaise soit peut-être un peu différente à l'époque actuelle, je doute que les Allemands soient vraiment plus comme les Espagnols que les Britanniques si l'on considère nos vies et nos traditions etc.
Également, bien que la politique anglaise soit peut-être un peu différente à l'époque actuelle, je doute que les Allemands soient vraiment plus comme les Espagnols que les Britanniques si l'on considère nos vies et nos traditions etc.
**Is it even possible to leave the EU at all?**
Tecnically difficult I reckon, maybe a protracted process, but certainly not impossible. Any withdrawl from a European union has no link whatsoever to the British relationship with the USA. We have a common Language with the USA, and similarities in lifestyle, and it's a country which would be the very last we would ever go to war against, but that's about it.
Tecnically difficult I reckon, maybe a protracted process, but certainly not impossible. Any withdrawl from a European union has no link whatsoever to the British relationship with the USA. We have a common Language with the USA, and similarities in lifestyle, and it's a country which would be the very last we would ever go to war against, but that's about it.
Yeah, that would make sense — I think that UKIP and the other people who advocate Britain's withdrawal from the EU tend to underestimate the complications. And even if we did decide to leave the EU (which we won't in the foreseeable future), as you said, it may well take several years, by which time we could easily have a new government and would probably have changed our minds anyway.
And I certainly agree that our membership with the EU is completely independent of our relationships with America and India, amongst other places. This is why I'm often confused by articles written on this subject by Americans — they sometimes seem to suggest that we must leave the EU in order to further a relationship with the US, which I don't understand at all. But then, the views of those Americans who had written such articles often seem to have rather little bearing in reality.
And I certainly agree that our membership with the EU is completely independent of our relationships with America and India, amongst other places. This is why I'm often confused by articles written on this subject by Americans — they sometimes seem to suggest that we must leave the EU in order to further a relationship with the US, which I don't understand at all. But then, the views of those Americans who had written such articles often seem to have rather little bearing in reality.